Pak govt Should issue special fund 30 to 50 billion to Pak navy for complete modernization

[Muhammad Omar]

The above one is the imagination of PLAN type 054b/type57, and the below one is a export design based on type 54A.

So they are not same???

Can they Add VLS as shown in Pic to the Model empty space???

 

[帅的一匹]

So they are not same???

Can they Add VLS as shown in Pic to the Model empty space???

Of course, as long as the customer need.

We can tailor it.

 

[niaz]

Don’t know how this thread came about. Before we go on building castles in the air spree, let look at ground realities.

Pakistan’s external debt is about $75-billion.

https://tradingeconomics.com/pakistan/external-debt

Pakistan’s net public debt is Rs 18.28-trillion ($182-billion).

https://www.dawn.com/news/1313037

Debt servicing costs during 2016 fiscal year were $5.3-billion

http://www.sbp.org.pk/ecodata/pakdebtsvr_summary.pdf

Pakistan trade deficit (imports versus exports) during the 8 months up to March 2017 was $20.2 –billion.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1352821/pakistans-trade-deficit-widens-record-high/

The forum is full of very intelligent members, can any wise man explain to an idiot like me from where $30 to 50 – billion for the Pak Navy in going to come from?

Undoubtedly we need a more powerful Navy. But the country also needs more power plants, more gas, more schools and more factories to find jobs for the younger generation. There is only so much available and compromise has to be made when allocating the resources.

I would also would like 30 Division PA, 30 combat squadron PAF and a 30 warship PN but this is simply not achievable. Even if we could somehow manage to spare $1-billion in FE each year for the PN; in 10 years’ time we would have a respectably strong navy.

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

Don’t know how this thread came about. Before we go on building castles in the air spree, let look at ground realities.

Pakistan’s external debt is about $75-billion.

https://tradingeconomics.com/pakistan/external-debt

Pakistan’s net public debt is Rs 18.28-trillion ($182-billion).

https://www.dawn.com/news/1313037

Debt servicing costs during 2016 fiscal year were $5.3-billion

http://www.sbp.org.pk/ecodata/pakdebtsvr_summary.pdf

Pakistan trade deficit (imports versus exports) during the 8 months up to March 2017 was $20.2 –billion.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1352821/pakistans-trade-deficit-widens-record-high/

The forum is full of very intelligent members, can any wise man explain to an idiot like me from where $30 to 50 – billion for the Pak Navy in going to come from?

Undoubtedly we need a more powerful Navy. But the country also needs more power plants, more gas, more schools and more factories to find jobs for the younger generation. There is only so much available and compromise has to be made when allocating the resources.

I would also would like 30 Division PA, 30 combat squadron PAF and a 30 warship PN but this is simply not achievable. Even if we could somehow manage to spare $1-billion in FE each year for the PN; in 10 years’ time we would have a respectably strong navy.

American debt is ~19-20 trillion lolz

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Don’t know how this thread came about. Before we go on building castles in the air spree, let look at ground realities.

Pakistan’s external debt is about $75-billion.

https://tradingeconomics.com/pakistan/external-debt

Pakistan’s net public debt is Rs 18.28-trillion ($182-billion).

https://www.dawn.com/news/1313037

Debt servicing costs during 2016 fiscal year were $5.3-billion

http://www.sbp.org.pk/ecodata/pakdebtsvr_summary.pdf

Pakistan trade deficit (imports versus exports) during the 8 months up to March 2017 was $20.2 –billion.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1352821/pakistans-trade-deficit-widens-record-high/

The forum is full of very intelligent members, can any wise man explain to an idiot like me from where $30 to 50 – billion for the Pak Navy in going to come from?

Undoubtedly we need a more powerful Navy. But the country also needs more power plants, more gas, more schools and more factories to find jobs for the younger generation. There is only so much available and compromise has to be made when allocating the resources.

I would also would like 30 Division PA, 30 combat squadron PAF and a 30 warship PN but this is simply not achievable. Even if we could somehow manage to spare $1-billion in FE each year for the PN; in 10 years’ time we would have a respectably strong navy.

Not $30-50 Billion at least $4-5 Billion would be enough to buy some Good Frigates for now

 

[BetterPakistan]

Not $30-50 Billion at least $4-5 Billion would be enough to buy some Good Frigates for now

Omar bhai $4-5 billion for frigates??

As far as I remember last four f-22 frigates cost us $175 mn a piece and if we go for type 054a frigate now it will cost us about $250 mn a piece and we can get 4 for a billion dollar than why $4-5 bn??

We need 5 frigates to replace those 5 british frigates currently serving and we can replace them by buying 5 more used frigates and upgrading them like we did with alamgir class frigate. Other than this I hope 4 ada class corvettes join Pakistan navy till the end of 2020. With these 4 ada class corvettes and 8 submarines afterwards we need more fast attack crafts like 6 more about 700-800 tonnes each not more frigates at least until we complete 4 ada class corvettes.

