‘Pakistan pays only 1 or 2 pc interest on Chinese loans’

[BHarwana]

You are right.

In fact the Express Tribune is a subsidiary of the New York Times.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Express_Tribune

They were thinking Pakistan is their play ground. Media terrorism and corruption, they launched a sudden attack but got countered in just 3 days lol. just try to read news before 5 th dec and after 17 dec. it is like 2 different worlds.

i think laptops is bull shit, i can say that because i got one and i didn't needed it

1.we need to first get 100% kid enrollement, problem is funds and lack of schools(which makes me crazy why give 1000s of laptops and spend 30 billion rupees if you have no schools)
2. than get technical education and in IT sector
3. engnr universities world class not bookish ones we have in field that matter and have industrial demand

getting no.2 and no.3 require a market oriented approach not a blind approach, they can talk to chinese for technical
assistance

I don't have any data on other provinces but in punjab Technical education colleges have been opened in every tahsil and each college was opened.

 

[Sully3]

@Ajaxpaul good for pakistan..

 

[Ajaxpaul]

@Ajaxpaul good for pakistan..

Of course why not

 

[SunilM]

Ok. The early harvest projects i.e the Power Plants are Chinese investment. Chinese companies have setup the plants and no loans are not involved here i.e Pakistani Govt is not reapying loans here. What this article tells us is that the Chinese companies got a loan at 5%. Now what is important here is the Return on Investment promised by Pakistan on these projects, which is around 30%. So the Chinese have got some very nice deals here.

Infact, the Chinese have realized the issue of non payment to IPPs and have asked the Govt to set up a revolving fund for the Chinese Power projects so that timely payment is made to them.

 

[Awan68]

You are right.

In fact the Express Tribune is a subsidiary of the New York Times.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Express_Tribune

Lol, i didnt knw that, no wonder they come up with such bullshit.

 

[ziaulislam]

They were thinking Pakistan is their play ground. Media terrorism and corruption, they launched a sudden attack but got countered in just 3 days lol. just try to read news before 5 th dec and after 17 dec. it is like 2 different worlds.



I don't have any data on other provinces but in punjab Technical education colleges have been opened in every tahsil and each college was opened.

i have seen them as my uncle leads one, that is not the definition of any modern technical education, teaching how to basic wiring and basic machine operating is not market oriented education that we need

this is where china can help

Ok. The early harvest projects i.e the Power Plants are Chinese investment. Chinese companies have setup the plants and no loans are not involved here i.e Pakistani Govt is not reapying loans here. What this article tells us is that the Chinese companies got a loan at 5%. Now what is important here is the Return on Investment promised by Pakistan on these projects, which is around 30%. So the Chinese have got some very nice deals here.

Infact, the Chinese have realized the issue of non payment to IPPs and have asked the Govt to set up a revolving fund for the Chinese Power projects so that timely payment is made to them.

wrong return is 17% not 30%
second it is not china exclusive, its for everyone, even if reliance come and invest here
its ploy to draw investment

the only place where return is around 25% due to tax breaks is thar coal, where a pakistani company is basically spear heading/engro

 

[BHarwana]

i have seen them as my uncle leads one, that is not the definition of any modern technical education, teaching how to basic wiring and basic machine operating is not market oriented education that we need

this is where china can help

Sir I don't know which you have seen but the one I am talking about will start operating in 2018. We just laind the foundation stone in our area and they are funded with million of dollars and focused from computer sciences to complex electronics and mechanics.

 

[武成王]

but it is also important for us and the govt to see what CPEC is
its an investment in energy and infrastructure which are important key catalyst for economic development but the first thing is education and skilled labour

the so called direct income from CPEC in trasnit fees is going to be VERY negligible
so called talks of transfer of technology cannot happened without education and skilled workers
current govt has completely ignored education

https://www.facebook.com/

You have to prioritize different tasks, the urgent requirement is to fix power shortage and instability of supply, and smooth interconnection of different region, this will significantly reduce business risk and cost for investors, then factories setup, job created, revenue increased, government then have fund to further improve education, you need lot of money to improve education, it's also not a goal can be accomplished in short term, long term continuous spending is required, this in turn need a continuous growing economy, improved education in turn contribute positive to economy, eventually shaped a positive cycle of mutual-promotion of education and economy.

 

[Canuck786]

Ok. The early harvest projects i.e the Power Plants are Chinese investment. Chinese companies have setup the plants and no loans are not involved here i.e Pakistani Govt is not reapying loans here. What this article tells us is that the Chinese companies got a loan at 5%. Now what is important here is the Return on Investment promised by Pakistan on these projects, which is around 30%. So the Chinese have got some very nice deals here.

Infact, the Chinese have realized the issue of non payment to IPPs and have asked the Govt to set up a revolving fund for the Chinese Power projects so that timely payment is made to them.

I think ROI is around 10-12 (years) on these energy project. In any case it is better to have cheap electricity than to not have it at all. Because the dominos affect of not have power generation to meet the requirements could cost a lot more.

