Pakistan Military Officer Pay Scale/Recruitment

[pakistanMYheart]

oh my ! have'nt we witnessed the same situation in another thread ! (The PAF Leadership one) and there we go again. This thread will soon end up "Closed for moderation"

@All members

There is one thing I fail to understand. Whenever somebody in this forum, tries to point out something wrong about some Military setup, a "Military Professional" comes in storming, loaded with bombs and missiles, full of anger, and starts making rude and abusive remarks. The original purpose of the thread is buried under loads of anger, and what is left is an apparent fight between Military Professionals and other members. The purpose of threads are not at all aimed to disrespect the military. They are just simple questions rising in the minds of common people, and if military professionals are present here, we expect cool and logical replies, and we will go home the happiest people on earth.

What is so wrong in saying something about the Military, that may have been going on wrong? Why dont we get plain, logical anger-less replies?. As a common fact of human psychology, getting infuriated at the first remark, mostly shows that you are wrong. According to the saying "Truth is always bitter".

None of these discussions are aimed at degrading the military. Why do military men feel degraded? There is something more than meets the eye, I suppose.

Our military people are the greatest of all people. But then, this nation works hard all day, and pays taxes, that support the military. Like any sensible nation, our government and military can be held answerable to tax-payers. Why not?

 

[PakiDil]

oh my ! have'nt we witnessed the same situation in another thread ! (The PAF Leadership one) and there we go again. This thread will soon end up "Closed for moderation"

@All members

There is one thing I fail to understand. Whenever somebody in this forum, tries to point out something wrong about some Military setup, a "Military Professional" comes in storming, loaded with bombs and missiles, full of anger, and starts making rude and abusive remarks. The original purpose of the thread is buried under loads of anger, and what is left is an apparent fight between Military Professionals and other members.

What is so wrong in saying something about the Military, that may have been going on wrong? Why dont we get plain, logical anger-less replies?. As a common fact of human psychology, getting infuriated at the first remark, mostly shows that you are wrong. According to the saying "Truth is always bitter".

None of these discussions are aimed at degrading the military. Why do military men feel degraded? There is something more than meets the eye, I suppose.

Our military people are the greatest of all people. But then, this nation works hard all day, and pays taxes, that support the military. Like any sensible nation, our government and military can be held answerable to tax-payers. Why not?

Thank you very much.

 

[Xeric]

Well I myself have heard from a number of Jawans that they were not treated well by their officers. How much of its was true and how much was exaggeration, I don’t know. I used to spend my vacation at my Uncle's place (who retired as a Brigadier), and I saw him at least treating his batman quite well. But than his batman was sort of our (mine and my cousin's) buddy. I guess it is little different when someone is with you for such a long period of time. My Dad had a batman who was with him from 1972 (I was born in 1973) till 1999 (when my father finally got posted in Lahore). At that time Altaf (that was his name) had grown old and he couldn’t accompany my Dad for a number of reasons. We always used to call him Altaf Chacha and he indeed was/is considered a family member rather than a batman.

And still you think that other officers other then your Brigdier uncle were Pherohs!

BTW, how many times did you hear workers in banks cribbing about their bosses, labours always talking abd about their employers, sale-men talking foul about the shop owners etc etc. But what surprises me is that a man who has the capability to see the truth also fails to see it or may be it is something deliberate.

A dude who dont even know how to write his name joins the Army and by the time he becomes a NCO he is so shrewd, sharp, learned that until he go back to his village people dont plan the marriages of their daughter without getting advice from the fauji saab, he is so capable that young officers take advices from him at every step even in live ops, he manages to get his children out from his village were probably there was no water or electricity what to talk about gas and bring him to a place were he lives with dignity and proud and he also manages to get his childerns in some guud school inside the cantt and there on in Military College Jehlum where his son turns out to be future Army Officer.The NCO might actually manage to save almost equal to what an Officer might save and intellectuals like you believe what a troll said which got him banned!

