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Options for PAF After India Selects Rafale for MMRCA

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I think there will be no such thing as BVR, we are next door, so likely there will be a dogfight. How capable are your pilots? i don't know, but as far as Pakistani pilots are concerned, they are trained only for that... So in the end, there is the pilot factor.
 
In which case, you wouldn't need an army, would you? Just ask the Chinese to show up for you.

Why have a country even? Call it a province of China.

The fact is that as allies they are trustworthy as mutual benefits exist in making such exchanges. Pakistan for example would provide value to China if it operates J-10s and J-20s in the future.
 
Why have a country even? Call it a province of China.

The fact is that as allies they are trustworthy as mutual benefits exist in making such exchanges. Pakistan for example would provide value to China if it operates J-10s and J-20s in the future.

when was the last time china helped you actively by participating on the behalf of Pakistan ? didn't they recently rejected defence pact and gwadar port for strategic purposes ?
 
Bhai sahab bagal wali gali main thode hi rehte ho..... :D

@topic-
BVR , well wouldn't it be useful if we bring down your aircraft from our side of border if acc. to you we are so close.

AWACs is best thing pak can do right now .

we have awacs i.e erieye and ZDK-03. JF-17 Block 1 right now has a strong radar without the AESA. They can shoot your aircrafts down within borders anyways. That is why you will need to come in close to us due to these threats. Either you stay where you are, or we both come....
 
Chalo for argument sake one takes ur theory then what about now?????

Today 1st Feb 2012???????


Following is something posted by a pakistani member "Pfpilot"

I agree with the assessment. But Pakistan has an inventory of other weapons to drag the fight on to India's ruin if India engaged in such a misadventure.

I'm guessing India doesn't like that so much so thats why I won't panic and emphasize upon gradual improvement.
 
right.

Brazil may buy Rafael now :tup:

O bhai, India may still not buy Rafale. I think I was an early teen when I got these awesome Rafale posters from the sales team at the Dubai Airshow. Till date no one has bought it.
 
We should be asking you the same thing for JFT and F-16s right now. You have more aircrafts with different looks to counter them...

Is is supposed to be good or bad?
well i dont know the answer...
But is it better to hav one good platform and hav it in large numbers instead of having different aircrafts?
correct me if im wrong?
Can a pilot using su 30 perform them same in say mig 29?
 
Is is supposed to be good or bad?
well i dont know the answer...
But is it better to hav one good platform and hav it in large numbers instead of having different aircrafts?
correct me if im wrong?
Can a pilot using su 30 perform them same in say mig 29?

Well both are twin engine aircrafts, their size, hard points, payload, weapon carrying, IRST, and radar might be more or less the same...
You even upgraded your mig-29s, so what is the difference?
If you say that it has a specific role, then my question to you is, for a certain role, why would you need large quantities? I mean for you guys, Pakistan is weak, F-16s are in MLU, and JF-17s are in induction mode. Is there some kind of fear in India's mind?
 
Lets face the truth we have no cash to match with the rapid modernization of indian defence forces .... they are playing their cards right along with the money its the brain that needs to work... we had the luxury of US , France and other western nations for almost 50 years but we didnt took the advantage and never played our cards right ...also thanks to our economy and doomed democracy cum dictatorship ...and they got just 10 years of luxury to be the customer of west and they showed us how to play the cards rightly .....

We have no option other then to play around with fc-20 ...the only thing we can do is modifying the fc-20 to make it par with the selected aircraft with best options we have.... but the hindrance remains the same i.e money ....Jf-17 block 2 and 3 is still long way away may be the former one is nearer then anticipated but the later one seems to be long away


in my humble opinion dire french need for sale of rafale made deal favorable for India.

France needed sales desperately and India exploited it.

when seller needs its product to be sold at all costs, it doesn't have too much say in negotiations.

so India went for Rafale as french are ready for ToT ( partially i guess ) and its similarity with Mirage 2000.

and as some Chinese analysts have pointed out some of the technology on MRCA winner will find way in FGFA.
 
Guys Wake Up......

Dassault Rafale came with many strings one must not forget.

Rafale Engine is powered by Snecma the same company that is helping in Kaveri Engine.
French Scorpène class submarines builders DCNS with Help in ATV programs with MESMA system
French shipbuilder DCNS will help in IAC 1 and 2 with CATOBAR technology and steam catapult
Dassault will help with AESA radar for LCA


Not to forget French were awarded with Nuclear contracts
 
Chinese analysts is wrong, We are not immoral backstabers. French have trusted us, we will not backstabbed. There is no way that India will smuggle the technology to Russia or after receiving 18-50 Rafael it will break the agreement (Like China did with USSR, I read this fear raised by some Brits in daily telegraph).

