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Nawaz Sharif first ever who visited India but totally ignored Kashmiri Leadership

as stated he decided not to think any thing started from the word K?
Not only that but water issue as well.

When spineless rented Karzai was spilling venom against Pakistan, ganja was busy meeting marasis & rest you all know he ignore Kashmir & water issue. This is the reason why this bastard & his jabroni party are national security threat.
 
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There is also a need to abrogate indus water treaty. We should only release on per capita need basis.. Eg. couple of handful litres of water per person in pakistan ought to be the new rule !
 
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Great. And we see them becoming less and less relevant each passing year.

thats just what you'll like to tell yourselves... I dont blame you baniyas for resorting to mental masturbation, to forget your sins against an entire people

they'll never be irrelevant and Kashmir will always by and large reject india



Yes. PA must be limited at all costs to its constitutional role. It can not keep usurping the executive's power as it has in the past.

it doesnt need to....the entire nation supports the military and the military isnt some Godlike figure.....it only usurped the exec in the past when the exec held the Constittion in contempt and was failing to deliver. You're probably one of those bleeding hearts who think in Egypt it was a coup too.

PA is a far more professional army than yours - which doubles up as occupiers of foreign land and enforcing draconian laws which go against endian constitution and its so-called "democratic" values




Changes are afoot. You will not see a coup again, and give it some time, PA's threat/influence in the GoP will also start to vane.

sure if the civilians behave themselves and not muck around and leave the country in a compromised position...maybe the baldie learned his lesson from 1999

on national security matters and on policies attributed especially towards the hostile eastern sector - you can be damn right PA will call the shots and that will continue (obviously)


Actually it does not. All the surrounding peaks are held by India which can immediately target 5353.

you'd have zero chance of succeeding unless you brought the air force into it.....if anything we will be in a position to also fully control tiger hill. Me personally I speak as a civilian when I say I have always vocally supported Pakistan devoting more TANGIBLE resources to the freedom fighters. Obama govt. is weak and looks confused as ever; under his govt. arms are being proliferated all over the world for half-assed causes. Kashmir is a genuine cause.

Arms or no arms, logistical/ground intel support or not - Kashmiris will resist regardless. It shows symbolically every indian independence day when black flags are raised

Secondly, India is already building a second road, tunneling under a mountain to provide all weather connectivity to that region
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what difference does that make when any line of communication can just be bombed and rendered useless? How familiar are you with occupied Kashmir?

All this basically means that 5353 has no military value. In the future use of 5353 as a vantage point will also cease as India will shift its logistics from the currently single road of that region which is also seasonal to a second all weather road which is under construction which has a good portion tunneled.

It holds value. There's a reason why the indians tried getting it back (but failed)


There were those that bought Pakistan's humanitarian line and mujahid story initially in those days. Fortunately for us as those claims fell through, so did Pakistan's credibility in the world.
And it has been a downhill ride ever since for Pakistan.

no its actually been worse for india as of late - as world is learning more about your caste system and the character of a good chunk of indians who turn the other way as indian women get raped in hoardes and thrown off buses, mutilated etc; indias image took a worse beating than Pakistans did in the eyes of the "international audience" (in 2011).

things have been downhill from Pakistan but we suffered 5 years of zardari. Quite frankly with him in power there was less to lose. Now with him crossed out and with Karzai (your and americas lap dog) time coming up -- things will certainly be getting interesting

on credibility and all - we dont need hindustani like you to be yapping about it.....you've failed to stop arms deals to Pakistan, you've failed to isolate Pakistan diplomatically, despite the frantic efforts of your lobbyists across the globe
 
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thats just what you'll like to tell yourselves... I dont blame you baniyas for resorting to mental masturbation, to forget your sins against an entire people

they'll never be irrelevant and Kashmir will always by and large reject india





it doesnt need to....the entire nation supports the military and the military isnt some Godlike figure.....it only usurped the exec in the past when the exec held the Constittion in contempt and was failing to deliver. You're probably one of those bleeding hearts who think in Egypt it was a coup too.

