Pakistan to purchase latest fighter planes, submarines: Tanveer

[he-man]

After the OBL episode Pakistan went to China where J-11's were offered but there were refused by PAF as they wanted to get the latest version J -16. At that time these were not available because of engines and copy right issues hence China offered the J-10's. Pakistan wanted at that time a multi role aircraft hence they wanted an upgraded version J-10B.

USA started to negotiate on providing more F-16's. At present according to @Oscar "F-16's that are going to be available are with GE engines unfortunately PAF does not have the support for such aircraft."

Now the inducting these F-16's would cost almost the same as any other new aircraft.

Pakistan is exercising the options of additional F-16 Blk 52 which were reduced due to financial constraints.

Currently PAF is required to ground all Mirage iii/v's due to safety issues but they are unable to induct aircraft of such short notice both locally (JF-17) and from US(F-16). Pakistan Navy initiated a inquiry if they can be provided Aircraft for air support. JF-17 were in consideration but due to requirements of the navy they have to consider an other platform. GOP is aware that USA would not be able to provide F-15's or F-18's as they would require approvals.

Now what are the possible alternates that can be procured:
1) Eurofighter...May be but with restrictions.
2) Rafale... NO due to India in advance stage of negotiations.
3) Su-35... Available as India has rejected it for SU-30MKI.
4) MIG-35... Available as India has rejected it in favour of Rafale.

Considerations: SU-35 MIG-35
1) Advance then SU-30 MKI Available on JV
2) Possible upgrades form China Later development into Naval Carrier version
3) Possibility of J15/16 joining along. Same engines as of JF-17
4) Joint Production with Egypt.
5) Other GCC states interested.

All the data has been compiled form various PDF Threads.

Post full of delusions.Nothing is on offer apart from chinese fighters.

 

[Slow motion]

when , Will we ever be self sufficient, our threat is more from our inner corrupt elements then external hostile , We have full capability of eliminating external threat at any given time and we have demonstrated that pretty well ,

 

[he-man]

when , Will we ever be self sufficient, our threat is more from our inner corrupt elements then external hostile , We have full capability of eliminating external threat at any given time and we have demonstrated that pretty well ,

And how is that?

 

[SQ8]

Post full of delusions.Nothing is on offer that is affordable apart from chinese fighters.

Amended for factual correction

 

[he-man]

Amended for factual correction

Yes that would hold true for eurofighter,rafale and gripen.

Not for su-35 and mig-35

 

[SQ8]

Yes that would hold true for eurofighter,rafale and gripen.

Not for su-35 and mig-35

That depends as well. Again, put some $15 billion in Pakistani coffers and see how the Russians move from B to A.

 

[he-man]

That depends as well. Again, put some $15 billion in Pakistani coffers and see how the Russians move from B to A.

Nope,,still they won't.
They cannot loose contracts worth 50 billion for 15.............simple management.

And btw 15 billion from where

 

[mehboobkz]

Nope,,still they won't.
They cannot loose contracts worth 50 billion for 15.............simple management.

And btw 15 billion from where

Have not you seen the show where they pull the rabbit out of empty black hat?
Seems like that.

 

[kaku1]

Yaar All in all Oranzaib bhai what can i read from yr post is that u are writing all this as an american and naturally favoring 'its line of sight' (im actually a PhD student from National Defence University in International Relations, so i know a few this and can analyze myself a few things since im not an ordinary indian or pakistani in the forum). But im a pakistani and pak's long term interests matter to me only. Because we lost just too much from this WOT. For all this u stated to actually happen and keep on happening even after 3 decades Pakistan's relations with its neighbors are above all including with India and entertaining their sensitivities are a must to ensure that not just pak individually but this region as a whole has to grow so that our economic pursuit must remain stable. We are looking to right now just maintain 4% growth rate. We dont claim much here since no matter slow but gradual rate of growth can ensure our better survival in the future for our children and their children. Atleast thats what we have learnt from our experience since 60s, 80s and 2000s economic boom.

So i woud say lets not count on the chickens before they are hatched and lets not jump too much abt ''what will happen or not'' because the threat from the indian radicals is real and now their more then ever influence on the indian bureaucracy is REAL so dont take these words for granted.

