PAF F-16s Beating The Typhoon

[Readerdefence]

Hi any learned member can comment on IAF and RAF exercise between su30 & t2 or t3 typhoon?
Thank you

 

[Ultima Thule]

Hi any learned member can comment on IAF and RAF exercise between su30 & t2 or t3 typhoon?
Thank you

don't bring troll in this thread @Readerdefence

 

[Windjammer]

Hi,

The Paf loves to SHOW-OFF in these type of exercises---they have always done that and keep doing that---.

The Paf has become a race course pony---.

@MastanKhan Sahib, holding your personal grudge, once again you are being very unfair.
Please enlighten us to where ever did PAF show off in relations to any exercise it was ever involved in.
As i said before, it seldom reveals what systems or equipment it's utilising in any exercise let alone the outcome, even the subject topic, albeit a decade old has never been revealed publicly by the PAF and has only been disclosed by third party.
The so called race course pony never made any song and dance when the Israeli commander made a point of visiting the Pakistani contingent during the Red Flag and acknowledge the professionalism and calibre of PAF. !!!

 

[Armchair]

@MastanKhan Sahib, holding your personal grudge, once again you are being very unfair.
Please enlighten us to where ever did show off in relations to any exercise it was ever involved in.
As i said before, it seldom reveals what systems or equipment it's utilising in any exercise let alone the outcome, even the subject topic, albeit a decade old has never been revealed publicly by the PAF and has only been disclosed by third party.
The so called race course pony never made any song and dance when the Israeli commander made a point of visiting the Pakistani contingent during the Red Flag and acknowledge the professionalism and calibre of PAF. !!!

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

 

[denel]

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

On the mark.... If IAF participant said something, it is taken to be all and encompassing; on the contrary it was just for the exercise only but nothing else. You have painted the rest of issues very well.

 

[Raider 21]

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

You address a particular group...not an entire organisation. Otherwise all Muslims are terrorists by that mentality....

 

[Armchair]

You address a particular group...not an entire organisation. Otherwise all Muslims are terrorists by that mentality....

That is a wrong metaphor. Islam is a religion. PAF is an institution. Institutional rot is not addressed by addressing a specific group. It is done by looking at the institutional factors that create those conditions. Your bringing up Islam and trying to connect it with terrorism is wildly inappropriate in this thread. Not to mention historically inaccurate. Reminds me of the adage, A drowning man clutches at straws.

 

[Raider 21]

That is a wrong metaphor. Islam is a religion. PAF is an institution. Institutional rot is not addressed by addressing a specific group. It is done by looking at the institutional factors that create those conditions. Your bringing up Islam and trying to connect it with terrorism is wildly inappropriate in this thread. Not to mention historically inaccurate. Reminds me of the adage, A drowning man clutches at straws.

I agree with you that I used a wrong example. I meant the generalisation term that goes on that's painted these days by a few bad apples....

Cheers !!!

 

[Trango Towers]

In a real fight, a EF will fly high and fast, having greater energy to increase the range of its BVR. It will then fire very long ranged Meteors, turn and scoot. F-16s with the AMRAAM would get the second shot rather than the first shot. They will also have fewer missiles comparatively.

And if you know this do you think PAF doesn't and won't devise tactics for that. Come on yaar

 

[Windjammer]

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

Yes just your 0.02.....which is not necessary correct but you have a right to your opinion.
But why make it sound as if you can read Mastan Khan sahib's mind.....i'm sure he is well capable of putting his own POV forward.

 

[Trango Towers]

I have no insider information, but a cursory look at PAF does tend to show it likes to boast about itself in a sophisticated manner. Which is waht Mastan Khan is talking about.

What Israel says or doesn't say seems to have a bigger emotional investment at PAF than warranted. That may be another issue. Rampant corruption, the most corrupt service among the three is another point. One point I was reading by Messiach was how they were focusing on ridiculous things like women fighter pilots, for what she described "as a man's job" and basically taking their eye off the ball regarding training and proficiency. A comment made after less than stellar performance of JF-17s against J-11s in the medium range engagements.

