Pakistan Army - AIR DEFENCE CORPS - Formation, Structure, Weapons

[Signalian]

Giraffe radar/antenna is capable of many functions than just detecting aircraft’s . Not sure if PA is using it to its max potential

 

[farooqbhai007]

Giraffe radar/antenna is capable of many functions than just detecting aircraft’s . Not sure if PA is using it to its max potential

Isn't that capability (C-RAM) only present in the newer Giraffe AMB model and not the older Giraffe model PA operates

 

[Signalian]

Isn't that capability (C-RAM) only present in the newer Giraffe AMB model and not the older Giraffe model PA operates

which model does PA operate ?

 

[farooqbhai007]

which model does PA operate ?

Giraffe-75 (75km range)

 

[Signalian]

Giraffe-75 (75km range)

Radar is pulse Doppler which opens further avenues of operations for it

 

[Signalian]

I think AD is where PA would need new tactics of keeping mixed SP formations of shoulder carried SAMs, AAA guns and medium altitude SAMs to provide AD cover for its armored forces.

 

[SQ8]

I think AD is where PA would need new tactics of keeping mixed SP formations of shoulder carried SAMs, AAA guns and medium altitude SAMs to provide AD cover for its armored forces.

The current inventory is still either focused on Battalion level AD or stuck with MANPADs as the only mobile element.

Considering the threat is evolving to where standoff sensor fuzed weapons and gps/iir munitions will be abundant along its primary threat - The Pakistan Army would be well advised to invest in both modern SPAAGs and quick response kill weapons. There isn’t an equivalent to the C-RAM with China or Turkey for now but that is the need of the day mounted on a common chassis with the AK or AZ series.

 

[farooqbhai007]

The current inventory is still either focused on Battalion level AD or stuck with MANPADs as the only mobile element.

Considering the threat is evolving to where standoff sensor fuzed weapons and gps/iir munitions will be abundant along its primary threat - The Pakistan Army would be well advised to invest in both modern SPAAGs and quick response kill weapons. There isn’t an equivalent to the C-RAM with China or Turkey for now but that is the need of the day mounted on a common chassis with the AK or AZ series.

C-RAM (Given your referring to phalanx) is available in both China and turkey. In trailer based as well as Wheeled configs.
Turkish 20mm CIWS

Chinese 30mm CIWS

Without generator. Exhibited at IDEAS.

While in wheeled category we have the following Chinese Combined SPAAGs. CW/SA-5, FK2000 & SWS2 for point defense/cram.

 

[SQ8]

C-RAM (Given your referring to phalanx) is available in both China and turkey. In trailer based as well as Wheeled configs.
Turkish 20mm CIWS
View attachment 936236
Chinese 30mm CIWS
View attachment 936237
Without generator. Exhibited at IDEAS.
View attachment 936238


While in wheeled category we have the following Chinese Combined SPAAGs. CW/SA-5, FK2000 & SWS2 for point defense/cram.

Not completely analogous in terms of capabilities - but doable. Same reasons the UAE and Saudis want Iron Dome and not Chinese or Turkish offers

 

[farooqbhai007]

Not completely analogous in terms of capabilities - but doable. Same reasons the UAE and Saudis want Iron Dome and not Chinese or Turkish offers

ah you meant a C-RAM rocket system. Yes the turks and chinese do lack in there. But i think UAE is currently pursing its own Sky Night C-RAM program (based on SA tech) which would be the most analogous to Iron Dome.

 

[sparten]

The current inventory is still either focused on Battalion level AD or stuck with MANPADs as the only mobile element.

Considering the threat is evolving to where standoff sensor fuzed weapons and gps/iir munitions will be abundant along its primary threat - The Pakistan Army would be well advised to invest in both modern SPAAGs and quick response kill weapons. There isn’t an equivalent to the C-RAM with China or Turkey for now but that is the need of the day mounted on a common chassis with the AK or AZ series.

I can tell you right now what they are going to do. They will fish out the old 37MM AAA they tried (and failed) to upgrade back in the 1990's out of storage. Put them on APC's and call it a day.
(The guns were pretty neat, autoloaders and radar guidance was added. In that era they were obsolete, which is why the program went nowhere. But, these are probably pretty good versus the new UAV threat).

 

[SQ8]

I can tell you right now what they are going to do. They will fish out the old 37MM AAA they tried (and failed) to upgrade back in the 1990's out of storage. Put them on APC's and call it a day.
(The guns were pretty neat, autoloaders and radar guidance was added. In that era they were obsolete, which is why the program went nowhere. But, these are probably pretty good versus the new UAV threat).

Good point - they could do that but they are going to be obsolete regardless. I think there may be a consensus happening on the Oerlikon model and using that across the board because that brings AHEAD and ATOM and they like that along with whoever has the agency for it.

 

[farooqbhai007]

I can tell you right now what they are going to do. They will fish out the old 37MM AAA they tried (and failed) to upgrade back in the 1990's out of storage. Put them on APC's and call it a day.
(The guns were pretty neat, autoloaders and radar guidance was added. In that era they were obsolete, which is why the program went nowhere. But, these are probably pretty good versus the new UAV threat).

Nope. I believe there are two reasons into why PA hasn't procured SHORAD yet.
1. Logically looking 10 Years back we didn't even have battalion level sam cover. So first was LY80 purchase, then came HQ9 purchase and then some newer variant of LY80 etc. Now it would make sense to procure SHORAD once that battalion level AD has been established.
2. In various images and posters from around 2018 or so Pantsir SHORAD purchase had been made and as Panzerkiel said even crews had been trained so much so that PA AD areas even had posters of Pantsir on walls depicting them as part of PA's AD network. However the russians pulled out last minute due to geopolitical pressure and other reasons. So we could have had our first shorad operational in 2019.

 

[farooqbhai007]

Good point - they could do that but they are going to be obsolete regardless. I think there may be a consensus happening on the Oerlikon model and using that across the board because that brings AHEAD and ATOM and they like that along with whoever has the agency for it.

Some points I may put here,
1. PAF has been trying to acquire Oerlikon GDF as well.
2. PN Marines AD operate several batteries of the PG-99 AAA (Chinese copy of GDF).
3. Several batteries of second hand Oerlikon GDF along with Sky guard 1s were delivered last year to Pakistan according to some aviation trackers who found images of GDF being transported from Italy to Pak.

 

[farooqbhai007]

@Signalian @PanzerKiel