Nuclear submarine is more necessary, isn't it?

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Omar bhai $4-5 billion for frigates??

As far as I remember last four f-22 frigates cost us $175 mn a piece and if we go for type 054a frigate now it will cost us about $250 mn a piece and we can get 4 for a billion dollar than why $4-5 bn??

We need 5 frigates to replace those 5 british frigates currently serving and we can replace them by buying 5 more used frigates and upgrading them like we did with alamgir class frigate. Other than this I hope 4 ada class corvettes join Pakistan navy till the end of 2020. With these 4 ada class corvettes and 8 submarines afterwards we need more fast attack crafts like 6 more about 700-800 tonnes each not more frigates at least until we complete 4 ada class corvettes.

Nuclear submarine is more necessary, isn't it?

Well The Denmark Frigates Cost $400 Million per piece

we need to Replace the old frigates which are nearing decommissioning and also increase our numbers of the Frigates also Corvettes and Destroyers to tackle all the threats of Indian Navy

 

[BetterPakistan]

Well The Denmark Frigates Cost $400 Million per piece

we need to Replace the old frigates which are nearing decommissioning and also increase our numbers of the Frigates also Corvettes and Destroyers to tackle all the threats of Indian Navy

Earlier Pakistan navy went for like 8 used frigates from US which could be a good decision but I don't think it is worth it.

Our coastline is a bit more than 1000 kilometres, what we have so far is 10 frigates (5 type 21 due to retire), 8 submarines (2 due to retire & in these 5, 3 are mini-submarines), 17 patrol crafts, 14 fast attack crafts (2 under construction), 3 mine warfare which makes a total of 52.

We have signed a deal for 8 submarines which will increase our submarine strength to 14 because 2 agosta-70 will be replaced by it.

We will sign a deal for 4 ada class corvettes on the end of this month which I guess will join our navy before 2020-22.

We have signed a deal with Netherlands for a MPV/patrol boat.

5 frigates need to be replaced which is the main point nowadays. With my limited knowledge we can go for 6 type 054a frigate which will cost about $250 mn a ship means $1.5 bn for six ships and will weigh 4000 tonnes each while type 21 frigate weigh 3250 tonnes.

6 more fast attack crafts are also needed. FAC-55 could be a good option, it runs on max at 102 km/h

N-submarine is the real thing to consider.

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

takes total to $8.5-9.5 bn and we have to spend this much money from 2017-2028 (11 years).

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Earlier Pakistan navy went for like 8 used frigates from US which could be a good decision but I don't think it is worth it.

Our coastline is a bit more than 1000 kilometres, what we have so far is 10 frigates (5 type 21 due to retire), 8 submarines (2 due to retire & in these 5, 3 are mini-submarines), 17 patrol crafts, 14 fast attack crafts (2 under construction), 3 mine warfare which makes a total of 52.

We have signed a deal for 8 submarines which will increase our submarine strength to 14 because 2 agosta-70 will be replaced by it.

We will sign a deal for 4 ada class corvettes on the end of this month which I guess will join our navy before 2020-22.

We have signed a deal with Netherlands for a MPV/patrol boat.

5 frigates need to be replaced which is the main point nowadays. With my limited knowledge we can go for 6 type 054a frigate which will cost about $250 mn a ship means $1.5 bn for six ships and will weigh 4000 tonnes each while type 21 frigate weigh 3250 tonnes.

6 more fast attack crafts are also needed. FAC-55 could be a good option, it runs on max at 102 km/h

N-submarine is the real thing to consider.

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

takes total to $8.5-9.5 bn and we have to spend this much money from 2017-2028 (11 years).

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn (add 2 more)
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

Will also Add 3-4 Type 052D Frigate to Tackle Kolkata Class Indian Destroyers

Also with some Multi Mission Frigate these will come in cheap with displacement of 1500 Tn to back up Type 54's

 

[Azeem_Ahmed]

Strong force strong Pakistan and strong economy... Pak navy may be provided all that funds which can modernize to it... New technology and equipment need to be purchased so that a powerful and robust navy should available in the country...

 

[BetterPakistan]

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn (add 2 more)
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

Will also Add 3-4 Type 052D Frigate to Tackle Kolkata Class Indian Destroyers

Also with some Multi Mission Frigate these will come in cheap with displacement of 1500 Tn to back up Type 54's

Type 052d destroyer is a beast, i love it. 2 destroyers of this class will cost about $1.5 bn making the total to $10-11 bn.

1500 displacement could be corvette not frigates. type 056 corvette is a good option weighing 1500 tonne each. It speeds at top 25 knots/hr. In 2014 China was trying to sell this corvette to Argentina priced at $50 mn a ship. We can easily get 8 for $0.5 bn.

Jo marzi ho bhai lekin 5th gen fighter jet ka apna hi maza hai lol

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Type 052d destroyer is a beast, i love it. 2 destroyers of this class will cost about $1.5 bn making the total to $10-11 bn.