Sir i have been tuiting the children of these honorable NCOs and JCOs when i was a lieut, i have to do away with my movie time for this task of mine but i never complained because i knew they cant afford some tuition and their kids would just end up as another 'C' Grader. There are many other things which i might quote you, but know you will again turn a deaf ear to it as usual. We have been purchasing 100s of items for them to be offered to them as gifts and incentives may it be in term of free rations or bangles for their kids (daughters) on Eid. My and other officers wives have been taking vocational classes for the lady wives to the same NCOs/JCOs while going in their homes. Our OFFICERS' children have been forcefully getting their children out their houses to play with them so that they dont feel the difference. And highly knowledgeable man like you just believe in hoaxes.

Execpt all the 'bad' things that many officer and men told you about the Army dod they ever tell you about a thing known as TFWC? Oh yes why would they, they also are probably also with the same kind to thinking as you possess. Not satisfied with their job, always complaining about the boss, hardships etc etc. i always give an advice to these kinda people, sir just write it on piece of paper they you are not satisfied with the Arm,y's working and i promise you before the next days dawn you would have left the cantt for guud!! From there on in peace and find a better job (if you can)!

 

[Xeric]

Sonicboom after getting his *** kicked by Army and PAakdef Mods is back with new ID

Lolzz...it was quick. These losers are so persistent, but let them have fun.

 

[jalip]

Actually, these perks and plots for military personnel are designed to negate this financial disparity felt by their officers without further burdening the tax payer. I never said that generals are financially vulnerable, ofcouse they’d probably be better off than your average Pakistani but that doesn’t mean they’re ‘showered in wealth’ or anything of the sort. The image of generals with unlimited access to the taxpayer’s money is untrue. They’re able to do fine for themselves no doubt, but that doesn’t mean excessive wealth. Civilians with their age and experience (often working for multinational companies) usually make much more than they do (including the plots and perks).

sir i would like u to compares the benifts including every thing with any developing countries You will find it out taxpayer ar giving more then half of their income for their defence for the last fifty year What they got u know that? I met a retired british genral he jocked with me by saying that he would like to retired as pakistan army genral as they retired with a gold spone
I thinks thats miltary officers while they retired should be given subtantial amount of money and then they have to live in civilian eenvironment as they are not serving the country any more

 

[Xeric]

oh my ! have'nt we witnessed the same situation in another thread ! (The PAF Leadership one) and there we go again. This thread will soon end up "Closed for moderation"

@All members

There is one thing I fail to understand. Whenever somebody in this forum, tries to point out something wrong about some Military setup, a "Military Professional" comes in storming, loaded with bombs and missiles, full of anger, and starts making rude and abusive remarks. The original purpose of the thread is buried under loads of anger, and what is left is an apparent fight between Military Professionals and other members. The purpose of threads are not at all aimed to disrespect the military. They are just simple questions rising in the minds of common people, and if military professionals are present here, we expect cool and logical replies, and we will go home the happiest people on earth.

What is so wrong in saying something about the Military, that may have been going on wrong? Why dont we get plain, logical anger-less replies?. As a common fact of human psychology, getting infuriated at the first remark, mostly shows that you are wrong. According to the saying "Truth is always bitter".

None of these discussions are aimed at degrading the military. Why do military men feel degraded? There is something more than meets the eye, I suppose.

Our military people are the greatest of all people. But then, this nation works hard all day, and pays taxes, that support the military. Like any sensible nation, our government and military can be held answerable to tax-payers. Why not?

Ok another sympathizer.

Sir, you open to criticize anyone to include military. But it becomes a pain in a$$ when false allegations leveled repeatedly even if all of them has been clarified by some MP. Moreover, if you are a new comer then i would suggest that before posting your hate fulled remarks search the forum as ALL of these stupid allegations have been countered many a time. So instead of wasting the bandwidth and others times do some homework yourself.
Lastly, MPs are not here to clarify your doubts. They are not paid fpr this nor do they have joined the forum with this purpose. If anyone gets in counters what you spew you must be thankful. i know the military has kicked the sorry azzez of many like you, and this kinda attitude would be expected from yourselves forever. That's a none-issue and you may proceed with what you want-i live in a free country i supposed!

 

[Xeric]

sir i would like u to compares the benifts including every thing with any developing countries You will find it out taxpayer ar giving more then half of their income for their defence for the last fifty year What they got u know that? I met a retired british genral he jocked with me by saying that he would like to retired as pakistan army genral as they retired with a gold spone
I thinks thats miltary officers while they retired should be given subtantial amount of money and then they have to live in civilian eenvironment as they are not serving the country any more

A few questions sir:

Developing contries? How. name them, give us the pay scale, and the perks that they dont get.

