PAK-FA takes to the sky!

[DaRk WaVe]

Please name the ones with 0.5m2 RCS or lower - 4th gen or even 4++ gen planes else again please dont just POINT OUT WITHOUT ANY BACK UP!

I don't believe in theory of 0.5 m^2, its impossible for 5th gen to have 0.5 m^2 RCS

any ways here you go

RCS ​

The base radar formula used is (RCS1/RCS2)^0.25. So the F-16C reduced RCS is 1.2 m2, standard fighter is 5 m2. (1.2/5)^0.25 = 0.69. Therefore the F-16C can be detected at 69% of radar range as compared with a standard fighter.
B-52 Bomber 100 m2 bomber range x1

F-4, A-10 25 m2 bomber x 0.71, fighter x 1.5

B-1B Bomber 10 m2 bomber x 0.56, fighter x 1.19

Tornado 8 m2 fighter x 1.12

Generic fighter 5 m2 fighter range x 1

MiG-21 3 m2 fighter x 0.88

F-16C/18C w. reduced RCS 1.2 m2 fighter x 0.7

F-18E, Rafale 0.75 m2 fighter x 0.62

Eurofighter 0.25-0.75 m2 fighter x 0.47-0.62

Exocet, Harpoon missile 0.1 m2 fighter x 0.38

JSF (‘golf ball sized&#8217 0.005 m2 fighter x 0.18

F-117, B-2, F-22 0.0001 m2 fighter x 0.07

F-117, B-2 F-22 also given as 0.01-0.001 m2, ‘marble sized’ or fighter x 0.12-0.21

F-22 RCS requirement was 1/1000th the F-15. This has probably be exceeded by a large margin. Even if the F-15 RCS is a large 25 m2, the F-22 is 0.025 m2 worst case (fighter x 0.26).

As can be seen ‘stealthy’ aircraft aim to reduce opposition situation awareness by decreasing detection range.

Situation Awareness

click on link & scroll down & read under heading of RCS

Stealth is term used to describe to laymen. What is stealth? Do you think f22 is invisible to radar? Nope. Just the reflected signals so weak that for large distances radars neglect them. Only when very close, some calculable signals reach the radar. This is what LO means.

when i said Raptor is invisible lets leave this side

 

[paritosh]

There are huge debates on other forums on how much of the Engine compressor blades are hidden or showing through the Air-inlets.Would like you to tell us about it

dude...do you know about the usage of baffle protection in the air-intakes on this plane from any of the other forums?

 

[DaRk WaVe]

dude...do you know about the usage of baffle protection in the air-intakes on this plane from any of the other forums?

Please explain to this girl
would like to know
thanks

 

[saurabh]

Hi
i am a total novice when it when it comes to this ... but i thought id ask anywayz ....in the t-50 in the picture ...there is a height diff bettween the engine intakes and the main fuselage so if that difference is removed by increaseing the height of the fuselage on the lowerside... it will also have a flat belly like the f-22 ...im not good with photoshop so cant do it .... if some1 can pls do it .. i think it would be interesting to see that ...
if this question is foolish pls ignore ... but i would be really gla if any1 can answer this for me ..

I am not expert, but I will try. The gape between the fuselage is so hyped because it is a general belief that it will create corners, and this corners reflect radio signals back to radar. I am no expert, so I cant counter that. But the ones siting in sukhoi design office are. There may be three reasons for it not having a flat-belly.
1. The designers found no problem with that, they have managed low reflections with that design.
2. It wasn't aerodynamically, or due to some other reasons possible for them to make it flat belly.
3. Its just a prototype for first flight. Later on, there may be many changes.

 

[saurabh]

they have to make it stealth
low observability of an Air craft is what we see in late 4th gen air crafts

when i said Raptor is invisible lets leave this side

No you didn't say that. I just wanted to make clear to you that stealth just means very low observability. In fact low observability is the correct term.

 

[paritosh]

Please explain to this girl
would like to know
thanks

ohh I though i quoted some one else...
nevermind that...
the idea is to hide the turbine blades as much as possible as they are a big source of microwave reflection thereby giving a large RCS....so baffles are installed in the air-intakes to hide the rotating turbine blades from coming into view of the radar...

