Pakistani ICBM

[Cookie Monster]

Let's say you kick the can further down the road. Once the economy stabilizes, what next? How will you test ICBMs and SLBMs under the same threat of sanctions? If you test right now, you may suffer economic consequences. If you test later, you may suffer economic consequences? Either way, you are blocked. If economy stabilizes and five years, you decide you want ICBM/SLBM, are you going to not test and discard potential to become full fledged nuclear power because it may ruin your economy?

U really want sanctions and to risk economy falling apart right now when Pak was having debt repayment crisis? Or would u take that risk when Pak has a thriving economy like South Korea? It's a no brainer...a diverse and powerful thriving economy can take more blows and prove resilient.

This is the same mistake Pakistan made in stopping nuclear weapons testing after 1998. It should have kept testing and improving its weapons yield and designs, instead of just matching India.

What? U want Pak to test actual nuclear weapons? Why? Did u not know that countries around the world(nuclear powers) have stopped exploding nukes on earth for testing purposes? Tests to improve things like yield and other such things are done theoretically by making models and simulating it in supercomputers.

Either way, it was sanctioned. Either way, it got relief from those sanctions in the near future.

It's bcuz Pak was needed again for WoT(2001 and after)...there's literally nothing stopping the US/West to keep up sanctions against Pak.

Better to test and gain the ability now, than worry about it later. Economic growth will come regardless. Pakistan tested Shaheen III and Ababeel. We did not see any sanctions in response to that. My point is if you want to be become a full-fledged nuclear power, go all the way, don't just stop half-way through.

Shaheen III and Ababeel are India specific. They don't have the kind of range that other countries can feel threatened by...so it draws less attention of the world towards Pak. ICBMs are a whole new ball game...they can potentially put any spot on the globe within striking range.

 

[guest9999]

U really want sanctions and to risk economy falling apart right now when Pak was having debt repayment crisis? Or would u take that risk when Pak has a thriving economy like South Korea? It's a no brainer...a diverse and powerful thriving economy can take more blows and prove resilient.

Let's put it this way, the more exports you have, the more weaker you are to sanctions. Just take a look at what is happening with China and tariffs placed on their exports. Their economy is collapsing. China is an export-based economy, the same model PTI is aiming to follow.

Economic growth comes and goes. Nuclear weapons do not, they are there to stay.

What? U want Pak to test actual nuclear weapons? Why? Did u not know that countries around the world(nuclear powers) have stopped exploding nukes on earth for testing purposes? Tests to improve things like yield and other such things are done theoretically by making models and simulating it in supercomputers.

I'm talking about testing in 1998, not now. Besides, supercomputer simulations are good at modeling yields for designs. But they will never be the real deal, you need hot tests to properly validate the yield. Also, please feel free to read up on the yields Pakistan's tests generated in 1998, they aren't something to be amazed at.

It's bcuz Pak was needed again for WoT(2001 and after)...there's literally nothing stopping the US/West to keep up sanctions against Pak.

Yup, US already has a noose around Pakistan, although it hasn't even tested an ICBM yet. Like I said, either way you are being constricted economically. Either way, economic growth will come sooner or later.

Shaheen III and Ababeel are India specific. They don't have the kind of range that other countries can feel threatened by...so it draws less attention of the world towards Pak. ICBMs are a whole new ball game...they can potentially put any spot on the globe within striking range.

You do realize that Pakistan is lying about the range of Shaheen III, right? Do you think Ababeel is much less in range? Shaheen III puts Israel at risk. As a matter of fact, it caught eyes in the media when it was tested, and generated concern. You know what happened next? NOTHING. The world forgot and moved on.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Let's put it this way, the more exports you have, the more weaker you are to sanctions. Just take a look at what is happening with China and tariffs placed on their exports. Their economy is collapsing. China is an export-based economy, the same model PTI is aiming to follow.

Chinese economy is collapsing? Where do u get ur news? Look it up it's still growing at above 5% despite the fact that it was supposed to slow down(regardless of trade wars and tariffs)...it's something known as the "middle income trap". Once the low hanging fruit of urbanization and industrialization have been plucked, countries tend to get stuck in second gear...only a few countries have managed to get past that. Besides no economy can keep posting amazing growth especially when it becomes a behemoth like China...an economy of a 1 billion dollars can easily post a growth of 5% just by having a growth of an additional 50 million or so. In comparison an economy of a trillion dollars will have to grow by a huge amount(5% of a trillion) in order to have 5% growth. Just look at US...the number one economy...it only grew by like 2% or so in 2018. So even in absence of trade wars Chinese economic slow down was projected. The fact that they are still growing by above 5% taking into account the above factors and the additional onslaught of trade wars(by China's biggest trade partner no less)...it's amazing to say the least. The reason China is still managing such growth is precisely bcuz Chinese economy is so diverse. If they were like a middle eastern country highly reliant on the export of oil...they would be screwed. A resilient economy is a diverse one...so if PTI wants to emulate China's economic model...I welcome it.

Economic growth comes and goes. Nuclear weapons do not, they are there to stay.

That doesn't mean u have to be dumb and not take into account the geopolitical calculus.

I'm talking about testing in 1998, not now. Besides, supercomputer simulations are good at modeling yields for designs. But they will never be the real deal, you need hot tests to properly validate the yield.