Tax-payers giving half of their pays to th military, that was a news sir, thnx, keep me posted.

-----

Let me clear off the dust myself. When i was in States one of my cleassfellows was a Naplese Army Lt Col. e ofcourse discussed the pay sacles. Ther rate of pay was almost the same but keeping in view that Pakistani Rupee is a very bit lower then the Nepalese Rupee i like to tell you that they were earning more then us. Moreover, allow me to take the honor to tell you how other 'developing' countries compensate theor soldiers. In our military it is normal that only the best of the best go for courses, scondments abroad or for UN Missions. Once you go your are probablt done, unlesss you get Kashnmir freed there is a remote chance that you would go out again, but guess what, it is normal in the Napese Army that first, EVERY Offcier gets a chance to go abroad, there is no competeion or should i say less of a competetion, almost everyone gets a chance to go abroad, Second, it is normal for them if someione has gone abroad for even more than 4 to 5 times!! Now anyone who has gone abraod 5 times odesnt need a fringing plot dude!

Moreover, there are certain scondments that are paid by the West (hosts), like the course in IMET Program, but for the others the govts who send theor officers pay, menaning thereby that thier govts pay their military officers in dollars !! Wow, let;s see if this happens here in Pakistan, you people will kill us

Here's the list of credits to that Napeles Officer;

Did his basic course from USA, he was from infantry. The Naplese govt paid for it.

Been to USA twice as a lieutenant for two more course, one was paid by the Naplese govt.

Been to UK and France once each, both trips were paid by the Naplese govt.

Was seconded to UN Missions thrice, one as a UN Observer, second as on a UN Mission, lastly as SO in some UN stuff. Yes this is something wihci the Naplese govt didn't pay for!

This was the fourth time he was coming to USA for a course. A course funded by the US itself.

And i was like, Sir ap tu COAS hain future k Naplese Army k, and he laughed, and replied Sir, what about those in our military who have spent HALF of their lives abroad!!

Now i wonder how much he must have earned during his service, no doubt they dont require plots...lolzzz

BTW, they same holds guud for Sri Lanka.
Chill!

 

[pakistanMYheart]

@xeric

I mentioned in my last post, why I think you are loosing your cool. Cant you please, for once reply to a post in a normal way, instead of abusing the poster?

MODS kindly note the tone.

 

[Xeric]

@xeric

I mentioned in my last post, why I think you are loosing your cool. Cant you please, for once reply to a post in a normal way, instead of abusing the poster?

MODS kindly note the tone.

The tone is and would remain as such until your demeanor remains insulting.

Mods please take note!!

 

[pakistanMYheart]

ok @xeric

You asked for it. Let me use the same tone then. Because I really really dont like the way you are talking. I hope being a non-MP does not make me any less a member of this forum? or does it?

Just pointing out some thing that is wrong with Army, seems insulting to you? Do you think you are perfect? Sent from heavens, and answerable to no body?

I will just ask the MODS to allow me to reply @xeric in the same tone. Seeking permission from MODS because, I do not want this forum to end up being "Closed for moderation", and see the interesting discussion I am going to have with @xeric, go down the drain.

 

[x_man]

Our military people are the greatest of all people. But then, this nation works hard all day, and pays taxes, that support the military. Like any sensible nation, our government and military can be held answerable to tax-payers. Why not?

Mate, we have already discussed everything with no results. Neither me nor any other member can help you here with the grievances that you have against pilots and other members of armed forces…….Discussion just for the sake of discussion is useless…….Nothing is going to change here….Pilots will continue to hold all key positions and you will keep feeling the same disgust in your heart…

If you are really sincere with your cause and think that PAF is mistreating all its braches (other than GD), or Armed forces are involved in Gross Loot Maar, then I think you need to raise the level. As I earlier suggested that you hit the mainstream media and bring to their attention the issues you have against pilots / Armed forces. You are not even a serving or retired member of armed forces, so you should be scared of losing any sort of benefits or getting punished. As you are a lawyer too so and its your job to give people justice and if you believe that gross injustice has been done by people running the forces, then by all means go ahead and bring them to their knees. Just see what lawyers achieved in last year or so….Do I see another movement here from another Lawyer???

