Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[PakShaheen79]

Just like yankies Yet to get Poseidon... and we bought 8.... anything regarding 6th-Gen with F-18 is too much... if some one is saying is this.. then it is due to Helucination only...although the Guy who said this... still looking for Link to back his claim(s)

Are these Psdeiden with IN?

 

[rajeev]

F16IN - I really doubt will be much different. LM claims that they are most advanced that Pak has, but as far I see it to quote a paraphrase during US elections, "it is the same pig with a different lipstick".

Infact I think Pak will be in advantageous position if India only buys 126 F16 (in case F16s are choosen). Pak pilots have been playing with the toy for a long time and besides China would have reverse engineered some of these crafts and added new things to make more powerful flying machines.

But if India really wants to buy F16IN for the offered price of 18million a piece, they could very well buy in excess of 500+ for that price.

 

[Haanzo]

my question: what kind of refueling system will the MLU and blk 52 birds have ...can those birds be refueled using probe and drogue system or the boom system ......one more point i read that for an f-16 to use probe system it MUST have conformal fuel tanks....... what is the solution that PAF is going after ???

 

[PakShaheen79]

I dont know about rest but CFTs are also part of the deal. So refueling must not be a problem whichever system is being used on board.

 

[fatman17]

6 Oct 1990

The US embargoes F-16 deliveries to Pakistan, and a total of 28 Pakistan F-16A/B Block 15OCU aircraft are put in flyable hold storage in the Sonoran desert.

 

[PakShaheen79]

6 Oct 1990

The US embargoes F-16 deliveries to Pakistan, and a total of 28 Pakistan F-16A/B Block 15OCU aircraft are put in flyable hold storage in the Sonoran desert.

Sense of betrayal and being stabbed in the back is still there though date is exactly 19 years old now... Hope nothing similar will happen to new deal.

 

[dbc]

Sense of betrayal and being stabbed in the back is still there though date is exactly 19 years old now... Hope nothing similar will happen to new deal.

Wrong! You shot yourself in the foot on that one..

 

[Arsalan]

Sense of betrayal and being stabbed in the back is still there though date is exactly 19 years old now... Hope nothing similar will happen to new deal.

totally agree on that one friend,,,,
i wishwe had learned from our previous mistakes,,,
now have you listened about Obama postponing the signing of logar bill,,,
isnt it a sign of things to come,,??

regards!

 

[PAFAce]

Sense of betrayal and being stabbed in the back is still there though date is exactly 19 years old now...

It's just politics man. Nothing personal. No reason to feel "betrayed". Think of it this way; No embargo, no JF-17. Now, doesn't that make you happy?

Wrong! You shot yourself in the foot on that one..

How is that, ma'am?

 

[Patriot]

my question: what kind of refueling system will the MLU and blk 52 birds have ...can those birds be refueled using probe and drogue system or the boom system ......one more point i read that for an f-16 to use probe system it MUST have conformal fuel tanks....... what is the solution that PAF is going after ???

PAF might acquire surplus KC-135 which US is going to retire soon and Block 52's will be equipped with CFT's so plenty of range even without refueling.

 

[dbc]

It's just politics man. Nothing personal. No reason to feel "betrayed". Think of it this way; No embargo, no JF-17. Now, doesn't that make you happy?


How is that, ma'am?