 

[saurabh]

ohh I though i quoted some one else...
nevermind that...
the idea is to hide the turbine blades as much as possible as they are a big source of microwave reflection thereby giving a large RCS....so baffles are installed in the air-intakes to hide the rotating turbine blades from coming into view of the radar...

Would be helpful if you could post a pic.

 

[Ruag]

Talking about propaganda this kid decides to take cover in worlds largest propaganda website the wikipeeedia and thinks he has got the facts. Do watch the videos and the British reporter is asking those saber pilots "the IAF has claimed to have shot you guys down before" and the pilots laughed and made fun of indians that they are pathological liars who will do anything just to satisfy their dirty indian ego with false claims.
tell you what... show me a single picture of IAF Mig-21 FL13 after pathok attack. and kid... i am only talking about 65 war not 71 where a 3rd generation fighter faced 2nd generation sabers and F-6s.

It seems that your English vocabulary is limited to "pathological liars".

And what wikipedia? There was no wikipedia source given. And look who is calling others "pathological liars".

Give me one neutral source which says that the PAF destroyed all IAF MiGs during Pathankot raids.

And why only talk about Sabers and F-6s? The MiG-21s shot down several F-104s in 1971.

Air Force History

And now don't claim that the MiG-21 was 3rd generation and the F-104 was 2nd generation. Read "Rolling thunder" By Ivan Rendall (ISBN: 9780684857800). He classifies F-104, MiG-21 and Mirage III in the same category. I can give numerous more sources because it seems people here are used to making up stories.

 

[Mahakaya]

I don't believe in theory of 0.5 m^2, its impossible for 5th gen to have 0.5 m^2 RCS

any ways here you go


Situation Awareness

click on link & scroll down & read under heading of RCS



when i said Raptor is invisible lets leave this side

Alright point taken - now we are talking - so also read the article in the link (get to right after the part you copied and pasted) - I am not sure how valid is that document but I will give you the benefit of the doubt. But will need to dig down more to get info on this the F-18 SE or the Typhoon or even the rafale.

 

[DaRk WaVe]

Alright point taken - now we are talking - so also read the article in the link (get to right after the part you copied and pasted) - I am not sure how valid is that document but I will give you the benefit of the doubt. But will need to dig down more to get info on this the F-18 SE or the Typhoon or even the rafale.

I really don't need any one's 'doubt benefit'...

as for Rafale the idea was to make not a true 5th Gen but a discreet fighter with ability to surpass enemy air defenses same is the idea about EF

here is some relevant info with some links

The Rafale EW suite, known as Spectra, is one of the most powerful systems installed on a fighter aircraft and is intimately associated with the unique approach to stealth and survivability designed into the Rafale. Dassault executives describe the Rafale as discreet rather than being stealthy in the sense of a F-22. To avoid detection, it combines avionics, tactics, and reduced radar reflectivity with some techniques that have not been directly revealed and are apparently unique.

The first element of discretion is that Spectra's receiver system and the FSO help detect and track targets without using radar. Spectra incorporates a radio-frequency (RF) detection system, a missile-approach warning sensor, and a laser-warning system and provides full 360-degrees coverage. The RF detection subsystem uses prominent square-section antennas, mounted on the lower corners of the engine inlets and in the rear of the fin-top pod, covering 120 degrees each. The receiver antennas use interferometric techniques to measure a signal's angle of arrival within less than 1 degree and are designed so that they do not have a large radar-cross-section (RCS) contribution.

Rafale, Dassault-Breguet

Powered by Google Docs

Stealth Warplanes - Google Books

PS: sorry for such wired inks

M-88 IR signature reduction

​

 

[marcos98]

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&sl=ru&tl=en&u=http://www.vesti.ru/videos%3Fvid%3D257560&rurl=translate.google.co.in&usg=ALkJrhhB5i4mXHWNxnNadY2EuJbObDs7XQ

NEXT FLIGHT- MONDAY
(paralay forum)

 

[hindustan]

Now it is clear, that in its airframe design the fighter is closer related to American F-23 prototype, than F-22 or JSF, but with bigger internal payload bay. However, it has unrepeatable impress of Sukhoi design house, clearly looking as a thoroughbred Su-linage. According to the most reliable estimations, T-50 has 10 internal and 2 additional external hardpoints on the wings (the 'mystery' triangle thickening under the wings). With this great payload capability and much space for the fuel T-50 can became a true military 'workhorse' of the future battlefield!

