Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[Battle Axe]

I was once so enamoured with that possibility of 100+ or 6 Squadrons of shining Vipers but that does not look like happening. We stay clocked at 63, oh 77!

No news of buying used F-16s from Norway (I'll prefer them a tonne over Blk I Thunders for our experience, combat record & love for the former bird) or elsewhere, nor the option of 18 Blk 52 & nor the 14 Navy EDAs being released...

 

[alimobin memon]

I was once so enamoured with that possibility of 100+ or 6 Squadrons of shining Vipers but that does not look like happening. We stay clocked at 63, oh 77!

No news of buying used F-16s from Norway (I'll prefer them a tonne over Blk I Thunders for our experience, combat record & love for the former bird) or elsewhere, nor the option of 18 Blk 52 & nor the 14 Navy EDAs being released...

No one's buying norway f-16

 

[ziaulislam]

seems so we wont be getting any more before 2015.
if US stays in afghnistan and pakistan manages to have even a descent relationship with them then we can expect some EDA stuff or cheaper refurbished stuff around 2015 as they will be inducting the JSF at that time.

 

[Imran Khan]

No one's buying norway f-16

they are outdated and used fully why we buy junk for just numbers?. thats why this money should used for any thing else.

 

[Free Soul]

they are outdated and used fully why we buy junk for just numbers?. thats why this money should used for any thing else.

Should avoid making sweeping statements like something is junk so and so.

F-16 A/Bs Mid Life Upgraded is what we got too. we never think of them as junk not even before MLU.

Don’t know if we are buying any Norwegian F-16 or not, but if a decision is taken it would be well thought-out

 

[Imran Khan]

Should avoid making sweeping statements like something is junk so and so.

F-16 A/Bs Mid Life Upgraded is what we got too. we never think of them as junk not even before MLU.

Don’t know if we are buying any Norwegian F-16 or not, but if a decision is taken it would be well thought-out

its not MLU its flight hours and environment sir .they lived and worked in extreme and fly over sea and stay near sea have hell flights hours . they are not rich to throw them away .

 

[malik1979]

Hi
I just wanna know if all f16 block 52 plus MLU F16 to be stationed in Jacobabad then which planes would be in SARGODHA AIRBASE

 

[Last Hope]

I noticed the Tail vertical stabilizer (ruder) base of Block 50/52+ F-16s is wider and bigger. But noticed in some Block 50/52s pictures we do not see this feature. Is this specific to Block 50/52 Plus?

Free Soul.

The difference is that Block 52 has two variants. F-16C and F-16D.
F-16D has a spine and is dual seater, unlike F-16C.

So in short, there are some changes in the fuselages and to meet the requirement, the length and size is adjusted.

 

[Free Soul]

its not MLU its flight hours and environment sir .they lived and worked in extreme and fly over sea and stay near sea have hell flights hours . they are not rich to throw them away .

Valid points Sir, Also MLU is not just a weapon systems, avionics upgrade.
Airframe and skin repairs are also taken care of. This adds to the aircraft’s life.

Included in MLU is following as well.

Aircraft structural integrity program
The F-16s airframe has been subject to more heavy loads than was predicted in 1979. This resulted in several unpredicted hair cracks in some of the airframe's bulkheads. Before an aircraft can be offered for MLU modification, the current state of the airframe is examined in the extensive Aircraft Structural Integrity Program (PACER SLIP). In this modification program, all bulkheads of the aircraft will be examined and repaired (using the so called Cold Working method) if necessary. After PACER SLIP, the aircraft will be able to last at least another 5,000 flying hours and can complete its life expectancy of 30 years.

Note that hair cracks are not uncommon in aircraft design. To predict the acceptable number and type of cracks, the aircraft manufacturer used information that reflected the exact capabilities of the aircraft. The F-16 was designed as a light and highly manoeuvrable aircraft that could withstand 9G and last for a minimum of 8,000 flight hours. All data is recorded in a load spectrum that specifies the use of the aircraft (i.e. type of missions), aircraft load and predicted number of landings.

First F-16 arrived at Sargodha Airbase on 15 January 1983 (delivered from 1983 to 1987) – our existing fleet of F-16s was of some 25 years and older, think of flying hours done on these aircrafts. MLU has added life to our older F-16s and made them very relevant with systems upgrades.

Regarding Flight hours and environment I would not think as if Norwegian F-16s are parked like a car on the road curb all rusty and rotten. A fighter aircraft is well looked after.

All of this is besides the point, I do not know if we are or even were thinking about procurement of some old Norwegian F-16s.

My contention was just that calling something junk is a tad bit OTT.

