Pakistan to soon start producing commercial aircraft

[jamal18]

Can't think of many 30 passenger planes besides the DO328J, but at the ~10 range there's the Grand Caravan EX. It seems PAC is aiming for something like that or in the N219 size range. They should examine the idea of reviving the Saab 2000.

Amazing, I have been thinking of this for ages. It was a project that was retired prematurely. We can buy the technology for pennies as they are no longer being produced. Why re-invent the wheel?
Saab and PAC can work together to upgrade it.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

while the goal is respective; they need to create a seperate division for civilian aircraft - new resources etc. otherwise scope is too vast.

It wouldn't surprise me if the long-term vision is to have PAC focus on design, development and testing, while having production and maintenance work deferred to the local private sector. This commercial aircraft program could be the first step, basically have PAC come up with the design (probably in partnership with another such as PTDI or Denel), and then contract out the production work to various companies in Pakistan. Those don't exist, but this program and others might give incentive to local investors to make it happen.

 

[El Sidd]

I propose an alliance with bombardier.

 

[ziaulislam]

It wouldn't surprise me if the long-term vision is to have PAC focus on design, development and testing, while having production and maintenance work deferred to the local private sector. This commercial aircraft program could be the first step, basically have PAC come up with the design (probably in partnership with another such as PTDI or Denel), and then contract out the production work to various companies in Pakistan. Those don't exist, but this program and others might give incentive to local investors to make it happen.

i am surprised they are going for something with no grantee delivery/orders
a more viable option would have been a JV in medium/light weight helios with grantee order of~100 from PA, PN and PAF

never the less a good step, but i would recommend baby steps first , may be JV, dont built too many subsystems, rely on a proven engine

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

i am surprised they are going for something with no grantee delivery/orders
a more viable option would have been a JV in medium/light weight helios with grantee order of~100 from PA, PN and PAF

never the less a good step, but i would recommend baby steps first , may be JV, dont built too many subsystems, rely on a proven engine

I honestly think the aim is to get the private sector involved. Yes, utility helicopters would have guaranteed orders from the armed forces and that should certainly be the plan. However, the private sector market for a commercial aircraft is bigger than those of helicopters, even within Pakistan.

A low-cost 30-passenger plane should see adoption in the Ministry of Interior, armed forces (e.g. taking on roles similar to Grand Caravan EX and King Air 350ER ISR), PIA and private sector airlines. In fact, it might even result in new commuter airlines to connect remote areas. Similar commuter requirements exist in Central Asia.

PAC must have guaranteed orders in place for this too, but I think the wider market will be able to sustain the production and maintenance industry for these aircraft in Pakistan. The good approach would be to split the development overhead by partnering, either with Indonesia on the N219 (nearing availability) or with South Africa on the SARA (conceptual stages, but might give Pakistan more leverage for ToT etc).

All that said, should slot in helicopters too. IMO a good approach would be to join with Turkey on the T625, ATAK-2 and 10-ton helicopter. Each of these is being developed with common components and subsystems for reducing the cost of logistics and maintenance. Partnering reduces the R&D load on each side and allows us to pool markets for scale.

 

[BHarwana]

It wouldn't surprise me if the long-term vision is to have PAC focus on design, development and testing, while having production and maintenance work deferred to the local private sector. This commercial aircraft program could be the first step, basically have PAC come up with the design (probably in partnership with another such as PTDI or Denel), and then contract out the production work to various companies in Pakistan. Those don't exist, but this program and others might give incentive to local investors to make it happen.

There are many companies in Pakistan that can do the job of producing specific parts as they have been doing for Honda Suzuki and Toyota. There are many companies with advance machines which work for milat Tractors and so on if the contracts are given to these companies they can manufacture parts but this has to be cost effective process for those companies to jump in. Making a technology demonstration is one thing but line production need to place cost in play

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

I propose an alliance with bombardier.

Too late, they're going to be rolling in money with Airbus.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Too late, they're going to be rolling in money with Airbus.

Airbus' investment has to pay dividends though.

The Bombardier C-Series is beginning to gain sales, but it doesn't seem PIA or the private sector airlines (e.g. Air Sial, Air Serene, Airblue, etc) are interested in narrow-body jets outside of the Boeing 737NG and A320neo. There would have a lot of orders between these airlines to feasibly undertake local production of any kind.

