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New Horizon of Turkish Defence Industry: MİLDEN (National AIP Submarine) Project Officially Launched

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The National Submarine (MİLDEN) Project, which has been planned to be launched for a long time with the aim of equipping Turkish Naval Forces Command with submarine ships produced with national sources, has been officially launched.

According to the presentation made by Rear Admiral Mehmet SARI, Deputy General Director of Shipyards of the Ministry of National Defense, the first cadres were assigned and the first assignments were made within the scope of MİLDEN Project. Thus, the MİLDEN Project was officially launched.

It is estimated that the National Submarines, whose development activities have been started within the scope of the MİLDEN Project, will be taken into the inventory of the Navy Command by the 2030s.

The experiences obtained from the New Type Submarine Project (YTDP), which was signed between the Defense Industry Presidency (SSB) and the German TKMS Company on June 22, 2011 and aimed to produce 6 REIS Class Submarines at Gölcük Shipyard Command, are planned to be used in the MİLDEN Project.

The MİLDEN project is expected to be directed by the Design Project Office (DPO) of the Turkish Navy, as in the MİLGEM project.

Within the scope of the New Type Submarine Project, the first submarine that is currently under construction will be delivered to the Turkish Navy Command in 2022 and the last submarine will be delivered in 2027. According to the information provided by SavunmaSanayİST, TCG Piri Reis (S-330) submarine, which is the first ship produced within the scope of the New Type Submarine Project, will be pulled into the pool in November 2019. So in a way it will be launched.

Source : https://savunmasanayist.com/haberler/milden-projesi-resmen-baslatildi/ ( Turkish )
 
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PART 1 - Existing preparations

2017

milden.jpg

A digitally created rendering of Milden shown during the workshop. The end product may have a much different shape. Interesting to note that it has X type rudders a shrouded propeller. The thin line prodding form the aft of the submarine is like to house a towed array sonar or a towed counter measure. There is a provision for flank array sonar. The sail is streamlined and houses the forward diving planes.

Turkish Naval Forces organised a national Submarine Workshop on 15. and 16. June at Tuzla Naval Shipyard.

This invitation only workshop was attended by marine engineers both military and civilian, representatives of defense companies and scholars.

The aim was to create a viable road map for the National Submarine, to identify competencies and competences of the national companies and potential short comings, risks in design and production phases.

Turkish Navy wants to commission its first indigenous submarine in 2030. Commander of Turkish Naval Forces Admrail Bostanoğlu stated in his opening speech that Turkish Navy was overhauling its submarines in Gölcük Naval Yard for the last 53 years. He also mentioned that Turkey constructed 11 submarines in 35 years and the building of Type 214 submarines was proceeding.

For me the most interesting part of the speech when Admiral Bostanoğlu mentioned that Turkish Navy developed its own engineering solution to 5 major design faults of Type 214 submarines.

These solutions were verified by TKMS and incorporated into the design of Turkish Type 214’s. Therefore the Turkish submarines will have slightly different dimensions compared to the one’s already serving in Greek, Portuguese and South Korean navies.

Admiral Bostanoğlu indicated the following objectives where local work and innovations is needed:

Integrated sonar and fire control system
High resolution optronics systems
Periscope
LPI navigation radar
ECM system capable of detecting LPI radars
Enhanced COMING and SIGINT capabilities
Accurate inertial navigation system
EHF and SHF satellite communication system
Link 16/22 ability
AIP
High powered batteries
Long range land attack capable cruise missiles
Locally developed torpedoes and mines
Torpedo and mine countermeasures.

Milden is the Turkish abbreviation of MİL-li DEN-izaltı meaning National Submarine in English. It will be quite a buzz word for the next decade like Milgem.

It is not a secret that Turkey aims to develop and built its own submarines and reduce its dependency to foreign suppliers in critical areas. This workshop indicates that the local know-how and production abilities reached a critical mark where a local development is considered feasible.

source : https://turkishnavy.net/tag/milden/

2017

Two of the most important shipbuilding programmes of the Turkish Navy are the local construction of six TKMS Reis-class submarines (Type-214TN) and the indigenous development of a new class of submarine.