PA is a far more professional army than yours - which doubles up as occupiers of foreign land and enforcing draconian laws which go against ****** constitution and its so-called "democratic" values

sure if the civilians behave themselves and not muck around and leave the country in a compromised position...maybe the baldie learned his lesson from 1999

on national security matters and on policies attributed especially towards the hostile eastern sector - you can be damn right PA will call the shots and that will continue (obviously)

you'd have zero chance of succeeding unless you brought the air force into it.....if anything we will be in a position to also fully control tiger hill. Me personally I speak as a civilian when I say I have always vocally supported Pakistan devoting more TANGIBLE resources to the freedom fighters. Obama govt. is weak and looks confused as ever; under his govt. arms are being proliferated all over the world for half-assed causes. Kashmir is a genuine cause.

Arms or no arms, logistical/ground intel support or not - Kashmiris will resist regardless. It shows symbolically every indian independence day when black flags are raised

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what difference does that make when any line of communication can just be bombed and rendered useless? How familiar are you with occupied Kashmir?

It holds value. There's a reason why the indians tried getting it back (but failed)
no its actually been worse for india as of late - as world is learning more about your caste system and the character of a good chunk of indians who turn the other way as indian women get raped in hoardes and thrown off buses, mutilated etc; indias image took a worse beating than Pakistans did in the eyes of the "international audience" (in 2011).

things have been downhill from Pakistan but we suffered 5 years of zardari. Quite frankly with him in power there was less to lose. Now with him crossed out and with Karzai (your and americas lap dog) time coming up -- things will certainly be getting interesting

on credibility and all - we dont need hindustani like you to be yapping about it.....you've failed to stop arms deals to Pakistan, you've failed to isolate Pakistan diplomatically, despite the frantic efforts of your lobbyists across the globe
If you are blind to your own country's credibility in the gutters in the International world, then I cant help you see it.
Sure, its India whose credibility is bad. Take heart from such lines. They are the only hope that Pakistani's such as yourselves can have.

Secondly, no, Pakistan can not take any peak in Kargil or Kashmir. They are now manned and watched. And no, Pakistan tried to bomb the road NH1 and failed even to choke supplies to Siachen on the one road that was visible from 5353. The second road being built is not even close there. Pakistan will as usual fail in its attempt to block traffic. Odds are Pakistan will be hard pressed in defending its own territory instead of attempting Indian land.

And as much as you cringe about it, PA will never again conduct a coup. Every one knows about the professionalism of an Army that conducts war without informing its own Prime Minister, then conducts a coup, makes its Generals a dictator.

Regardless of what happens, the politicians of Pakistan are aware of the praetorian guard that PA has become, and no one wants a coup - including the Pakistani public. So PA's influence has decidedly become less in the last 5 years. Give it another decade and any last vestiges of their extra-constitutional power will be stripped away.
 
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sir,what i don't understad,why Pakistanis r always against there govt.....ok politicians r corrupt,,,,but fact is power corrupts,,,why r u guys always(literally),against d democratically elected govt...

greetings and respect you you my dear
congrats to your 15th PM election

we dont have democracy yet, what we have is rackets and cartels, feudal and industrial families that have stranglehold on all power echelons of the state, they dont even have democracy in their party structure.

a dear fellow Indian advises me that people have spoken and we must accept it, but fact is we have cases of over 137% turn out. even Western Europe and India that are two prime examples of democracy have not been able to achieve that.

we have elected ministers who were loosing so badly that they would have had their security payment confiscated, yet they came out victorious suddenly after midnight when a general directives were sent out to ensure that PMLn has massive majority.

my dear
do you see, whenever a "democratically elected " is kicked out by either the army or by the president, ... the people on the streets celebrate with sweets and dances. thats pretty much shows how much they had their hand in selecting the party to govern them.

these political mafias dont even allow the grass root democracy like local bodies elections because they fear that a common citizen will take away their power. they have put laws against any dissent , floor closing or talking against the party leader or policy.. our political parties are far more dictatorial and totalitarians than the military dictators who dont pass their throne to their sons.

PTI was a hope but is a tragedy that in order to make itself relevant, it had to go to some figures that were against its original idea, the results of 2013 did show it as a serious contender and a third force but top slot remained with the parties that wont allow the democracy in this country in its true classical spirit.

we are no different to Indians, we want the democracy, after all we got our independence on the power of vote not through guns did we? we tried to set ourselves free democratically in 2013 we failed we have the same result of musical chair between 2 members of political cartel.
military will avoid stepping in for the "sake of constitution" and wont give these cartel members the sympathy vote again. it will be common people who will throw them out like it happened in Poland some time ago and in Egypt recently.
 