So in International Relations view our relations with Iran specially if we are not entertaining the indians are very very i mean really very important since that threat is real and iran is not pak who can be contained for just a shush or shut up call for long term. What u are saying is a very temporary solution ie will last for just the analysis for 3 decades. What im saying as a pakistani and as a IR student is the long term regional stability which will in future directly influence our economic boom. So relations with iran are very very important (i repeat), dont take it wrong or personal but i as a pakistani and u as an american have difference in the sense we see the future of this region and specially our pakistan here. I agree with rest in yr reply and wholeheartedly agree but in order to ensure that in the long term our relations right now will effect our future economic stability either it remain in just 4% or may go more. Look i dont in any sense saying we should buy iran's gas or give it leverages in order to dictate its terms on us in future but just saying they must not be cornered. Since our relations with iran are historic and will be always important as the indian threat is still real no matter we take it out of picture or not to settle disputes as of now but if we ignore it completely in future it might come back to haunt us. Pak ignoring Iran completely will be seen in iran as pak's loyalty with western interests which is primarily to isolate iran economically to save israeli and american interests in west bank and greater middle east. So atleast a SAARC entry for iran in the next meeting in islamabad is feasible as of now or any other deal with them which satisfies them as of now and in future more and more trade deals depending upon the Global atmosphere can be done to make sure iran dont get involved under indian influence that it signs the defence deal. Since Pak is capable to tackle them or not is not the question but the long term regional stability is the question @haman10 @nair

We saw why india has still not signed the Rafael deal and the clue of what im saying can be found there. Like i said before International relations are sometimes like having more then one wife. Both need to engaged and must to kept happy for yr own good. Or like a moderator in PDF.
But We (as a whole) aint stupid like indians if u know what i mean! @Irfan Baloch

Rafale is a tricky issues, it is just not about buying that aircraft. There are issues of liabilities, there are issues of M88 ToT, India is actually not interested in the M88 engine as whole, but the engine's core tech., and mainly did France provide the metallurgy of SCB in which India failed tremendously.

The main purpose is not just built the Rafale in India like JF-17. But also bring the necessary tech, in which DRDO failed to develop in LCA and Kaveri program.

And one more thing, Kaveri was also tested with M88 core, and it worked perfectly. But again that not indigenous at all.

 

[he-man]

Rafale is a tricky issues, it is just not about buying that aircraft. There are issues of liabilities, there are issues of M88 ToT, India is actually not interested in the M88 engine as whole, but the engine's core tech., and mainly did France provide the metallurgy of SCB in which India failed tremendously.

The main purpose is not just built the Rafale in India like JF-17. But also bring the necessary tech, in which DRDO failed to develop in LCA and Kaveri program.

And one more thing, Kaveri was also tested with M88 core, and it worked perfectly. But again that not indigenous at all.

No critical tech will be provided by french...........sorry.

 

[kaku1]

No critical tech will be provided by french...........sorry.

I have to say then, if M88 put out of ToT, then Rafale will hang forever, The jet engine is more important for India, even more than AESA development.

And even there is no requirement then, to assemble these aircraft in HAL facility.

 

[he-man]

I have to say then, if M88 put out of ToT, then Rafale will hang forever, The jet engine is more important for India, even more than AESA development.

Neither are we getting m88 core or aesa tech.
U are misinformed.

 

[kaku1]

Neither are we getting m88 core or aesa tech.
U are misinformed.

Then why the France talking about liabilities, if it just going to assemble in HAL facility. All the product will be manufactured by Dassault.

And one thing, I said it will hang forever, if that not possible, may be IAF wait till 2017, if the FGFA failed, then it goes to Rafale, We already learn the lesson of manufacturing airframe from SUs, there is nothing we going to get from Rafake.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

@orangzaib @Umair Nawaz @Sulman Badshah
thanks for your posts but we have gone way past the scope of the thread (its not our sacred constitution though so its fine just saying)

I just expressed my doubts over too good to be true news first our journalists lack technical know how and the authentication of such claims, secondly something so significant would have more meat to the bone.

Iran tilting to India at the expense of Pakistan is too far fetched, granted we have differences and issues with Iran due to activities of USA/ KSA against it through our land but Iran & Pakistan also suffer the insurgency of the Baloch nationalists & sectarian terrorists and it will suffer same fate. I cant , also speak for India on how America will see India cozying up with Ayatullahs either. if Su 3x family was on cards then Pakistan would have gone for Chinese J-11 but it didnt so I dont know

 

[kaku1]

@orangzaib @Umair Nawaz @Sulman Badshah
thanks for your posts but we have gone way past the scope of the thread (its not our sacred constitution though so its fine just saying)

I just expressed my doubts over too good to be true news first our journalists lack technical know how and the authentication of such claims, secondly something so significant would have more meat to the bone.

Iran tilting to India at the expense of Pakistan is too far fetched, granted we have differences and issues with Iran due to activities of USA/ KSA against it through our land but Iran & Pakistan also suffer the insurgency of the Baloch nationalists & sectarian terrorists and it will suffer same fate. I cant , also speak for India on how America will see India cozying up with Ayatullahs either. if Su 3x family was on cards then Pakistan would have gone for Chinese J-11 but it didnt so I dont know

Please can you explain your point clearly. What is the relation between SUs and Iran?