Pakistan's Airborne Early Warning and Control Aircrafts

[Scorpiooo]

Wait till the 30th of this month there's something coming.

Other then saabs ?

 

[airomerix]

Agree on all points except the above in red. Please note:

Saab 2000 AEW&C prepares for duty
by David Donald
- July 3, 2008

Coverage has been increased to two 150-degree sectors (from 120-degrees, still with a 1-degree beamwidth), with range out to the horizon (typically 199 to 217 miles).

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2008-07-03/saab-2000-aewc-prepares-duty

There are several factors that go into determining the detection angle. Results are varied according to different target sizes and their radar-absorbent characteristics.

"The system is capable of tracking multiple air and sea target over the horizon and provides above 20km altitude coverage, 360° coverage and has sea surveillance capability."

https://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/saab-2000/

Hence, for various targets, SAAB 2000 is able to detect targets 360 degrees around. While the general definiteion of angular coverage is said to be 120 degrees for all targets.

 

[Blacklight]

There are several factors that go into determining the detection angle. Results are varied according to different target sizes and their radar-absorbent characteristics.

"The system is capable of tracking multiple air and sea target over the horizon and provides above 20km altitude coverage, 360° coverage and has sea surveillance capability."

https://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/saab-2000/

Hence, for various targets, SAAB 2000 is able to detect targets 360 degrees around. While the general definiteion of angular coverage is said to be 120 degrees for all targets.

120 degrees was pre-1995. Lets agree to disagree.

 

[ali_raza]

First lets establish something, Stealth aircraft are not Jinn. They have a radar / IR signature, although one that is minuscule, and normal radars would detect them too late, if at all.

PAF Air Defence Directorate's, recent induction of the Chinese JY-27A is not its first attempt into the realm of stealth a/c tracking. VERA and then VERA NG have been there for a decade plus.

These stealth tracking systems work by being cued by the likes of TPS-77. Data from multiple units is assimilated, in real time, and range, altitude, heading of an a/c is produced. This can further be updated to QRA a/c's via radio or data links.

PAF is one of the few services in the world to posses this capability.

Once a QRA a/c has a stealth a/c in sight, its best bet to engage it, would be an IR based A2A missile. It's another issue, that severe political repercussions would follow.

Note: QRA = Quick Reaction Alert, this is not the terminology PAF uses, but RAF does, and unfortunately for me it is engraved in my head.

i think paf uses CAP

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Serbia shot down a US stealth jet …… which Serbian radar detected it?

 

[The Raven]

I don't find it difficult to believe the PAF detected and tracked an F-22, multiple other countries have been able to achieve that and the tactics against the F-22 are probably widely known by now. What I do find difficult to believe is how the F-22 pilot "got lost" on his way to Afghanistan, given the advanced navigation aids at hand. That would suggest some form of complete technical failure in navigation equipment and communication in the F-22.

Of course, the other most likely explanation was that the F-22 wasn't even in stealth mode, it was probably using a Luneburg lens to generate a specific RCS signal to identify its presence. The USAF don't need an F-22 in VLO mode to bomb the Taliban in Afghanistan, its use there was mostly as a proving ground to hone its deployment and air to ground capabilities.The USAF routinely use Luneburg lenses on F-22s and F-35s when they don't need complete VLO, as well as the Chinese on the J-20.

Luneburg lens RCS enhancer on F-22.

i think paf uses CAP

Yep, QRA (quick reaction alert) is typically used by the RAF, while the PAF uses CAP (combat air patrols).

 

[Blacklight]

Serbia shot down a US stealth jet …… which Serbian radar detected it?

P-18

 

[ali_raza]

P-18

wasn’t it operators personal genius who got that plane down

 

[aziqbal]

Pakistan shares a wide variety of land based terrain with India and lacks the strategic depth. Which means, a side looking Erieye traveling from North to South makes more sense compared to 360 looking ZDK-03 given the technological advantages of the former system. Furthermore, ZDK-03 does its job reasonably well supporting the Naval fleet, Naval air arm, and PAF squadrons in the south. However, any day, if you ask a JF-17 pilot to pick and choose between Erieye and ZDK 03 as their battle manager, Erieye will always come on top.