 

[Myth_buster_1]

So does the F-15 infact at around 25m2. The F-15SE is at around 1m2. So I am guessing the "smart skin" (if there is any) will definitely be able to get it down considerably or let me rephrase that "CUTTING DOWN ON RCS IS NOT IMMPOSSIBLE"

typical indian. stop being laughing stock of this forum... F-15 with a 25m2 RCS?

 

[Myth_buster_1]

1. A picture is worth 10,000 words but what if there is more to something then just a picture. ( The thing exists and can achieve its goals in more than one ways). Maybe you are so obsessed by downgrading other's achievements that your brain gets a seizure.

Look i am only giving you free lessons and you are welcome to disagree with be and live in your small narrow minded indian bubble. Can you simply agree or am i just going to much against your indian ego which can only be satisfied with fake claims? Those two huge @ss engines are so prominent to the nake eye the IRST will simply track it! And thats what the picture tells! on the other hand i am not even claiming that PAK-FA has cr@ppy avionics or radar because I do not know their specs or anything! Now do you understand!

2. I took a cheap shot at your signature and was hoping you would reply in a manner that you did. The good thing about existence of people like you is that people like you are the very reason why pakistan will never outshine India . The hatred (maybe your textbooks teach you that) in you acts as a deterence against logic. Have seen loads of your posts here that justify the same.

And i am very happy to know that such people exsist in india in large numbers because you are the guys who are going to end this outshine India honeymoon.
hatred in our textbook? kindly turn on your TV and tune it to any indian news channel... thats what you call hatred.
Btw you are not even contributing anything to the topic. so next time you come up with your upbringing street junk talk i am simply gonna ignore it.

 

[SSGPA1]

And it is Gyaan not Giyaan..Should have paid attention at school...Oh right...You must have been busy learning about Jihad....

Don't giv two sweet sh*ts how a word in hindi is spelled. Proudly learned about Jihad that it is compulsory when attacked.

Well what can I say..you are one omniscient one.As Dave's company's motto is "THERE IS NO OFF POSITION ON GENIUS SWITCH!!!!!Dude by abusing Indians you are not gonna get into Heaven for your fair share of virgins!!!!

sad my comments further impacted the state of your mind
I didn't abused Indians, read my post again. I think some Muslim in India has kicked your butt really hard therefore there is so much reference to Jihad

True very true..but F-22 is way way superior to JSF...Actually F-22 is an overkill.At the time of its launch there was not a single plane which can challange it,and the situation is not gonna change in the next 15 years..Gambit once posted the amount of maintenance required for a F-22.And the result is the most awesome plane ever..
These clients are opting for JSF because US congress has banned the sale of F-22 to any other country,Not even Israel which is as you pakistanis love to quote,lap adorement of US.

Once again..F-15 and F-16 analogy.F-15 was the Galactus,really awesome but expensive to maintain..so F-16 ,the silver surfer was created.F-22 cannot be sold to any other country due to Congress ban.Seriously start reading some good newspapers like New York Times or Washington Post.

There is a difference in reading and actually supporting the program. I ahve supported both of these projects a couple years ago while working for a mjor defence company so just shut your mouth because you and many like you read stuff and gladly claim to become champions!!

F-22 is great and JSF is greater.

Do you know how many platform USAF has?? or Ruskies have or for that PLAAF has????IF India is trying to do the same it is not efficient??Just because your country does not has different aircraft it becomes inefficient for other countries?Awesome reasoning.Gem of logical coherence.....

You are a complete a**! India is not a superpower like the countries which you have mentioned in your post. India is on its way to become a regional power only but even that is a loooong way!

My point has been throughout that India can spend the resources much better and get better result.

Junk???If this is junk then what is JF-17???Give respect where it is due.....

Once you have finished your daily dose of cow's gober then look at the specs of JF-17 and F-16 and see the similarities.

JF-17 gave PAF the desired result with less than $1 billion in total investment and PAK-FA couldn't give the desired result with billions of dollar in investment and delays so it is a junk at this stage.