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greetings and respect you you my dear
congrats to your 15th PM election

we dont have democracy yet, what we have is rackets and cartels, feudal and industrial families that have stranglehold on all power echelons of the state, they dont even have democracy in their party structure.

a dear fellow Indian advises me that people have spoken and we must accept it, but fact is we have cases of over 137% turn out. even Western Europe and India that are two prime examples of democracy have not been able to achieve that.

we have elected ministers who were loosing so badly that they would have had their security payment confiscated, yet they came out victorious suddenly after midnight when a general directives were sent out to ensure that PMLn has massive majority.

my dear
do you see, whenever a "democratically elected " is kicked out by either the army or by the president, ... the people on the streets celebrate with sweets and dances. thats pretty much shows how much they had their hand in selecting the party to govern them.

these political mafias dont even allow the grass root democracy like local bodies elections because they fear that a common citizen will take away their power. they have put laws against any dissent , floor closing or talking against the party leader or policy.. our political parties are far more dictatorial and totalitarians than the military dictators who dont pass their throne to their sons.

PTI was a hope but is a tragedy that in order to make itself relevant, it had to go to some figures that were against its original idea, the results of 2013 did show it as a serious contender and a third force but top slot remained with the parties that wont allow the democracy in this country in its true classical spirit.

we are no different to Indians, we want the democracy, after all we got our independence on the power of vote not through guns did we? we tried to set ourselves free democratically in 2013 we failed we have the same result of musical chair between 2 members of political cartel.
military will avoid stepping in for the "sake of constitution" and wont give these cartel members the sympathy vote again. it will be common people who will throw them out like it happened in Poland some time ago and in Egypt recently.
sir,again u blamed everything on the "corrupt political parties",,,,its the easiest thing to do....these leaders r all product of Pakistani society....in democracy, u get what u deserve.
democracy,in third world countries,like ours needs time to mature.
or do u think,Indian democracy is all rainbow n sunshine...

n the point u made about rigging,,,,that happens(yaha bhi hota hai),,,i am sure there r institutions(like EC) n laws which can,if they have the will,,put a cap on them...
i don't know about d political situation of Pakistan.....
but when common man loses faith on democratically elected govt. N democracy itself,,it generally means sh#t is about to hit the fan...
 
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sir,again u blamed everything on the "corrupt political parties",,,,its the easiest thing to do....these leaders r all product of Pakistani society....in democracy, u get what u deserve..
you summed it up right
 
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my dear
do you see, whenever a "democratically elected " is kicked out by either the army or by the president, ... the people on the streets celebrate with sweets and dances. thats pretty much shows how much they had their hand in selecting the party to govern them.

Of course, to be fair, it should be noted that these are the same people who also celebrate with sweets and dances when the imposed fauji dictatorships collapse too and are kicked out in ignominy.
 
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Of course, to be fair, it should be noted that these are the same people who also celebrate with sweets and dances when the imposed fauji dictatorships collapse too and are kicked out in ignominy.
true that.
I recall Mushi's announcement of resignation and PMLn guys shooting in the air. as you have seen
my Indian friend is surprised why we Pakistanis dont like democracy.

dislike for military dictatorship is easily understandable of course.
 
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So many people here with overactive imaginations. How would Nawaz Sharif meet anyone in India....without having the "understanding" of the Indian government, now led by Modi? Every previous meeting with the Hurriyat in India has happened because the Indian government allowed that meeting to take place. Nobody.....that means nobody gets to meet a Pakistani leader within India if the Indian government has definite objections to it.

Had Nawaz sharif asked for the meeting, it would have been seen as a provocative act especially when he is not on an official visit. "Experts" on forums are entitled to eat their "Khwabi Pulao " but leaders have to make do with what is actually on the menu.
 
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true that.
I recall Mushi's announcement of resignation and PMLn guys shooting in the air. as you have seen
my Indian friend is surprised why we Pakistanis dont like democracy.

dislike for military dictatorship is easily understandable of course.

But what does it say about the nation itself and just how fickle and short on memory and principles it is? Of course that is why we have the government we deserve - equally fickle and short on principles.
 
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But what does it say about the nation itself and just how fickle and short on memory and principles it is? Of course that is why we have the government we deserve - equally fickle and short on principles.
and short on morality and value for life too
where we cant even mourn the murder of a doctor from a persecuted community who left USA and came to Pakistan.
 
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