Pakistan’s Evolving Nuclear Weapons Infrastructure

[Dazzler]

They might have, but the point is that we have some very VERY wrong people managing things of very medicore performance records in critical places just because they are military or ex-military. So the problem of nepotism and corruption isn’t confined to bad governance by political parties but in such cases can lead to serious danger to the country.

True that, nepotism is there for long and so are some average, near incapable people sitting at the helm of affairs in some places.

Thats true. The incompetency of the "high" command in sensitive positions is so astonishing, that apparently guys on twitter freak them out and cause them to take "action". They have absolutely no realization of how the real world works these days. They still think that if you block digital access to the facilities, and move people around in blindfolds, the outside world won't know whats going on. The military still judges itself on 90's standards.

Besides the obvious devastation, I sincerely hope that it never comes to the point that a nuclear war breaks out. We might launch the first few, but I'm afraid thats gonna be all from our side.

Agreed, the psychological impact of the lost decade is still there. it can be seen so evidently. incompetence has become a usual thing unfortunately.

 

[SQ8]

Thats true. The incompetency of the "high" command in sensitive positions is so astonishing, that apparently guys on twitter freak them out and cause them to take "action". They have absolutely no realization of how the real world works these days. They still think that if you block digital access to the facilities, and move people around in blindfolds, the outside world won't know whats going on. The military still judges itself on 90's standards.

Besides the obvious devastation, I sincerely hope that it never comes to the point that a nuclear war breaks out. We might launch the first few, but I'm afraid thats gonna be all from our side.

There is some comfort in that despite this continued “bhalatkaar” of our R&D culture we still make some decent progress in certain areas and that the younger generation (not necessary in their 20-30s but even those in their late 30s to late 40s of military and civilian personnel who are more connected with the outside world see these issues and finally making small but significant changes to this culture.

 

[The Deterrent]

There is some comfort in that despite this continued “bhalatkaar” of our R&D culture we still make some decent progress in certain areas and that the younger generation (not necessary in their 20-30s but even those in their late 30s to late 40s of military and civilian personnel who are more connected with the outside world see these issues and finally making small but significant changes to this culture.

Yeah maybe some minimum reliable progress will always be there to keep India in check, thanks to the few honest, hardworking and intelligent men. I just hope nobody calls our bluff.

 

[SQ8]

Yeah maybe some minimum reliable progress will always be there to keep India in check, thanks to the few honest, hardworking and intelligent men. I just hope nobody calls our bluff.

Right now our bluff is being called on the intelligence and internal security front and we’re just about running around like a cat with socks on its feet.. but that is a different topic.

 

[HRK]

“That not an issue, air force F-16s will go low and bomb those sites.. not a problem”

This is the display of limited scope of their understanding ......

I think there must be some sort of cross functional training system to introduce relevant personals of all three branches understand the difficulties each branch will face in case of war ....

 

[livewire]

Right now our bluff is being called on the intelligence and internal security front and we’re just about running around like a cat with socks on its feet.. but that is a different topic.

Is there a link that topic already? :/

 

[AUz]

These guys should not be there. I had a frank discussion on this with a senior officer on the promotion/selection committee they have(the one with a excel sheet showing greens and reds apparently) who was open on how some of the mediocre or slated for retirement folks are sent off to Fauji Foundation, NDC , Agencies or other places to “live off their retirement”.
Basically, the bad apples are thrown out of the Army into MORE senstive places as management or project heads assuming somehow that for Electronic Support system project should be easy to manage for someone not fit enough to command a brigade!
So what you get is essentially some of these career duds or blockheads at key places either trying to pass the time, engage in some commissions and corruption, or worse actually trying to prove themselves and screwing up critical projects.

Why is that, Oscar? Surely, the generals/high-command realizes the importance of high-tech and industrial supply chain in conducting modern warfare. They realize that as a smaller nation, we need to have the competitive edge in being lead and mean, smarter with our weaponry, much more organized etc etc. Then why generals are okay with sub-par performances and/or placement of subpar managers in NDC, NESCOM, and other sensitive institutions. What gives?