The latter is known as MiLDEN (Milli Denizaltı) and is an ambitious attempt of the Turkish defense industry not only to design and develop a new class of submarine, but to develop the suite of electronics, telecommunications, sensors, propulsion and weapon systems that will be integrated into the boat.

The MiLDEN development programme began in March 2012 under the auspices of ArMerKom, the Turkish Naval Research Center Command. The first phase of the programme, which lasted until 2015, included the feasibility study. The second phase – initiated in 2015 – will proceed until 2018 and includes the definition of the submarine’s technical and operational specifications.

During this period, the Turkish defense industry will develop the national integrated submarine management system, the national sonar, the national torpedo, and all related systems. In the following years (2017-2023), a Turkish company will try to develop a national Atmosphere Independent Power (AIP) system.

The third phase of MiLDEN includes a two-year initial design period (2023-2025), which will involve designing the hull and installation of the AIP system. This will be followed by a three-year detailed design period (2025-2028) to include the installation and integration of the systems mentioned earlier. The construction of the first submarine will start in 2028 and the goal is for it to be delivered to the Turkish Navy in 2033.

The Navy intends to incorporate as many Turkish defence companies into MiLDEN as possible.

panopoly_image_original_cd352e7cf9eccd68d5c34ef47cb98baf.jpg


Already many state and private owned defence contractors – as well as national research institutes – are working on the development and production of indigenous systems that will be installed in the six under-construction Reis-class (Type-214TN) submarines and will later be used for the construction of the MiLDEN submarines.

Aselsan will produce, install and integrate the ARES-2N ESM system into the Reis-class, along with the Alper LPI radar, an integrated communications system, an X-band satellite communication system and a thermal imaging camera for the Carl Zeiss Optronics periscopes.

Milsoft will develop the software for the Link-11/22 communication system, while Havelsan will integrate its SEDA system (Sonar integration and Control system) and TorAKS system (Torpedo fire control system, which is part of the SEDA system) with ISUS-90/72 Combat Management System (CMS) made by German company Atlas Elektronik. The consoles of the ISUS-90/72 CMS will be made by Turkey’s own Ayesas, and UK-based Ultra Electronics will work together with the Turkish company Koç Savuma Sistemleri to provide the torpedo countermeasures Sea Crypsis system.

The state owned research institute TUBITAK-MAM is set to develop the hydrophones, the vessel’s battery control system and the life support system of the new submarine. The propulsion system – a new generation AIP – will be developed by the Turkish company IdeaLab.

Turkish engineers are currently working on a compressed power generation system that uses compressed carbon dioxide. This new system is smaller and lighter compared to the existing technology and will allow the submarine to operate submerged for up to 90 days over a range of 15,000km.

Although this enterprising programme appears to be running smoothly at present, the biggest challenge for the Turkish defense industry will be the integration and effective performance of these many intricate systems.

https://www.defenceiq.com/naval-maritime-defence/articles/milden-turkeys-quest-to-build-a-national
 
.
PART 1 - Existing preparations

2017

milden.jpg

A digitally created rendering of Milden shown during the workshop. The end product may have a much different shape. Interesting to note that it has X type rudders a shrouded propeller. The thin line prodding form the aft of the submarine is like to house a towed array sonar or a towed counter measure. There is a provision for flank array sonar. The sail is streamlined and houses the forward diving planes.

Turkish Naval Forces organised a national Submarine Workshop on 15. and 16. June at Tuzla Naval Shipyard.

This invitation only workshop was attended by marine engineers both military and civilian, representatives of defense companies and scholars.

The aim was to create a viable road map for the National Submarine, to identify competencies and competences of the national companies and potential short comings, risks in design and production phases.

Turkish Navy wants to commission its first indigenous submarine in 2030. Commander of Turkish Naval Forces Admrail Bostanoğlu stated in his opening speech that Turkish Navy was overhauling its submarines in Gölcük Naval Yard for the last 53 years. He also mentioned that Turkey constructed 11 submarines in 35 years and the building of Type 214 submarines was proceeding.

For me the most interesting part of the speech when Admiral Bostanoğlu mentioned that Turkish Navy developed its own engineering solution to 5 major design faults of Type 214 submarines.