And they are not fanboys.

can we first go back to my original post #5732 and see what I wrote before this comparison between Erieye and ZDK-03 started ? who compared Erieye to ZDK-03, not me

I clearly mentioned we should go for additional KJ-500 AWACS, then due to the ignorance of subsequent members including some seniors who simply didnt know what KJ-500 was or even heard of the KJ500 AWACS to make it simple for their own understanding they started comparison between Erieye vs ZDK-03 to avoid getting into a panic

so to clear what is the KJ-500 its NOT ZDK-03 its new generation of Chinese AWACSs based on the newer Y-9 platform not the Y-8 category III platform, even the platforms are different now are talking about a completely different AWACS

The KJ-500 is the result of the 38th institute and is a ASEA radar with full true 360 degree coverage, its Chinas first mass produced AWACS and is operational now with the Chinese Air Force and the Navy with probably between 20-30 units operational which is a very high number for AWACS production and production is in full swing right

there are some fair points which should be answered-

yes Erieye is using longitude radar for North South operations as such it could be better suited to geography and terrain of Northern Areas, but also KJ-500 was deployed to Tibet close to Doklam stand off in 2017 which means this AWACS can work in mountainous terrain also, there is satellite images for it

yes also Erieye can do sea surveillance and reconnaissance missions but so KJ-500 since it was also deployed to Fiery Cross Artificial reef in the Spratly islands in South China sea in 2018 there is satellite images for it also

yes Erieye has range but also new variant the KJ-500A has been spotted with IFR probe in 2018 also making it long endurance AWACS, working also with our Midas tankers

and finally with JF17 Block III ASEA and KJ-500 AESA it would be a game in terms of situational awareness both systems would work in synergy, as a matter of fact all F16+Erieye roles would be replaced with JF17 Block III + KJ-500 AWACS

 

[Trailer23]

Why the hell doesn't Leonardo build a bloody AEW&C?

They have the ATR 42/72MP, but that isn't what we're looking for.
https://www.leonardocompany.com/en/air/aircraft/multi-mission-surveillance-aircraft

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Why the hell doesn't Leonardo build a bloody AEW&C?

They have the ATR 42/72MP, but that isn't what we're looking for.
https://www.leonardocompany.com/en/air/aircraft/multi-mission-surveillance-aircraft

They can probably ask their Selex Galileo division to do it, but it's probably an issue of cost and addressable market. Raytheon, IAI and Saab have more or less grabbed 90%+ of the addressable market share, leaving Leonardo with very few potential customers worth anything, if any.

 

[Trailer23]

@Bilal Khan (Quwa)
I think Embraer also has a bit of the market.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

@Bilal Khan (Quwa)
I think Embraer also has a bit of the market.

Embraer uses the Saab Erieye (and in India the DRDO AEW&C).

 

[Path-Finder]

They can probably ask their Selex Galileo division to do it, but it's probably an issue of cost and addressable market. Raytheon, IAI and Saab have more or less grabbed 90%+ of the addressable market share, leaving Leonardo with very few potential customers worth anything, if any.

Can Leonardo/Selex possibly make the antena/radar? Maybe the way india built their netra we can try to build some that way with their input. I am sure there are nations that have a need for airborne surveillance and the established nations are not keen on selling them it!

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Can Leonardo/Selex possibly make the antena/radar? Maybe the way india built their netra we can try to build some that way with their input. I am sure there are nations that have a need for airborne surveillance and the established nations are not keen on selling them it!

Selex/Leonardo can make the radar unit as a standalone product. They know GaN TRMs as well as anyone, so if there is a customer, I'm sure they can develop a solution.