As far as i am concerned, i am more excited about J-10Bs.

 

[Donatello]

AIM 9X???????

We didn't order Aim 9X....or did we?

Any think tank members who can clarify?

 

[Free Soul]

AIM 9X???????

We didn't order Aim 9X....or did we?

Any think tank members who can clarify?

Sorry am not Think Tank, but can share this much

Think we are getting AIM-9M or 9R Sidewinder, Off-bore sight aiming capability, Proximity/optic fuse etc. these are not fifth generation AIM-9X but the next best after that.

Item 2: Weapons for the New F-16s – $650 Million

To equip those new F-16s, the Government of Pakistan has requested a possible sale of:

500 AIM-120C5 Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missiles (AMRAAM)
12 AMRAAM training missiles – these have seeker warheads but lack engines
200 AIM-9M-8/9 Sidewinder Short-Range Air-Air Missiles; they are the version before the fifth-generation AIM-9X.
240 LAU-129/A Launchers – these support AMRAAM or Sidewinder missiles.
500 Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) Guidance Kits: GBU-31/38 Guided Bomb Unit (GBU) kits
1,600 Enhanced Paveway GBU-12 (500 lb.) and GBU-24s (2,000 lb.) with dual laser/GPS guidance
800 MK-82 500 pound General Purpose (GP) and MK-84 2,000 pound GP bombs
700 BLU-109 2,000 pound bunker-buster bombs with the FMU-143 Fuse
Associated support equipment, software development/integration, modification kits, capability to employ a wide variety of munitions, spares and repair parts, flight test instrumentation, publications and technical documentation, CONUS-personnel training and training equipment, U.S. Government and contractor technical and logistics personnel services, and other related requirements to ensure full program supportability will also be provided.

$5.1B Proposed Sales, Upgrades, Weapons Pakistan’s F-16s

 

[Najam Khan]

AIM 9X???????

We didn't order Aim 9X....or did we?

Any think tank members who can clarify?

Well this question has no definite answer...some people point their guns at Airchief and his team, some at U.S administration which was trying its best to capture the MMRCA...the delay in supply of -9X was not in PAF's favour.

My understanding is that "9M-8/9 standard" was the most favourable option available at that time. It is improved version of -9L, with better guidance system, InfraRed Counter Counter Measures (IRCCM) capability and 35 degree High Off Bore Sight (HOBS) as compare to 90 degree HOBS of -9X. Both -9X and -9M have same warhead and propulsion system, but -9x has more speed and possibly more range as claimed by Raytheon.

 

[fatman17]

Well this question has no definite answer...some people point their guns at Airchief and his team, some at U.S administration which was trying its best to capture the MMRCA...the delay in supply of -9X was not in PAF's favour.

My understanding is that "9M-8/9 standard" was the most favourable option available at that time. It is improved version of -9L, with better guidance system, InfraRed Counter Counter Measures (IRCCM) capability and 35 degree High Off Bore Sight (HOBS) as compare to 90 degree HOBS of -9X. Both -9X and -9M have same warhead and propulsion system, but -9x has more speed and possibly more range as claimed by Raytheon.

9X will be available sooner than later.

---------- Post added at 01:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:15 PM ----------

Sorry am not Think Tank, but can share this much

Think we are getting AIM-9M or 9R Sidewinder, Off-bore sight aiming capability, Proximity/optic fuse etc. these are not fifth generation AIM-9X but the next best after that.



$5.1B Proposed Sales, Upgrades, Weapons Pakistan’s F-16s

remember the deal was 'concluded' in 2006 and at that time the 9X was only available to US and NATO airforces plus some tier-1 countries like japan, israel etc.
now it is available to most 'allies'. its a matter of time.

---------- Post added at 01:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:18 PM ----------

Hi
I just wanna know if all f16 block 52 plus MLU F16 to be stationed in Jacobabad then which planes would be in SARGODHA AIRBASE

once the MLU is complete, there will be 4 viper squadrons. 2 at shabaz and 2 at mushaf.

 

[nomi007]

Italy is returning its 14 f-16 to usa this year they are good in condition and are block 30 i think we try for get

 

[Imran Khan]

Italy is returning its 14 f-16 to usa this year they are good in condition and are block 30 i think we try for get

you are wrong sir .they are not block-30 . they are block-5 block-10 and block-15 .which were already in storage of USAF IN 2003.
USAF take them out of Davis-Monthan AFB give them refurbishment and upgrades and hand over to italy . they are ex-USAF + upgrade and now EX-ITALY block 5 and 10 if you fly them more they will give you taste of mig-21 .


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