Keysersoze
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Gentlemen can we keep this thread to the topic at hand. If you wish to continue the current discussion please feel free to open a new thread.
Pakistan's Airborne Early Warning and Control Aircrafts
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fatman17
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my apologies - i dont know how we got side-tracked!
Muradk
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fat: you are absolutly right but remember bangladesh doesn't have the problems we have Just look at our surroudings I mean PAkistan except China we need army on all sides and then the war. After 1947. 48, 65, 71 , 99 Army has been fighting so know they are big and powerfull. It is unfortunate of pakistan what happen in 1979 , you remember fatman I told you that I was
Zulfiqur Ali Bhutto's ADC and man I stood with him for 22 hours straight 1 day and night no one was alowed in the room he had his lamp on Gin and tonic, He was thinking of his speech for the UN and after an hour he used to say will this sentence work and I used to say yes Sir, Twice I said yes Sir and he got pissed at
me he said " I want your opnion for yes sir I have a lot of other people so tell me the truth" I was so scard . If Bhutto would have been alive Pakistan would have been Dubai and the center of Asia. And I have no doubt Paksitan under him would have been one of the super-powers. From what I know of him spending 24 hours with him looking at stuff he is doing listening to what he is saying. In my opnion he was a genius , His thinking made the West so scard that they thought it would be better if he is 6 feet under.\sorry getting off topic just to tell you there is nothing so special about the AWACS from sweden , They are very good for shallow places like sea not for other terrain like we have all across NWFP , Kishmir, even some places like Islamabad.
fatman17
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fat: you are absolutly right but remember bangladesh doesn't have the problems we have Just look at our surroudings I mean PAkistan except China we need army on all sides and then the war. After 1947. 48, 65, 71 , 99 Army has been fighting so know they are big and powerfull. It is unfortunate of pakistan what happen in 1979 , you remember fatman I told you that I was
Zulfiqur Ali Bhutto's ADC and man I stood with him for 22 hours straight 1 day and night no one was alowed in the room he had his lamp on Gin and tonic, He was thinking of his speech for the UN and after an hour he used to say will this sentence work and I used to say yes Sir, Twice I said yes Sir and he got pissed at
getting off topic just to tell you there is nothing so special about the AWACS from sweden , They are very good for shallow places like sea not for other terrain like we have all across NWFP , Kishmir, even some places like Islamabad.
Sir,
I totally agree with what u have said above. thanks for taking the time.
Myth_buster_1
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[Johannesburg] - Pakistan has become the fifth country to acquire the software-driven airborne Erieye surveillance system from Saab, the Swedish defence vendor.
This raises hopes at the company that SA may lease three or four of the aircraft for the 2010 Soccer World Cup.
Pakistan took possession of the most recent iteration of the radar plane, the Saab 2000, late last month and will primarily use the aircraft to patrol and monitor its porous, mountainous border with Afghanistan.
“This is a large and strategically important deal for Saab. It is in line with our business strategy within the area of security and surveillance, and it shows Saab's competence in system integration,” says Saab Surveillance Systems MD Karl Lyth.
Erieye was developed as a military system, but is increasingly being used for civil applications such as airspace surveillance, maritime and border surveillance and for countering smuggling.
Brazil seized 84 aircraft used for illegal purposes such as drug running in the first month it operated Erieye and closed 30 illegal airfields.
“Saab 2000 is a much larger platform [than the Saab 340 previously used] with more space and greater capacity,” says Saab Aerotech project manager Joakim Andersson, who was in charge of developing the aircraft.
“It gives the opportunity of carrying more equipment, for example more sensors, electronic intelligence and self-protection,” he adds. “An important strength of Saab 2000 is that it has a very long patrol time; it can remain airborne for more than nine hours without refuelling.“Another important factor is that the platform must meet the demands of take off and landing in high temperatures and high-altitude airfields,” Andersson says.
The intelligence in the surveillance platform is made up of the Erieye mission system, which was developed by Saab Microwave Systems. The system includes a radar, command and control, identification friend or foe, and a ground-based mission training system.
The case for SA
Saab Surveillance Systems director Peter Hultin says the Erieye's software-driven Active Electronically Scanned Array radar gives users the ability to comprehensively and simultaneously survey the air, sea surface and ground environment in a radius of up to 450km around the aircraft to which it is fitted – or about 450 000km2.