India is known for keeping trade secrete. We had Nuclear submarine in 90s, we never release the USSR technology to French for there scorpion. We never release any information regarding MiG29 or Su30 to any western country.

So this so called Chinese analysts is wrong. Its true ppl look others the way they are..

i meant India may use Rafale components on FGFA with french permission.
 
I knew this since I joined this forum.

You people will never understand Pakistanis. We are smart. maybe corrupt, but great politicians...
Ever thought of a country other than Pakistan getting weapons from U.S, China, Russia, France, Turkey, etc...?
True. Chinese are Business opportunist. But we need knowledge and experience, that all. You may laugh looking at the situation now, but ever country starts off with getting dependent. JFT and K-8 projects allow us not only being dependent, but allows us to learn. If we were so dependent than maybe i could ask how on earth we made nuclear weapons in the first place starting from 1970s? I bet you, if your country had 180 million people in a small country, you wouldn't be as successful as we are. LOL, you couldnt even produce a single fast bowler out of a billion people but we did... In this population, we even produced a nobel piece prize winner, poets, musicians, youngest Microsoft certifiers on world list. How about you out of a billion people?
 
when was the last time china helped you actively by participating on the behalf of Pakistan ? didn't they recently rejected defence pact and gwadar port for strategic purposes ?

In the 2002 Standoff with India they rushed the delivery of parts for F-7 PGs and even supplied many of them. Suddenly 250 more F-7PGs in our inventory played a major role in India backing off of a fight back then.
 
For Pakistan.... best solution so kill all these corrupt politicians and Generals.... Call techno-crate govt and allow new technical faces (those who have expertise in Finance, Military, Business, Sports). Change the atmosphere of corruption hang all old Generals because of whom today's Pakistan is suffering.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Control Corruption... and buy ANYTHING! still after only 10% of TAX collection... your military and govt spending and running organizations.... when Pakistan tax collection close to 50 % at-least our forces will buy ANYTHING.... but before KILL-N-KICK Corrupt GENERALS and LEADERS!


Indian MMRCA project has been going on for a long time. Everyone in PAF and Ministry of Defence as well at the Joint Staff Hqrs in Islamabad must be aware that it will come sooner or later. So what is the big problem now?

PAF has been cash starved since its birth mainly because Pakistan has always had shortage of foreign exchange. One of the main reasons for Pakistan joining Cento, SEATO and all those treaties was to get military hardware on the cheap.

Pakistan foreign policy has been Indian centric since birth. This myopic view plus the misguided thinking that Pakistan is a fortress of Islam and we must interfere in places like Chechnya etc. is the real cause of our ills. Why do you think that US is providing Nuclear Technology to India and not to Pakistan?

Let us face it, there is a strong section of Pakistan society which sympathises with the Taliban and Al-Qaida and completely ignores dastardly attacks by the so called Islamic terrorists. Recently TTP captured and beheaded 15 Pak Army soldiers and even released a video showing this heinous act. Did anyone even care about it? On the other hand 24 Pak soldiers were killed at Salala by the US and the whole nation is up in arms. Both the act are equally abhorrent but treated totally differently by the national media and everyone else including the Army? Do we think that it is okay by Taliban to kill Pak soldiers because they are doing it in the name of Islam?

Such dichotomy in the national thinking is what the real problem is. Most of the Western world thinks that there is a real danger of Pak Nukes falling in the hands of Taliban or their sympathizers. Regretfully Imran Khan is among such politicians, he is fuming against US in every speech, but did he even condemned TTP for their butchery? Imran can possibly win next election; therefore fears of the West are genuine. Corrupt military and politicians simply make the matter worse that is all. Killing off all the corrupt politicians is not going to solve the problem. Even if we had the money, it is doubtful that the West would sell us the hardware that we want. Remember that Swedish Grippen couldn’t be sold to us because of US Engine.

Wars are fought and won with strong economy. Pakistan economy is a pigmy compared to India, so let us not try to ‘keep up with the Joneses’. In the foreseeable future Pak economy will not be strong enough to attack India and come out on top. Therefore all we need is a lean and mean PAF strong enough to make it too costly for Indian to attack Pakistan. Think PAF is on the right track towards achieving this objective.

I totally agree with your conclusions though. For the time being any funds that we can spare should go toward resolving the gas and electric load shedding problem as it is crippling Pak economy and resovling law and order situation; both are necessary for peace and prosperity.
 
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