Are u an expert in nuclear Physics? Or were u involved in modeling theoretical yields of Pak's current nuclear weapons to know that such methods of supercomputer simulations aren't working well?

Also, please feel free to read up on the yields Pakistan's tests generated in 1998, they aren't something to be amazed at.

I am aware...why is this an argument? Did I say those yields were amazing? That's when Pakistan was still young in developing nuclear weapons. Pakistan has come far since then. Being able to miniaturize nuclear warheads to put them on the likes of Babur/Raad/Nasr shows that continuous progress is being made.

Yup, US already has a noose around Pakistan, although it hasn't even tested an ICBM yet. Like I said, either way you are being constricted economically. Either way, economic growth will come sooner or later.

Any sane person would rather choose to have economic growth NOW. Go read up on how precarious Pak's economic situation really was. Pak was literally supported by Arab and Chinese money.

You do realize that Pakistan is lying about the range of Shaheen III, right?

Give me proof or else it's just a fanboyish speculation. I don't do fanboy speculations...I would rather stick to cold hard facts.

Do you think Ababeel is much less in range? Shaheen III puts Israel at risk. As a matter of fact, it caught eyes in the media when it was tested, and generated concern. You know what happened next? NOTHING. The world forgot and moved on.

Israel is incapable of sanctioning Pakistan...as simple as that. Additionally the range of Shaheen III also conincided with the narrative that it's range puts targets within India as far as Nicobar and Andaman Islands(Indian Naval bases) within range of Pak's missiles. With ICBMs...how would Pak justify that it's for India?

 

[ps3linux]

Pakistan’s defense narrative has always been of defensive-offense capability and or India centric to be specific. Most of the capability/range nuclear, conventional and missile technology fall within the same narrative and range. Our demonstrated/declared missile range cover India effectively. The crux is “India specific capability”.

Once we start declaring/demonstrating capability beyond Indian coverage range, it will become “ambition”, our whole narrative will become null and void and when it comes to ambition somehow the other “Israel” automatically comes to mind.

Knowing few things (not made public) we definitely have the capability to develop ICBM, but to perfect that capability we will have to do field testing which is demonstrating ambitions beyond requirement. Declaration comes later.

The bitter reality is that due to many factors (internal and external) we have always been treated as a special case by international community (I still do remember cartoons of nuclear bomb with Pakistani flag – captioned as Islamic bomb) appearing in international media. Now coupled without dilapidated economic condition we as a nation should curb our enthusiasm in that direction else we are inviting trouble which could be worse than 1998, 9/11 came as a blessing in disguise for us that time not this time.

 

[Cool_Soldier]

I suppose, Israel's involvement was like Monkey between two cats.
It was just provoking India to go ahead.
Intelligence support and nefarious plan support was with India but no physical involvement of Jet and Personnel in operation.

we need to revive policy for those WHO HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH US BUT TRY TO DO SOMETHING SCRETELY.

 

[Umar Nazir]

How many Shaheen 2 and 3 missile Pakistan have ???? Can any body guess with logic????

 

[Safriz]

How many Shaheen 2 and 3 missile Pakistan have ???? Can any body guess with logic????

25 Shaheen-2 launchers were Photographed by US satellites back in 2008

 

[Umar Nazir]

25 Shaheen-2 launchers were Photographed by US satellites back in 2008

hmmm 11 years ago. its mean in 2019 we should have more than 100

 

[Usamafarooqi99]

Pakistani ICBM

Pakistani scientists and engineers have achieved the ability to build and test an Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM).

Capability was achieved, but the powers that be, have decided that for the time being that potential will remain just potential.

Full spectrum deterrence has been achieved against the neighbour to the east, and having a ICBM would invite a unnecessary spotlight on the homeland.

The only way I see that decision being changed is, well let's just leave it at that.

Pakistan already have acheived modern technology but theres better to develop and be quiet otherwise sanctioned will be faced. US wont allow any country with nukes to develop such tech who reaches US easily

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

hmmm 11 years ago. its mean in 2019 we should have more than 100

Hence, 3X retaliation if India launches hers.....

How many Shaheen 2 and 3 missile Pakistan have ???? Can any body guess with logic????

Enough for Modi/RSS/Hindutva/Marwari/Parsi/Jain etc. to withstand Israili pressure and back off.....

 

[Umar Nazir]

Hence, 3X retaliation if India launches hers.....


Enough for Modi/RSS/Hindutva/Marwari/Parsi/Jain etc. to withstand Israili pressure and back off.....

yes we should have enough, dont want even a inch in india remain safe from destruction in case of Nuclear war with india

 

[Haroon Baloch]

I heard that the Shaheen III is actually an ICBM but their range has been lowered on paper to avoid any unwarranted attention.

 

[LeGenD]

I heard that the Shaheen III is actually an ICBM but their range has been lowered on paper to avoid any unwarranted attention.

Shaheen III is two-stage solid-fueled MRBM.

 

[Safriz]

Shaheen III is two-stage solid-fueled MRBM.

Three stages. The third stage is tucked away in the top red triangle

 

[LeGenD]

Three stages. The third stage is tucked away in the top red triangle

Third stage of Shaheen III is its RV which is not what I am alluding to.

This video:

- shows a Minuteman III ICBM.

I am sure that a large number of commentators below had no idea.