By contrast, ground radar can perhaps scan the near-ground environment to a range of about 50km, taking into account the curvature of the earth. Using Doppler radar, Erieye can accurately track hovering helicopters flying nap-of-the-earth or “rubber duck” type boats and jet skis in the surf at extended ranges. This is a valuable feature when employing Erieye in the search-and rescue role or for detecting piracy or illegal fishing activities, says Saab.
Hultin points out that a single aircraft can monitor approximately a quarter of SA's lowest airspace at any given time, versus a 1/200 for ground radar. “Two aircraft, one based in Gauteng and the other in the Cape, can observe almost all of SA in as fast as half an hour: 10 minutes to warn the systems and take off, and 20 to reach orbit,” he adds.
In addition, Erieye can complement or supplement existing ground radar and even replace ground-based air traffic control in case of natural calamity, power outage or terrorist attack.
The platform is also ideal to help impose economic and environmental exclusion zones, around nature and fishery reserves, for example. Similarly, it can assist in enforcing no-fly zones in peacekeeping operations, around VIP meetings such as those of the G8, critical infrastructure such as nuclear plants or major events, typified by the 2010 FIFA Soccer World Cup.
This raises hopes at the company that SA may lease three or four of the aircraft for the 2010 Soccer World Cup.
Pakistan took possession of the most recent iteration of the radar plane, the Saab 2000, late last month and will primarily use the aircraft to patrol and monitor its porous, mountainous border with Afghanistan.
“This is a large and strategically important deal for Saab. It is in line with our business strategy within the area of security and surveillance, and it shows Saab's competence in system integration,” says Saab Surveillance Systems MD Karl Lyth.
Erieye was developed as a military system, but is increasingly being used for civil applications such as airspace surveillance, maritime and border surveillance and for countering smuggling.
Brazil seized 84 aircraft used for illegal purposes such as drug running in the first month it operated Erieye and closed 30 illegal airfields.
“Saab 2000 is a much larger platform [than the Saab 340 previously used] with more space and greater capacity,” says Saab Aerotech project manager Joakim Andersson, who was in charge of developing the aircraft.
“It gives the opportunity of carrying more equipment, for example more sensors, electronic intelligence and self-protection,” he adds. “An important strength of Saab 2000 is that it has a very long patrol time; it can remain airborne for more than nine hours without refuelling.“Another important factor is that the platform must meet the demands of take off and landing in high temperatures and high-altitude airfields,” Andersson says.
The intelligence in the surveillance platform is made up of the Erieye mission system, which was developed by Saab Microwave Systems. The system includes a radar, command and control, identification friend or foe, and a ground-based mission training system.
The case for SA
Saab Surveillance Systems director Peter Hultin says the Erieye's software-driven Active Electronically Scanned Array radar gives users the ability to comprehensively and simultaneously survey the air, sea surface and ground environment in a radius of up to 450km around the aircraft to which it is fitted – or about 450 000km2.
By contrast, ground radar can perhaps scan the near-ground environment to a range of about 50km, taking into account the curvature of the earth. Using Doppler radar, Erieye can accurately track hovering helicopters flying nap-of-the-earth or “rubber duck” type boats and jet skis in the surf at extended ranges. This is a valuable feature when employing Erieye in the search-and rescue role or for detecting piracy or illegal fishing activities, says Saab.
Hultin points out that a single aircraft can monitor approximately a quarter of SA's lowest airspace at any given time, versus a 1/200 for ground radar. “Two aircraft, one based in Gauteng and the other in the Cape, can observe almost all of SA in as fast as half an hour: 10 minutes to warn the systems and take off, and 20 to reach orbit,” he adds.
In addition, Erieye can complement or supplement existing ground radar and even replace ground-based air traffic control in case of natural calamity, power outage or terrorist attack.
