Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[Yasser76]

He worked for PAC Kamra. So he may have a better idea. And rotational cannibalisation did exist at the time yet fortunately it didn't affect flying time much with sanctions. That's why the selection for F-16 aircrew was kept a lot more strict than today.

However, there were no hangar queens with the Vipers other than a particular B model.

CCS still does the borrowing as does the OCU for training new cadre of Viper IPs and studs.

Thought CCS now had their own Vipers? Is the "Aggressor" Sqd not assigned to them?

Also Is number 11 or 13 not the OCU?

 

[Raider 21]

Thought CCS now had their own Vipers? Is the "Aggressor" Sqd not assigned to them?

Also Is number 11 or 13 not the OCU?

19 is OCU and then those selected for MLU & EMLU go to 11 for conversion

 

[Yasser76]

19 is OCU and then those selected for MLU & EMLU go to 11 for conversion

Great thanks, sorry, meant to write 19 not 13. Why send pilots to two seperate OCU courses for the Viper?

 

[Raider 21]

Great thanks, sorry, meant to write 19 not 13. Why send pilots to two seperate OCU courses for the Viper?

In the PAF system, they have kept the ADFs and MLUs in separate squadrons. Newbies now start off in 19

 

[Yasser76]

In the PAF system, they have kept the ADFs and MLUs in separate squadrons. Newbies now start off in 19

So all pilots for 5,9,11 and 28 need to start off on the ADFs with Number 19? That sounds strange and surely the numbers do not add up, there are only 13 ADFs at Bolhari so how does support enough new pilots for the rest of the fleet?

Also 19 only has 3-4 two seater Bs,

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Genius, this still is the case. Clearly shows that your JSCC guest didnt teach you much.

There are still no exclusive CCS vipers. They still borrow from either 9 or 29. #708 has been the red force aggressor for decades now, which means more stress on the airframe. However, red forces do not operate for 365 days and CCS courses are not structured this way. I have said enough already on this, Take a hike.

No sweetheart. OC 9 can any day take a 29 bird.

Similarly, OC 29 took a No. 9 bird (731) for swift retort.

harmless banter is just fine.
its ok to have differing opinions.

we are together when it comes to serve tea and surprise

 

[Raider 21]

So all pilots for 5,9,11 and 28 need to start off on the ADFs with Number 19? That sounds strange and surely the numbers do not add up, there are only 13 ADFs at Bolhari so how does support enough new pilots for the rest of the fleet?

Also 19 only has 3-4 two seater Bs,

That's the setup they have where they take fresh OCU minted pilots into Vipers. I am sure experienced guys get sent to MLU without going through ADF route. And it is not strange, no such thing as strange. It is just PAF being PAF....

 

[Yasser76]

That's the setup they have where they take fresh OCU minted pilots into Vipers. I am sure experienced guys get sent to MLU without going through ADF route. And it is not strange, no such thing as strange. It is just PAF being PAF....

So, when I meant strange, surely for the Viper fleet we need a minimum of around 50 new pilots a year (in addition to experianced ones), how do 3 F-16Bs at Number 19 cope with that?

 

[Talon]

So all pilots for 5,9,11 and 28 need to start off on the ADFs with Number 19? That sounds strange and surely the numbers do not add up, there are only 13 ADFs at Bolhari so how does support enough new pilots for the rest of the fleet?

Also 19 only has 3-4 two seater Bs,

Experienced pilots usually go directly on MLUed vipers

 

[Raider 21]

It's not difficult being a clever dick and pick up info from what others have posted add some cheap banter and consider your self a cool guy....must say his English has at least improved a lot since he use to post on the older PDF forum.
Anyways, does anyone knows anti-rain dance as the weather forecast for 23 March is of no joy.

Watch the language. Behave.

 

[airomerix]

So all pilots for 5,9,11 and 28 need to start off on the ADFs with Number 19? That sounds strange and surely the numbers do not add up, there are only 13 ADFs at Bolhari so how does support enough new pilots for the rest of the fleet?

Also 19 only has 3-4 two seater Bs,

Pilots going to No. 19 have to do 8 missions 'flawlessly' in order to complete the OCU, X number of missions are done with IP on F-16B's and Y number of missions are completed on A models. This is in addition to accumulate Z number of flying hours on F-16As. Not to mention, the simulator is also there.

After 19, they transition to 11 sqn (in some cases 9) to complete advanced weapons training on B model MLU's. But the real conversion happens at 19. Since the induction of ADFs, it has taken off the load from B MLU's and they don't have to do touch and go every now and then.

harmless banter is just fine.
its ok to have differing opinions.

we are together when it comes to serve tea and surprise

I agree. This is why I don't mind giving him these banters. He is touchy and very patriotic. And we are on the same team. Makes it even better.

 

[Yasser76]

Pilots going to No. 19 have to do 8 missions 'flawlessly' in order to complete the OCU, X number of missions are done with IP on F-16B's and Y number of missions are completed on A models. This is in addition to accumulate Z number of flying hours on F-16As. Not to mention, the simulator is also there.

After 19, they transition to 11 sqn (in some cases 9) to complete advanced weapons training on B model MLU's. But the real conversion happens at 19. Since the induction of ADFs, it has taken off the load from B MLU's and they don't have to do touch and go every now and then.


I agree. This is why I don't mind giving him these banters. He is touchy and very patriotic. And we are on the same team. Makes it even better.

Great, thanks, then this must leave 19 with very little spare time/airframes to do QRA no?

 

[Raider 21]

And what language is that....let me be very clear, I never use degrading terms specially against a Pakistani member and since you have spent time in UK, one expects that you would be aware of certain terms or sayings however if you are not just taking a dig then let me help you.


English: clever DickEnglish: clever dick
Definition of 'clever Dick'


clever Dick in British English
or cleverdick (ˈklɛvəˌdɪk )
NOUN
informal
a person considered to have an unwarrantably high opinion of his or her own ability or knowledge
Collins English Dictionary. Copyright © HarperCollins Publishers

And who are you to assume I spent that long enough of time in the UK. Yes I intend to do so eventually, but I have spent time between Pak, Middle East and Canada.

Pilots going to No. 19 have to do 8 missions 'flawlessly' in order to complete the OCU, X number of missions are done with IP on F-16B's and Y number of missions are completed on A models. This is in addition to accumulate Z number of flying hours on F-16As. Not to mention, the simulator is also there.

After 19, they transition to 11 sqn (in some cases 9) to complete advanced weapons training on B model MLU's. But the real conversion happens at 19. Since the induction of ADFs, it has taken off the load from B MLU's and they don't have to do touch and go every now and then.


I agree. This is why I don't mind giving him these banters. He is touchy and very patriotic. And we are on the same team. Makes it even better.

Hope to work on those Sims one day if they come under our division. PAF Viper Sims will now be under CAE

 

[airomerix]

And who are you to assume I spent that long enough of time in the UK. Yes I intend to do so eventually, but I have spent time between Pak, Middle East and Canada.

Hope to work on those Sims one day if they come under our division. PAF Viper Sims will now be under CAE

Congratulations on the acquisition of L3 Harris simulation division. Indeed a great step!

 

[SQ8]

Congratulations on the acquisition of L3 Harris simulation division. Indeed a great step!

One can go check with AVM Shamim or older folks circa 1998-2000 on what we could have had or planned out for Viper sims.
Neural feedback for G-simulation was once thought up, except the PAF never wanted to put the money into getting top neurologists involved but was happy getting all viper pilots go bald - and they say the PAF did not think beyond 5 years.