From your posts, it genuinely come across that even I might be more competent, focussed, and have much greater sense of urgency when it comes to improving our defence capabilities, and becoming ready for the future challenges than most of our decision makers and managers in our defense-industry hierarchy.

The highcommand can't be this lazy and incompetent---then why such behavior? Genuinely curious

@The Deterrent

 

[CriticalThought]

Why is that, Oscar? Surely, the generals/high-command realizes the importance of high-tech and industrial supply chain in conducting modern warfare. They realize that as a smaller nation, we need to have the competitive edge in being lead and mean, smarter with our weaponry, much more organized etc etc. Then why generals are okay with sub-par performances and/or placement of subpar managers in NDC, NESCOM, and other sensitive institutions. What gives?

From your posts, it genuinely come across that even I might be more competent, focussed, and have much greater sense of urgency when it comes to improving our defence capabilities, and becoming ready for the future challenges than most of our decision makers and managers in our defense-industry hierarchy.

The highcommand can't be this lazy and incompetent---then why such behavior? Genuinely curious

@The Deterrent

Forget the managers, the workers in institutions like NESCOM represent some of the least innovative, least imaginative left overs from our education system. Sending them to top notch Pakistani universities has mixed results. If the person himself lacks high intellect, getting another degree hardly matters. The real problem from top to bottom is mental subjugation. They are intellectually incapable of confronting a challenging problem they have never solved before, applying analysis and mathematical modeling, and finding a viable solution. This in turn leads to lack of confidence amongst the top leadership, and the vicious cycle continues. The top leadership doesn't assign them any challenging work either. Making them public or privately owned doesn't change anything.

I once had the opportunity to talk with a bright A-Levels students who already had a position in a foreign uni. I tried to sell the prospect of studying at one the topmost universities in all of Pakistan. And he laughed at the prospect. He said what is there to learn? And so, our brightest minds go to foreign nations where they are given so much opportunities they wouldn't think of leaving.

I kid you not. You have no idea what it is like to work in a Western organization that really, really pampers its human capital. The salaries, bonuses, and perks will boggle your mind.

The solution is to grab as much talent as possible after intermediate/A-levels, and provide them the best education possible in Pakistan. NUST, from what i read on the forum, seems to be such a place. I am not sure what the quality of education really is, but it needs to be enhanced and the graduates provided opportunities.

 

[War Thunder]

I heard in 2015 from reliable sources that 175 Indian cities were targetted by Pakistani Nukes. These must be by intermediate and long range ballistic missiles. So the number of nukes must be considerably larger since submarine launched Baburs were not included in the figures.

The real stockpile ofcourse is larger than most people could think.
We are not talking about targeting one city with one warhead but multiple warheads and launching platforms for some of the important cities.
If you add it all up then you are easily looking at atleast 350+ nuke warheads for missiles alone which excludes a decent number of mini warheads for battlefield purposes on NASR and such.

 

[Hellfire]

@Joe Shearer Pretty interesting read.

 

[Joe Shearer]

@Joe Shearer Pretty interesting read.

What? The whole thread? All 82 posts?

<sigh!> And I thought the balmy air of Lucknow would soften you.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@Joe Shearer

Dada,

Welcome back.

Regards

 

[Hellfire]

What? The whole thread? All 82 posts?

<sigh!> And I thought the balmy air of Lucknow would soften you.

I can not comment on anything here.

 

[CriticalThought]

I can not comment on anything here.

As long as your comments befit your stature, you have nothing to fear.

 

[Arsalan]

@Joe Shearer Pretty interesting read.

Boss have you checked the opening post? The thread is based on the "findings" of his excellency raj47!
(should have been deleted in my opinion but it was way before i was a MOD and no point in deleting it after so much time)