These solutions were verified by TKMS and incorporated into the design of Turkish Type 214’s. Therefore the Turkish submarines will have slightly different dimensions compared to the one’s already serving in Greek, Portuguese and South Korean navies.

Admiral Bostanoğlu indicated the following objectives where local work and innovations is needed:

Integrated sonar and fire control system
High resolution optronics systems
Periscope
LPI navigation radar
ECM system capable of detecting LPI radars
Enhanced COMING and SIGINT capabilities
Accurate inertial navigation system
EHF and SHF satellite communication system
Link 16/22 ability
AIP
High powered batteries
Long range land attack capable cruise missiles
Locally developed torpedoes and mines
Torpedo and mine countermeasures.

Milden is the Turkish abbreviation of MİL-li DEN-izaltı meaning National Submarine in English. It will be quite a buzz word for the next decade like Milgem.

It is not a secret that Turkey aims to develop and built its own submarines and reduce its dependency to foreign suppliers in critical areas. This workshop indicates that the local know-how and production abilities reached a critical mark where a local development is considered feasible.

source : https://turkishnavy.net/tag/milden/

2017

Two of the most important shipbuilding programmes of the Turkish Navy are the local construction of six TKMS Reis-class submarines (Type-214TN) and the indigenous development of a new class of submarine.

The latter is known as MiLDEN (Milli Denizaltı) and is an ambitious attempt of the Turkish defense industry not only to design and develop a new class of submarine, but to develop the suite of electronics, telecommunications, sensors, propulsion and weapon systems that will be integrated into the boat.

The MiLDEN development programme began in March 2012 under the auspices of ArMerKom, the Turkish Naval Research Center Command. The first phase of the programme, which lasted until 2015, included the feasibility study. The second phase – initiated in 2015 – will proceed until 2018 and includes the definition of the submarine’s technical and operational specifications.

During this period, the Turkish defense industry will develop the national integrated submarine management system, the national sonar, the national torpedo, and all related systems. In the following years (2017-2023), a Turkish company will try to develop a national Atmosphere Independent Power (AIP) system.

The third phase of MiLDEN includes a two-year initial design period (2023-2025), which will involve designing the hull and installation of the AIP system. This will be followed by a three-year detailed design period (2025-2028) to include the installation and integration of the systems mentioned earlier. The construction of the first submarine will start in 2028 and the goal is for it to be delivered to the Turkish Navy in 2033.

The Navy intends to incorporate as many Turkish defence companies into MiLDEN as possible.

panopoly_image_original_cd352e7cf9eccd68d5c34ef47cb98baf.jpg


Already many state and private owned defence contractors – as well as national research institutes – are working on the development and production of indigenous systems that will be installed in the six under-construction Reis-class (Type-214TN) submarines and will later be used for the construction of the MiLDEN submarines.

Aselsan will produce, install and integrate the ARES-2N ESM system into the Reis-class, along with the Alper LPI radar, an integrated communications system, an X-band satellite communication system and a thermal imaging camera for the Carl Zeiss Optronics periscopes.

Milsoft will develop the software for the Link-11/22 communication system, while Havelsan will integrate its SEDA system (Sonar integration and Control system) and TorAKS system (Torpedo fire control system, which is part of the SEDA system) with ISUS-90/72 Combat Management System (CMS) made by German company Atlas Elektronik. The consoles of the ISUS-90/72 CMS will be made by Turkey’s own Ayesas, and UK-based Ultra Electronics will work together with the Turkish company Koç Savuma Sistemleri to provide the torpedo countermeasures Sea Crypsis system.

The state owned research institute TUBITAK-MAM is set to develop the hydrophones, the vessel’s battery control system and the life support system of the new submarine. The propulsion system – a new generation AIP – will be developed by the Turkish company IdeaLab.

Turkish engineers are currently working on a compressed power generation system that uses compressed carbon dioxide. This new system is smaller and lighter compared to the existing technology and will allow the submarine to operate submerged for up to 90 days over a range of 15,000km.

