Not Shinkansen ? India plans high-speed rail project with China

[Chinese-Dragon]

Trade deficit with China will be wiped off by 2018 or earlier, the mistakes of last 10 years will be rectified soon.

LOL you guys keep saying that, yet India's trade deficit to China grows larger and larger...

While we pile up trillions in currency reserves, more than double India's entire GDP in currency reserves alone.

 

[cnleio]

Those people in the picture won't be the passengers of HSR anyway, they are the Indian counterparts of Chinese poors who also can't access Chinese HSR service, that's why we need more trains for them rather than these toys.

LOL ... China CRH will help ur India even the poor Indian passengers can sit on comfortable chairs inside Made in China carriages ... once pay for the ticket they all r passengers not rich or poor on CRH.

 

[terranMarine]

@cnleio
but if all have a sit inside the train then where are the people?

 

[dray]

Why does India want ghost trains anyway? The experience of open air, insects crashing into one's mouth, under the scorching sun or the monsoon rain with thunder entering the ears like music is much more thrilling. This is it means to be alive living on the edge

India is a beautiful country, and one can experience all the colours and diversity of it only when one is travelling in non-AC compartments, not in AC coaches.

 

[Nova2]

Absolutely, these trains will have a top speed of 300 kmph, average speed will probably be below that, we already have trains running at 140 or 160 kmph and engines capable of running at 225 kmph. Apart from that we have our low-cost airlines, why do we need to spend a whooping $32 bn on a passenger train NOW when we have other far more important priorities!! Rather, we can spend the money on dedicated freight corridors, or upgrade our old lines in important routes to run our own trains at 225 kmph! @anant_s @gslv mk3 what do you think?

Indeed emphasis should be given on improving freight corridors not just the once from WDFC or EDFC but also on other routes,they need to improve last mile conectivity to major port which for now creates a lot of traffic because of less rail infra connecting those ports,cargo generates major revenue for IR and a lot has to be done than it's been done. Improving the speed of trains along the present routes is more financialy viable as it would cost 3-5cr/km to upgrade those tracks than 150cr/km that is required for an HSR. It's better to upgrade the tracks to 160kmph and later to 200,but looks like they wana do both these things at the same time.

And probably more than the plane fare....! ! !

Yep most probably more if not same,especially when Air Asia and others are having a war over fare.

 

[terranMarine]

India is a beautiful country, and one can experience all the colours and diversity of it only when one is travelling in non-AC compartments, not in AC coaches.

who needs compartments when you can just hang outside

 

[dray]

LOL ... China CRH will help ur India even the poor Indian passengers can sit on comfortable chairs inside Made in China carriages ... once pay for the ticket they all r passengers not rich or poor on CRH.

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And they can travel 'tension-free' in a Japanese train.

 

[cnleio]

@cnleio
but if all have a sit inside the train then where are the people?

That's a problem ... LOL ... but still inside CRH carriages. The better solution is to make special carriage without chairs with cheaper pirce to the poor ppl, this time it isn't possible to hang them outside a 200~300km/h high-speed train =).

 

[cnleio]

And they can travel 'tension-free' in a Japanese train.

If Shinkansen cheaper than CRH, or Japanese can provide more cheaper ticket than China train cost to Indian poor ppl ... then i trust u.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Like I said, if you could do it yourself, you would not ask China to do it for you.

$32 billion is a drop in the bucket compared to our $4 trillion in currency reserves. But India has serious budgetary problems, they can't even start the initial order of the Rafale, not even the initial order. They had to delay it, due to there being no money in the budget.

So? How is this related to high speed train? For someone who is trying to sell your product you really are an obnoxious salesman. Why should our expectations not be that you bow down before us for that cash? In any case this is a pointless debate. I think this will end up with the Japs coz their tech is mature and their companies are better managed. Your track record as salesmen is very bad-the trains you supplied to Pak collapsed. Bad Kitty!

 

[Guynextdoor2]

If Shinkansen cheaper than CRH, or Japanese can provide more cheaper ticket than China train cost to Indian poor ppl ... then i trust u.

I'm sorry if your trains break down the way the pak locos did then it's actually more expensive for us.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I'm sorry if your trains break down the way the pak locos did then it's actually more expensive for us.

Thanks for the $32 billion anyway.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Why are the passengers in the Chinese train pictures ALL smiling? I mean not in one picture from China do we see a frowning face. All are either looking straight ahead with a busy look or smiling like they are in heaven. And by all I mean all!!!

Secondly the 32 billion USD quote is coming from Chinese sources only. And from Indian sources that are themselves quoting the Chinese figures. In any case, the speed being reported is 300kmph. Now speeds of our older trains can sretch upto 220kmph anyway!

So for a gain of 70 to 80kmph why do we need such Chinese inputs? Especially at such costs! Instead of spending money on Chinese built HSR we can invest directly within our own country optimizing our own technology. That will give us much greater returns on investment, besides being a cost multiplier. We can use dedicateed freight corridoors, upgrade tracks to enable high speeds on our own Indian engines - which are incidentally one of the safest ones in the world. As for speed the newer ones are capable of reaching 225kmph.

The Japanese have quoted slightly higher costs and very conveniently (given the fact that we are baniya) we sent a team to China. So we are perhaps hoping the Japanese reduce their costs a little and we can go ahead with the Shinkansen.

I understand that eventually we will have to entirely shift to faster railways, but with much much lesser investment we ourselves can do that - with some Japanese orignal help. Given the close Indo-Japanese relations, I believe that won't be a major problem. Also when it comes to trust, quality and longevity, Japanese technology is hard to beat. Then there is an emotional bond between India and Japan that goes beyond economics.

Also we DON'T need a break-neck credit crunching growth. A sustainable growth is what we have always desired, goes fine for us. From the 225kmph we can, with a little more research (and upgrading tracks ), reach supersonic speeds. Maybe another 10 years for the research (max) and another 10 for implementation. The money stays home and we even get the chance to export our own latest goodies elsewhere.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

I don't think so, right now Indian engineering companies have ZERO experience to build a high-speed railway, if not India won't need China there to build this line. If the deal done, Chinese companies will come and hire local labors in India but main engineering still built by Chinese workers, coz this's a big railway project and China must make sure the good quality of CRH.

After that if Indian learn building experiences and enough techs, India can start ur high-speed railway project that's not Chinese business.

If India pay money or mineral exchange to China, of course Chinese will provide a good quality engineering project to the price, finish it on schedule and no any delay.

CRH it's a big project :
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High speed rail is not that much of a technical leap for us. It's a new field where we'll get training on the manifacturing side. The model will be that of Metro projects we're running (like with Bombardier) . We'll have a JV with BEML which will train engineers in China and jointly set up production facilities. Like Bombardier The Chinese engineers might be there for technical help until the full plant operations are established. The civil engineering will be entirely Indian from start to finish (majority of the 32 B will go there). In the end the production will have to move to 100% Indian like we did for Bombardier- even the head is an Indian. In any case this'll go to the Japs coz they're more mature in this.

'Made in India' Metro rolls out - Economic Times

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Instead of spending money on Chinese built HSR we can invest directly within our own country optimizing our own technology.

That will give us much greater returns on investment, besides being a cost multiplier.

That's what a clever country would do.