No control over operations of Army, ISI: govt

[jahangeer yousaf]

This, unfortunately is a case of wielding power without assuming the responsibility that comes with it. The civilian government is talking the flak for every problem faced by the country while not being in a position to execute any plans that they may have without it being subject to a veto. Forget genuine civilian issues like power supply, railways & so on (where budgetary constraints because of the share allocated to the military play a part)..even in military failures like the raid on the OBL compound, the military has deftly managed to put the civilian government in the dock rather than be held accountable for its failure ( both for supposedly not knowing of OBL's presence as well as being unable to stop the raid). You have a recipe for disaster & economic/governmental gridlock. A clear & defined centre of power must exist (whether civilian or military) for a country to have any chance of progress. This may be a convenient fig leaf for the Pakistani generals but it spells very bad news for the country as a whole. You are essentially blaming the civilian government (this or any other) for matters that are simply not under their control while those who actually hold the reigns of power have no accountability whatsoever.

you see we are very much attached to our army ...... and last decade of their rule in pakistan in musharaf's period army was treated like dogs in our country by a lay person ..... i mean they had very bad impact on a single person due to policies of musharaf towards america and afghanistan ......... but the time changed when musharaf left we as a nation were so demanding towards democracy and i think this nation should taste the 5 years of democracy with no electricity no water no gass ....... these are the gueniune issues which we cannot put aside ........ i being a lay person living in a village has nothing to do with damn war of terror ....... i need electricity to run my tubewell i need water to water my fields which are rare in pakistan in democracy ....... army is doing pretty good job ................. army should come into power after ppp completes its 5 years then i believe public will more appreciate and wellcome army otherwise it may happens as it is happening in egypt civil war .........

 

[Pioneerfirst]

This is a political statement and its reality too.
We have two poles of power in Pakistan Army and Political Govt.Pakistan is not the only country in the world e.g in USA pentagon has its own policies and are independent of White house.Obama said he will end the war but Pentagon over powered its decision over Obama.
Similarly Indian political Govt wanted to solve Siachin and Sircreek issues but Indian military Establishment did not agreed and the issues are still threre.

 

[Jango]

There should be a more alarming headline - "No control over government: People of Pakistan" or "Full control over Pakistan: United States".

Looking at the glass half full or half empty I am afraid.

 

[jagjitnatt]

Thank GOD our Govt does not has any control over ARMY AND ISI ......... otherwise this country has been doomed .......... army and ISI should remain like they are ..........

Oh really? If its Army and ISI that is running the country, then its the Army and ISI that needs to be credited for the mess Pakistan is in. Don't you think?

ISI and Army have been glorified in Pakistan beyond a point where they can be held accountable for anything. They are trusted like anything and enjoy complete freedom, which is evident from your comment

---------- Post added at 04:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:00 PM ----------

This is a political statement and its reality too.
We have two poles of power in Pakistan Army and Political Govt.Pakistan is not the only country in the world e.g in USA pentagon has its own policies and are independent of White house.Obama said he will end the war but Pentagon over powered its decision over Obama.
Similarly Indian political Govt wanted to solve Siachin and Sircreek issues but Indian military Establishment did not agreed and the issues are still threre.

Your points are not valid in a way that governments in other countries like India have the final say in every issue, not the army.

In Pakistan, Army does everything, in fact all moves of the govt. are carved by the army. Not only is the Army involved in military issues, but all also judicial, civil, political, economic, and social issues. That is too much nose poking, not found in US, India or even a communist country like China.

 

[Awesome]

Federal government should be questioned over this, that why have they raised this issue after 4 years? The people of Pakistan put you in charge and if you didn't conduct Rah-e-Rast, and Rah-e-Nijat... Then who did? Army? Whose authority? Their own? Why did you allow it? They didn't listen? Why didn't you speak up before?

 

[Splurgenxs]

Lets assume for one moment ,tht some how the autonomy of the defense forces is a good thing for Pakistan.
IS it not the defense forces, that brought about this institutional mess tht Pakistan is in today in the first place?

With such a majority of the countries economy in the hands of the defense forces , does anyone for even a moment believe that they would give up this power willingly?

Out of the pan into the fire ... so as they say, may definitely be something Pakistan may find itself in the near future.

 

[foxbat]

Thank GOD our Govt does not has any control over ARMY AND ISI ......... otherwise this country has been doomed .......... army and ISI should remain like they are ..........