1500 displacement could be corvette not frigates. type 056 corvette is a good option weighing 1500 tonne each. It speeds at top 25 knots/hr. In 2014 China was trying to sell this corvette to Argentina priced at $50 mn a ship. We can easily get 8 for $0.5 bn.

Jo marzi ho bhai lekin 5th gen fighter jet ka apna hi maza hai lol

5th Generation to Airforce ko milay ga..

Also we need Heavy Platform Plane for Naval wing

 

[CHACHA"G"]

Earlier Pakistan navy went for like 8 used frigates from US which could be a good decision but I don't think it is worth it.

Our coastline is a bit more than 1000 kilometres, what we have so far is 10 frigates (5 type 21 due to retire), 8 submarines (2 due to retire & in these 5, 3 are mini-submarines), 17 patrol crafts, 14 fast attack crafts (2 under construction), 3 mine warfare which makes a total of 52.

We have signed a deal for 8 submarines which will increase our submarine strength to 14 because 2 agosta-70 will be replaced by it.

We will sign a deal for 4 ada class corvettes on the end of this month which I guess will join our navy before 2020-22.

We have signed a deal with Netherlands for a MPV/patrol boat.

5 frigates need to be replaced which is the main point nowadays. With my limited knowledge we can go for 6 type 054a frigate which will cost about $250 mn a ship means $1.5 bn for six ships and will weigh 4000 tonnes each while type 21 frigate weigh 3250 tonnes.

6 more fast attack crafts are also needed. FAC-55 could be a good option, it runs on max at 102 km/h

N-submarine is the real thing to consider.

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

takes total to $8.5-9.5 bn and we have to spend this much money from 2017-2028 (11 years).

4 ada class corvettes = $1 bn
8 submarines = $4-5 bn
6 type 054a frigates = $1.5 bn (add 2 more)
N submarine = $1.5
6 fast attack crafts = $0.5 bn (max)

Will also Add 3-4 Type 052D Frigate to Tackle Kolkata Class Indian Destroyers

Also with some Multi Mission Frigate these will come in cheap with displacement of 1500 Tn to back up Type 54's

For many people here both of you guys have "Wish list" , but the time line you gave and the ships you described are Much needed and this is all do able.
1500 tone ship is more likely FAC or very fast and small in seize covert , we can add that too.
The main thing is "Availability" and war planning , If we want our Navy strong and want to give them any chance against Indian Navy we need bigger and Better ships. It will take time and money but because of time it is doable .
People need to understand we don't have to pay 10 or 11 Billion $$$ in one year , this payment will be divided on 10 or may be more years , As @MastanKhan described it very well in 8 sub purchase .
With CPEC and new energy plants our economy will improve so we can give some extra to Navy each year , and don't forget my suggestion "Public Fund" for Navy where every one can pay his/her donations.

 

[BetterPakistan]

For many people here both of you guys have "Wish list" , but the time line you gave and the ships you described are Much needed and this is all do able.
1500 tone ship is more likely FAC or very fast and small in seize covert , we can add that too.
The main thing is "Availability" and war planning , If we want our Navy strong and want to give them any chance against Indian Navy we need bigger and Better ships. It will take time and money but because of time it is doable .
People need to understand we don't have to pay 10 or 11 Billion $$$ in one year , this payment will be divided on 10 or may be more years , As @MastanKhan described it very well in 8 sub purchase .
With CPEC and new energy plants our economy will improve so we can give some extra to Navy each year , and don't forget my suggestion "Public Fund" for Navy where every one can pay his/her donations.

Yeah, I have said that we can purchase all these ships in 11 years and payment would be made year on year which we can afford. If we can increase our defence budget by 10% every year than it is possible.

1500 tonne can be classified as a corvette, FAC are like 500-600 tonnes.

For tackling India we need mix tonnage warships like from big destroyers to fast attack crafts. I have seen indian navy ships and I feel we need to have the following warships till 2030.

2 Destroyers (type 052 destroyer)
12 Frigates (4 f-22p (already present), 4 type 054a, 1 alamgir class (already present), 3 more used like alamgir class)
12 Corvettes (4 ada class corvettes, 8 type 056 corvette)
15 Submarines (including 1 nuke, 3 mini (bigger than x-craft), 3 upgraded agosta b already present, 8 chinese one ordered)
30 Fast Attack Crafts/Patrol Boats (we already have 14 FAC and 6 patrol boats, 10 more needed)
3 Mine warfare

takes total ships to 74 and will make our powerful navy more powerful and I guess we need to increase active troop strength from 30,700 to 35,000

5th Generation to Airforce ko milay ga..

Also we need Heavy Platform Plane for Naval wing

Han to air force ki hi baat kr raha houn..

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

Indeed there should be a fund where we can donate for pak armed forces provided that accountability for that money is well established. I remember there was a tank fund in the past where people donated loose change and coins etc and army was able procure good number of good tanks