The platform is also ideal to help impose economic and environmental exclusion zones, around nature and fishery reserves, for example. Similarly, it can assist in enforcing no-fly zones in peacekeeping operations, around VIP meetings such as those of the G8, critical infrastructure such as nuclear plants or major events, typified by the 2010 FIFA Soccer World Cup.
araz
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fat: you are absolutly right but remember bangladesh doesn't have the problems we have Just look at our surroudings I mean PAkistan except China we need army on all sides and then the war. After 1947. 48, 65, 71 , 99 Army has been fighting so know they are big and powerfull. It is unfortunate of pakistan what happen in 1979 , you remember fatman I told you that I was
Zulfiqur Ali Bhutto's ADC and man I stood with him for 22 hours straight 1 day and night no one was alowed in the room he had his lamp on Gin and tonic, He was thinking of his speech for the UN and after an hour he used to say will this sentence work and I used to say yes Sir, Twice I said yes Sir and he got pissed at
getting off topic just to tell you there is nothing so special about the AWACS from sweden , They are very good for shallow places like sea not for other terrain like we have all across NWFP , Kishmir, even some places like Islamabad.
Murad Sahib.
AOA
Idont understand your comment about Saab being good for shallow places but not for other terrain.As I understood PAF evaluated the plane and rejected the American one because of precisely this point . Could you please elaborate further.
WaSalam
Araz
Myth_buster_1
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sorry to say sir but i have failed to understand how did Bhutto family would have changed pakistan into dubia? Zulfiqur Ali Bhutto and her daughter both failed to bring something positive to this country.Take PAF lost decade of 90s as an example, paf was sanctioned to the extent where it could only operate one F-16 squadron at a time? PAF had a demand of Mirage-2000 and MR10% with his wife blew the done deal away.
Even dictators have done something good for this country. Islamabad is a dictator built city with rapid development under way.
If no jew plan of 9/11 have had happened, Mush would have changed this country into mini Turkey!
Keysersoze
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sorry to say sir but i have failed to understand how did Bhutto family would have changed pakistan into dubia? Zulfiqur Ali Bhutto and her daughter both failed to bring something positive to this country.Take PAF lost decade of 90s as an example, paf was sanctioned to the extent where it could only operate one F-16 squadron at a time? PAF had a demand of Mirage-2000 and MR10% with his wife blew the done deal away.
Even dictators have done something good for this country. Islamabad is a dictator built city with rapid development under way.
If no jew plan of 9/11 have had happened, Mush would have changed this country into mini Turkey!
Dude this is a AWACS thread....please post in a relevant section. Also conspiracy theories go in the relevant section as well please. All replies to this will be deleted. AWACS AND RELATED SUBJECTS ONLY PLEASE!
Muradk
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US would have never given us the AWACS it was all talk. plus why buy a equipment which is in use since 1970. why not buy the latest but not everything is perfect. The radar signals work in harmony in a shallow enviroment like a desert or sea. Its a good thing we are not worried that china will attack us mountains do create problems , That is why we have radars on the high mountains like kala bagh AFB , Muree Cliffdon, and so on. I an not saying that we waisted money I was just telling a few bad things about AWACs.
Keysersoze
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I believe the Hawkeye 2000 platform (on the P-3) was a newer design (than the older carrier based hawkeyes. Plus the radar was a a newer upgraded version which is still currently in use on board U.S. hawkeyes (at least until the E2-D comes out)
Quwa
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Even if PN doesn't get the Hawkeye-2000, it wouldn't matter for very long anyways as we have two very good alternatives.
For one is the AWACS Pakistan is developing with Chinese assistance; it will probably utilize phased-array technology in AESA form, interoperability with all assets, etc.
The other option is another set of Erieye; I think Saab will continue to develop the system and solve particular short-comings. Either way the new systems will be in the Wedgetail & Phalcon league...and will draw interest from Pakistan.
Honestly I'm not worried about the systems as much as their potential platforms.
For one is the AWACS Pakistan is developing with Chinese assistance; it will probably utilize phased-array technology in AESA form, interoperability with all assets, etc.
The other option is another set of Erieye; I think Saab will continue to develop the system and solve particular short-comings. Either way the new systems will be in the Wedgetail & Phalcon league...and will draw interest from Pakistan.
Honestly I'm not worried about the systems as much as their potential platforms.
IceCold
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Kool!Nice pics. I assume that these birds would ever be made available to pakistan not until a more modern version of it is created and the old ones are to be phased out.
On the side note has US offered these to India? Indian navy was offered something, i am a bit confused to what it actual was?
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