Look at it this way.. No govt has ever had any tangible/long term control over army /ISI in Pakistan during 64 years of its existence. Do you think Pakistan is in a shape that was envisioned by its founding fathers.. If not then probably the fact Army and ISI are not controlled by the govt is not such a nice thing as you believe it to be

 

[jagjitnatt]

Federal government should be questioned over this, that why have they raised this issue after 4 years? The people of Pakistan put you in charge and if you didn't conduct Rah-e-Rast, and Rah-e-Nijat... Then who did? Army? Whose authority? Their own? Why did you allow it? They didn't listen? Why didn't you speak up before?

Because Army is simply too powerful to be blamed in a country as dangerous as Pakistan. A little accident here, a little bomb blast there and the people speaking about control over Army may be resting in peace. Pakistan is not a place where you blame the supreme authority

 

[Patriot]

I am happy to hear that - If we ever gave operation control of Armed Forces to these corrupt bastards they would turn it into Pakistani Police.

 

[ramu]

Thank GOD our Govt does not has any control over ARMY AND ISI ......... otherwise this country has been doomed .......... army and ISI should remain like they are ..........

I am of the opinion that the country is still doomed. The army or its leadership is not elected by the people and hence no accountability. Journalists are living in fear and some people in delusion are celebrating.

 

[Jungibaaz]

Oh really? If its Army and ISI that is running the country, then its the Army and ISI that needs to be credited for the mess Pakistan is in. Don't you think?

Hello JJ,

They run it as much as they can, which is not enough. No Army and intel services in any other country face situations and challenges that ours do, without them this country would be even worse off in the situation we've seen in the past few years.
For that they should be credited.

ISI and Army have been glorified in Pakistan beyond a point where they can be held accountable for anything. They are trusted like anything and enjoy complete freedom, which is evident from your comment

They are trusted, mostly because in the past they've intervened in politics, no saying whether that is a good or bad thing, but at this point Pakistanis feel that military govt would do a much better job than GoP.

Your points are not valid in a way that governments in other countries like India have the final say in every issue, not the army.

JJ, current GoP is far from democracy, we don't want Uncle Sam endorsed NRO democracy, we'd be better off the army in control. But obviously the best thing to do would be to wait till next elections, watch the death of PPP etc.

In Pakistan, Army does everything,

Indeed, mostly because the govt is incapable of doing so, or in some cases chooses not to.

in fact all moves of the govt. are carved by the army.

If we talk about today's GoP, I'd rather it be that way.
After a free and fair election, if the army still intervene as much, then we can say what they are doing is wrong, but for now, it's all justified.

Not only is the Army involved in military issues, but all also judicial, civil, political, economic, and social issues.

Now again, do I need to tell you how capable GoP is?
Not only are they unfit to run Pakistan, especially in current situation, but they are also unwilling to do anything but to serve their own agenda.

That is too much nose poking, not found in US, India or even a communist country like China.

NRO democracy? Are these nations new-born in terms of democracy? Do they have governments who were in all honesty unfairly elected? They are as much dictators as any Military ruler.

Now this time, we've seen that PA has not done what it has done in the past, which is a good sign, hopefully next elections will be a little more democratic and fair, or PA intervention/influence is not only likely, but it is also needed.

 

[ramu]

I am happy to hear that - If we ever gave operation control of Armed Forces to these corrupt bastards they would turn it into Pakistani Police.

Even India has corrupt politicians but what makes the current arrangement so special. In what way is Pakistan at an advantage with army and ISI unaccountable to anyone. I feel it is a sad state of affairs.

 

[notsuperstitious]

It was obvious when the govt tried to change the reporting structure of ISI and they had to change the decision within 24 hrs.

I do not know why Pakistanis do not see the fundamental issue in this state of affairs. Power with no accountability, no need to go to people for vote, coupled with ability to intimidate and spy on own people - hell thats a recipe for disater.

Of all these posters supporting an ''independent army'', I want to know how many are directly benefitting from this system. This type typically also suffer from anger issues LOL

 

[Awesome]

Because Army is simply too powerful to be blamed in a country as dangerous as Pakistan. A little accident here, a little bomb blast there and the people speaking about control over Army may be resting in peace. Pakistan is not a place where you blame the supreme authority

They just did, when the Supreme court questioned them... So obviously they are not afraid of anything other than saving their own behinds. This doesn't fly...

 

[Black Widow]

Surrender..