Before, thermal plants were producing electricity at about 25 - 30 rupee / unit. While consumers were only charged Rs. 13 / unit thereby creating a circular debt due to the government subsidy. Now Pakistan is buying electricity at 10 rupee per unit from these Chinese companies so no circular debt would supposedly be created. Current rate of electricity charged to consumer is about Rs. 18 / unit.

See, it's a win win situation for Pakistan

 

[SunilM]

i have seen them as my uncle leads one, that is not the definition of any modern technical education, teaching how to basic wiring and basic machine operating is not market oriented education that we need

this is where china can help


wrong return is 17% not 30%
second it is not china exclusive, its for everyone, even if reliance come and invest here
its ploy to draw investment

the only place where return is around 25% due to tax breaks is thar coal, where a pakistani company is basically spear heading/engro

Any document/news report to confirm this?

 

[Max]

Good to have official confirmation.

Now we have to ask some Pakistani news outlets, like the Express Tribune and Dawn, where exactly did they get their "information" about those incredibly high CPEC interest rates they were quoting?

Did they just pull those numbers out of their backside, or were they paid to do so? Funny how they were quoting the same numbers that appeared in the Indian media?

most probably from here.

 

[ziaulislam]

I think ROI is around 10-12 (years) on these energy project. In any case it is better to have cheap electricity than to not have it at all. Because the dominos affect of not have power generation to meet the requirements could cost a lot more.

Before, thermal plants were producing electricity at about 25 - 30 rupee / unit. While consumers were only charged Rs. 13 / unit thereby creating a circular debt due to the government subsidy. Now Pakistan is buying electricity at 10 rupee per unit from these Chinese companies so no circular debt would supposedly be created. Current rate of electricity charged to consumer is about Rs. 18 / unit.

See, it's a win win situation for Pakistan

nope
that is not the reason for circular debt, one of the reason but not THE REASON
circular debt issue is purely a management issue nothing else and alot of corruption goes into it too

basics
govt recovery is decent, the average cost is now nearly at par so what goes wrong, so in addition to having a gap between the cost(average around 16=gen+distribution+losses) and bill(average around 14) which you mention what other problems we have, as this purely doesn't explained the colossal 800 billion rupees circular debt..this is exactly what the chinese pointed out

1. slow release of funds by govt entities, so govt consumption like schools, health, military etc have very slow release funds which means govt end up paying a high interest rate on that money which by the end of the years is 10% higher than what was expected due to interest and thus roles over
2. lack of payment to PSO
3. subsides

solution:
pay on time
Mr Dar was known to work around figures, holding up tax refund to show better tax figures, similarly he was famous for holding up energy payment to show better fiscal deficit, in turn hurting Pakistan

 

[Canuck786]

nope
that is not the reason for circular debt, one of the reason but not THE REASON
circular debt issue is purely a management issue nothing else and alot of corruption goes into it too

basics
govt recovery is decent, the average cost is now nearly at par so what goes wrong, so in addition to having a gap between the cost(average around 16=gen+distribution+losses) and bill(average around 14) which you mention what other problems we have, as this purely doesn't explained the colossal 800 billion rupees circular debt..this is exactly what the chinese pointed out

1. slow release of funds by govt entities, so govt consumption like schools, health, military etc have very slow release funds which means govt end up paying a high interest rate on that money which by the end of the years is 10% higher than what was expected due to interest and thus roles over
2. lack of payment to PSO
3. subsides

solution:
pay on time
Mr Dar was known to work around figures, holding up tax refund to show better tax figures, similarly he was famous for holding up energy payment to show better fiscal deficit, in turn hurting Pakistan

Sorry don't mean to argue with you but I am quoting information from the horse's mouth. So I still stand by my statement. If you read carefully you will see the logic behind it too.

Have you ever thought few months ago we had more than enough power generation on paper yet there was a scheduled load shedding. Why was it? Because all the furnace fuel / diesel powered plants were not being utilized to stop circular debt from building up. They don't talk about it so often to avoid public overreaction.

 

[neem456]

Is anybody even reading the complete article.
Investments by chinese enterprises will attract 5 % interest, only govt concessional loans will be at 1 or 2 %.

While we pay 0.1% to japanese for their investments in india, where not a single japanese worker comes to india, not a single inch is given to japan, not a single share is sold to japan, not a single free zone is created for japs, not a single inch of any port given for free . Now compare and do your own math.

 

[Canuck786]

Is anybody even reading the complete article.
Investments by chinese enterprises will attract 5 % interest, only govt concessional loans will be at 1 or 2 %.

While we pay 0.1% to japanese for their investments in india, where not a single japanese worker comes to india, not a single inch is given to japan, not a single share is sold to japan, not a single free zone is created for japs, not a single inch of any port given for free . Now compare and do your own math.

Did you read the article yourself?

The 5% is the rate of interest charged to Chinese companies that are investing in these projects and will be paid by the Chinese companies and not by Pakistan government.

Oh and as for India and Japan deal.