Another issues seems to be PAF tends to send its most qualified and best pilots for exercises abroad. Perhaps this is what Mastan Khan was specifically referring to.

A truly professional force would take serious remedial measures regarding corruption. For instance having a policy of officers who make purchasing decisions to never be allowed to settle abroad. Strict punishment for caught corruption cases. Not the lax laissez faire we have seen so far. That is not professionalism.

A truly professional force would NOT allow a group of PAF officers to delay and oppose the JF-17 on behalf of the US. A truly professional force would not break protocol and negotiate with Indian generals to keep out of a conflict. A truly professional force wouldn't keep mum while Karachi port was about to be attacked by missile boats.

A truly professional airforce would not allow a foreign country to bomb its territories for decades, killing women and children and attacking wedding parties. A truly professional airforce would not banter with and befriend such an enemy country while such attacks were taking place. Let alone allowing highest privileges to such airforce and their civilian guests.

No, that would be a colonial airforce that serves the interests still of the colonial order it was part of. Maybe something to ponder over... and these are but a handful of issues. 101 similar ones lie beneath.

I still remember PShamim being ashamed of what he and others like him had done. At least he had a conscience. Sadly, many PAF personnel today don't even have that. In their blind arrogance they instead get upset when someone like Mastan Khan points them out...

Just my 0.02

Regarding women fighter pilots a Messiach......one thing people fail to see is women physiology is that they are able to withstand much higher g loading than men. In a dog fight at high g loading that's crucial. I think women complain if you do and complain if you don't without thinking first. Also do you think PAF will put women on the front line if they are not capable?.
I think your post is so negative. If you want to fix society or a nation fix yourself and then your family then your extended family like brothers sister their kids uncles parents etc. I bet you can't. Yet here we are pointing fingers badly at those that have successfully defended Pakistan whilst we sleep with both eyes shut knowing full well when we need them they will be there.

 

[Raider 21]

Regarding women fighter pilots a Messiach......one thing people fail to see is women physiology is that they are able to withstand much higher g loading than men. In a dog fight at high g loading that's crucial. I think women complain if you do and complain if you don't without thinking first. Also do you think PAF will put women on the front line if they are not capable?.
I think your post is so negative. If you want to fix society or a nation fix yourself and then your family then your extended family like brothers sister their kids uncles parents etc. I bet you can't. Yet here we are pointing fingers badly at those that have successfully defended Pakistan whilst we sleep with both eyes shut knowing full well when we need them they will be there.

The jet is not smart enough to know if it is operated by a man or woman. Rules in this profession have been written in blood....meet the criteria and one will get a career in fast jet flying....regardless of male or female...

 

[Trango Towers]

The jet is not smart enough to know if it is operated by a man or woman. Rules in this profession have been written in blood....meet the criteria and one will get a career in fast jet flying....regardless of male or female...

Isn't that what I just said? Reread my post

 

[airmarshal]

View attachment 472874


View attachment 472875

The real opponent who lost in all three set-ups against the PAF F-16s.

View attachment 472876

The PAF Squadron Leader is wearing a JHMCS helmet which is compatible only with MLUed F-16 or block 52. Both have BVR capability. But the AFM snippet talks about WVR F-16s. So that means the picture of the pilot was taken after 2008.

Also in exercise mode, the adversaries dont demonstrate full capabilities of skill and the machine so the boasts about the success are not that realistic.

 

[Trango Towers]

The PAF Squadron Leader is wearing a JHMCS helmet which is compatible only with MLUed F-16 or block 52. Both have BVR capability. But the AFM snippet talks about WVR F-16s. So that means the picture of the pilot was taken after 2008.

Also in exercise mode, the adversaries dont demonstrate full capabilities of skill and the machine so the boasts about the success are not that realistic.

In exercise mode it's doenst matter who.wins