Have you ever heard of the name Wing Commander K R Nagesh or do you know what happened in IAF in Feb, 1998? Well allow me to make you aware about that: wide disparity in the pay scales between flying branch and Engg Branch forced the IAF engineers and their wives to demonstrate in the streets at a number of Bases. They too had serious issues against their pilots (damn they are same everywhere) and in the end they too (engineers) won and had the pay rise…..Morale of the story is that there is a lot for you to learn from their experiences…. Wg Comdr. Nagesh fought for what he believe was right and in the end won…..Can you become the Nagesh for PAFs ground branches????

So muster all your courage and create some waves in a pond where you can really make the difference. ..Otherwise you will keep pounding your head against the wall here and achieve NOTHING….... I again suggest you taking things a one step further…. hope to see something very soon from you in mainstream .

All the best.

 

[pakistanMYheart]

@x_man

Nice to see you again.
I think I am being grossly misunderstood here. I am not here to win a war. Discussion forums do not bring changes. They are like Gup Shup, we would normally have with our friends. So, why not do some intellectual Gup Shup. You say something, I say something, and we both go home happy.

I joined the forums with exactly this intention. I think you should take it with the same spirit.

If you are right, then it must be your belief that no one in this world can prove you wrong. If you are right, your actions will support you, you wont need to resort to anger or abuse.

And if you are wrong, why not accept it. Of course, these forums do not matter. I can assure you, when you go to your office next time, your boss will still be a pilot. There will be no Phd sitting there, guiding you how to fly well. So why worry ?

 

[x_man]

First of all you seem to be the owner of this forum

Errrrr…. he actually runs the forum if you couldn’t figure it out till now…

and you are serving the interest of some of the ex army and air force officers to keep your forum in business.

Wrong once again….You know how many members this forum has: 17, 349 and out of these how many Mil Prof ??? Well just 16. And not all these MPs are from Pakistan. They are from Australia, USA , UK and even INDIA , so saying that PDF only supports Pakistani POV, is way off the mark.

No forum member even an MP ( previous Think Tanks) is above the forum rules. If you do not know, I too have been banned once from this forum for being unreasonable. There have been TT wwho were stripped off their titles and many other senior Pakistani members banned for trespassing the rules. So if you think that Admin of this forum is protecting MPs then you are putting just another baseless allegation that you have been doing uptill now.

Secondly I did not make any derogatory statements but told the absolute truth and truth is always bitter

Yeh truth is bitter and sometimes counter Truth is even bitter. Xeric has very well countered all the missiles you fired at him and forces , and I guess you have nothing to add on the subject.

Everyone knows what goes in ISSB and how the selection process favors sons/ daughters and relatives of officers.

Gibberish….I know countless guys whose dads were in Armed forces and the boys never made it thru ISSB in both attempts. Hundreds and thousands of guys appear in ISSB each year and very few are selected. And all those who never get it thru, have only one thing to say: ISSB main sirf sifarish chalti hai….So typical. Have you ever met a single guy who said that he couldn’t do well in the group tasks, or intelligence tests or Interview??? They all blame it on ISSB as you are doing too….Just out of curiosity, have you ever been to ISSB???

You can ban me as many times as you wish. Let's see who wins here.

If you are here to win anything then you never will. Because there is nothing to win or lose here. ….No one really gives a hoot..

In PAF one and this thread, you first tried to divide the opinion of members against our Armed forces by misleading them with false information and now you are attempting to divide people by directly confronting the Admin team and their powers on this forum. No MOD or Webby send you the invitation at your home to join PDF….If you cant stand them or other members then no one is compelling you to stay here…..

 

[x_man]

Discussion forums do not bring changes.

Exactly my point.

I can assure you, when you go to your office next time, your boss will still be a pilot. There will be no Phd sitting there, guiding you how to fly well. So why worry..

Thanks for letting me know...I am so relieved...

 

[Xeric]

Sir X_man:
Request initiate ignore mode, please. Let's not feed the troll.

You already have given him enough masala, if he has an iota of shame he would refrain from stupid remarks. Let's chill.

How's this for a change:
Sir get a seat for me in the next C-130