Although this enterprising programme appears to be running smoothly at present, the biggest challenge for the Turkish defense industry will be the integration and effective performance of these many intricate systems.

https://www.defenceiq.com/naval-maritime-defence/articles/milden-turkeys-quest-to-build-a-national

Something that the PN would have it's eye on.
 
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The AIP system that Turkey developed and tested is the first such system and first AIP that can match with Nuclear warhear submarines.
1) 90 days submerged instead of German u214, 21 days submurged),
2) way more silent, as you know, nuclear reactors make huge noises and cannot go to shadow seas because of that, such as Mediterranean, Gulf...
3) way hard to detect by thermal cameras - nuclear engine need to through away hot water out which is used to cool the reactor down, which can be detected by thermal cameras, by UAVs and Poseidons.
4) it will be way smaller, more than 5 times smaller, which will decrease the radar detection distance
5) it will be way cheaper as you can purchase 10 and more per each nuclear powered submarine..
6) You can also hide it easily using island as your cover,
7) you cannot turn off nuclear reactor, but you can Turn off these machines and wait for your hunt to come which is very dangerous..
In normal fight they wait for 1-3 weeks for those diesel engined submarines to come up but, now, they will need to wait 90 days which is unacceptible..
 
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The AIP system that Turkey developed and tested is the first such system and first AIP that can match with Nuclear warhear submarines.
1) 90 days submerged instead of German u214, 21 days submurged),
2) way more silent, as you know, nuclear reactors make huge noises and cannot go to shadow seas because of that, such as Mediterranean, Gulf...
3) way hard to detect by thermal cameras - nuclear engine need to through away hot water out which is used to cool the reactor down, which can be detected by thermal cameras, by UAVs and Poseidons.
4) it will be way smaller, more than 5 times smaller, which will decrease the radar detection distance
5) it will be way cheaper as you can purchase 10 and more per each nuclear powered submarine..
6) You can also hide it easily using island as your cover,
7) you cannot turn off nuclear reactor, but you can Turn off these machines and wait for your hunt to come which is very dangerous..
In normal fight they wait for 1-3 weeks for those diesel engined submarines to come up but, now, they will need to wait 90 days which is unacceptible..
Its not about nuclear vs non nuclear at this subject and for your information, the most silent submarine is USN's latest nuclear submarine, even at high speeds and while not idling.
And there are more and newer technologies for nuclear powered submarines which you can extendly read on web, they nowadays have very low rates to ensure silence , which you mentioned by turning engine off.
And lastly, sound is the most primitive way of detection, come on its 21st century already. Wake and magnetic detection is the popular one. Acoustic detection is mostly for situational awareness.

And turkish aip is still a lab rat, and we can only do wishful thinking to consider it on field, currently. That technology has its own drawbacks which that company or someone else has 10 years to resolve.
 
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Its not about nuclear vs non nuclear at this subject and for your information, the most silent submarine is USN's latest nuclear submarine, even at high speeds and while not idling.
And there are more and newer technologies for nuclear powered submarines which you can extendly read on web, they nowadays have very low rates to ensure silence , which you mentioned by turning engine off.
And lastly, sound is the most primitive way of detection, come on its 21st century already. Wake and magnetic detection is the popular one. Acoustic detection is mostly for situational awareness.

And turkish aip is still a lab rat, and we can only do wishful thinking to consider it on field, currently. That technology has its own drawbacks which that company or someone else has 10 years to resolve.
You are wrong about these, i know what i am talking about...
You can go to deep ocean and make it harder for others to find you, but you cannot do it in shallow waters, as those sounds and vibration will come back from the bottom of the sea...
Same about cooling system, with nw thermal cameras, it will also be easy to detect them.
Bad side is you cannot have ICBM in small submarines which is a must for nuclear capable countries for second strike option..
 
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Something that the PN would have it's eye on.
As far as the Turkish defense gadgets are concerned Pak’s eyes = hands....

Any detail report about this development ?
Submarines are supposed to be “submerged” (from any details whatsoever), unless it’s a Scorpion or other subs IN operates....

Turkey never cease to amaze me with its defense production
:smitten::smitten:

Turkey never cease to amaze me with its defense production
:smitten::smitten:
And, so does Pak as far as countering the Indian “wet dreams” are concerned....
 
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