From another thread Re: It does not matter These people hate us

@AM,
US non proliferation law was first introduced in 1961, in 1989, I suspect the Pakistani government was well aware that it risked billions of dollars in financial and military assistance including Peace Gate (F-16 purchase) if Pakistan ever delivered or received, acquired or transferred nuclear enrichment technology. At the time of placing the order for seventy one F-16’s you had already acquired the capability, Dr. Abdul Qadeer Khan said so in 1987, this was later corroborated by the Pakistan foreign secretary in 1992. F-16’s and other advanced US weapons and billions of dollars of US assistance was the incentive on offer from the US Congress after assurances from both the US administration and Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto that military assistance would address Pakistan’s security concerns and thereby keep Pakistan from acquiring the bomb. Your Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto pledged that Pakistan neither had nor would develop nuclear weapons at a joint session with US congress in Washington in 1989.
Pressler amendment was Pakistan specific, it allowed President Reagan and Bush to continue providing weapons and financial assistance by certifying that Pakistan did not possess a nuclear device. Both were later accused by Senator John Glenn in 1992 of hoodwinking the US Congress and the American taxpayer. Under immense pressure and mounting evidence, President George Bush could no longer make the certification required by Pressler’s amendment and on October 6th, 1990 the US government embargoed further arms deliveries to Pakistan.
Pakistan was aware of the risk it took placing the order in 1989, by the time Pakistan was sanctioned in Oct 1990 General Dynamics had already started work on building the F-16’s worth 658m$ but the planes could not be delivered to Pakistan. The first batch of (Peace Gate III) eleven aircrafts were flown directly to AMARC (Aircraft Maintenance and Regeneration Center) at Davis-Monthan AFB, Arizona where they were put in 'Flyable Hold' later these were joined by seventeen more Peace Gate IV fighters. Since the government did not make a budget allocation for a refund of 658m$ the only choice was to find a buyer for the 28 F-16’s in storage. A few years later and after several failed attempts at selling the planes, an agreement was reached with Pakistan in Dec 2008 to pay $326.9 million in cash and up to $140 million in other compensation to settle the eight-year dispute. The $140 million includes about $60 million in US white wheat. The remaining $80 million in compensation will be negotiated by the two sides. After reaching the agreement with President Clinton, your Prime Minister Mohammad Nawaz Sharif had this to say at a press conference “the F-16 dispute has been resolved to the satisfaction of Pakistan”. No accusations of “theft”, “fraud” or “betrayal of trust” – you obviously disagree; take it up with Mr Sharif.

It was your Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto and your officials that defrauded the American taxpayer off 6 billion $ in military sales and grants between 1982 and 1990 by pledging nuclear abstinence while being only a few screw driver turns away from a fully functional nuclear device.

 

[Patriot]

DBC, Don't be so innocent.Your government damn well knew we were building the bomb and i would even say Ronald Regan was great for Pakistan as he just ignored Pakistan Nuclear bomb and if you honestly believe CIA did not have any info about our bomb prior to President Certification then you're very naive.Well, in any case, Nuclear bomb was far more worthy then F-16 ever could be.Thanks to capable ISI..it kept US and its lackeys at one end and we managed to get nuclear bomb. In any case, sanctions resulted in a lot of good stuff, Mainly our Nuclear bomb..JF-17 and more indigenous stuff.Before that, Army was very much pro west.

 

[hj786]

PAF might acquire surplus KC-135 which US is going to retire soon and Block 52's will be equipped with CFT's so plenty of range even without refueling.

KC-135 is just a modified Boing 707. The PAF has operated 3 of these since 1986, 2 as cargo aircraft and the third as a VIP transport aircraft. They were even thinking of converting the cargo aircraft to aerial refuelling tankers according to an Air International article from 1987.

 

[dbc]

DBC, Don't be so innocent.Your government damn well knew we were building the bomb and i would even say Ronald Regan was great for Pakistan as he just ignored Pakistan Nuclear bomb and if you honestly believe CIA did not have any info about our bomb prior to President Certification then you're very naive.Well, in any case, Nuclear bomb was far more worthy then F-16 ever could be.Thanks to capable ISI..it kept US and its lackeys at one end and we managed to get nuclear bomb. In any case, sanctions resulted in a lot of good stuff, Mainly our Nuclear bomb..JF-17 and more indigenous stuff.Before that, Army was very much pro west.

No sir, I’m not naïve and please don’t confuse the US Administration with Congress. CIA reports its findings to the Oval office not Congress so it was easy for President Reagan to keep congress in the dark. But after Dr. Abdul Qadeer Khan spilled the beans in 1987 it was political suicide for President Bush to sign the waiver required under Pressler amendment certifying Pakistan did not deliver or receive, acquire or transfer nuclear enrichment technology.

 

[SSGPA1]

Any news about arrival of new F-16s?