 

[Blue Marlin]

i think pakistan will develop aircraft like the :

ebm-120:

Dornier 328:

BA Jetstream 41

saab 340

which can then be grown to

and then to stuff like this

If u can dish a million or two dollars.

they wpnt be that expensive heck a cessna 172 sells for ~$280k id expect this to be around ~$180-240

on a side note the saab 340 and the 2000 would be perfect as pakistan operates the 2000 variant and can be expanded for other roles. looking at the specs you can see it's very powerful in respect to the engines especially when it's compared to the ll-114. and also other parameters, range service ceiling

if pakistan can bag production of the 340 and the 2000 then consider the future for Pakistan aviation industry very bright.










(damn i'd make a good Saab sales man)

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

i think pakistan will develop aircraft like the :

ebm-120:

Dornier 328:

BA Jetstream 41

saab 340

which can then be grown to

and then to stuff like this

they wpnt be that expensive heck a cessna 172 sells for ~$280k id expect this to be around ~$180-240

on a side note the saab 340 and the 2000 would be perfect as pakistan operates the 2000 variant and can be expanded for other roles. looking at the specs you can see it's very powerful in respect to the engines especially when it's compared to the ll-114. and also other parameters, range service ceiling

if pakistan can bag production of the 340 and the 2000 then consider the future for Pakistan aviation industry very bright.










(damn i'd make a good Saab sales man)

I'd love it if they can revive the Saab 340 and Saab 2000.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Evektor EV-55 | Czech Republic | 9-14 passengers

https://www.evektor.cz/en/ev-55-outback

9-

 

[FunkyGen]

i think pakistan will develop aircraft like the

i think pakistan will licence produce* aircraft like the

It's a billion years to early for us to be developing anything. I might have to take antidepressants before i start rambling on how pathetic the government structure here is... and BTW the billion years are for the private sector to catch up... that's a fish that's barely breathing.

Like come on guys a few assembled Jfs and those antique propeller grannies and we're acting like we are the next air power. Don't take it the wrong way though we've done a tremendous job, however, the next steps should be along the line of producing specialized electronics and weapons instead of becoming the glorified body makers. Something along the lines of those pods that we purchased from Turkey. That will fetch us some good money. This project is speaking corruption from the get-go. Like what business has PAC assembling propeller junk...

 

[Blue Marlin]

I'd love it if they can revive the Saab 340 and Saab 2000.

well i may have set the bar a bit too high there, but they did say 30 seaters right ?

 

[Ultimate Weapon]

Saab 2000 would be a logical choice. Whats its seating capacity?

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

i think pakistan will licence produce* aircraft like the

It's a billion years to early for us to be developing anything. I might have to take antidepressants before i start rambling on how pathetic the government structure here is... and BTW the billion years are for the private sector to catch up... that's a fish that's barely breathing.

Like come on guys a few assembled Jfs and those antique propeller grannies and we're acting like we are the next air power. Don't take it the wrong way though we've done a tremendous job, however, the next steps should be along the line of producing specialized electronics and weapons instead of becoming the glorified body makers. Something along the lines of those pods that we purchased from Turkey. That will fetch us some good money. This project is speaking corruption from the get-go. Like what business has PAC assembling propeller junk...

I wouldn't undersell it as "few assembled Jfs..." It's a proper joint-production effort in that 58% of the sub-assemblies are actually manufactured in Pakistan, with final assembly (with 42% imports) of course.

Truly, less than a handful of countries can claim to manufacture everything from end-to-end (e.g. U.S., France, Russia and China, with the U.K, Germany, Japan, South Korea, Italy, etc moving to partnerships and consortiums). In all likelihood, PAC will approach the 10-30 commercial plane in much the same way, i.e. partner up with someone already engaged in the effort (e.g. Indonesia, Czech Republic or South Africa) and co-produce.

As for 'why' ... Pakistan has a commuter aircraft market, especially in the Northern Areas which basically require twin engine turboprop planes to operate in semi-prepared runways and hot-and-high conditions. These aircraft will expand the connectivity within the Northern Areas et. al as well as between it and the rest of the country (and to an extent other countries, esp. in Central Asia). Similar efforts are underway in Central Asia and Sub-Saharan Africa, so the market has potential. The key is to guarantee strong adoption earlier on and to give enough incentive to the private sector to manage most, if not all, of the production and maintenance/support work.