NATO copter downed; Navy SEALs among the 30 U.S. dead

[President Camacho]

This is what I said, we have to believe that is being told. No proof, just words of mouth so far.

You seem to desperately want to believe that the Americans are lying, esp about the OBL raid.

Okay - for a moment let us not believe them, and let us give in to the piece of history that you desire: -

"The Seals that died in the Chinook yesterday were the same that killed OBL, and were deliberately killed by their own government to hide the truth".

There you go...

Q: Now what are you going do with it? Or, for that matter, what could the Pakistani government ever do with it?

A: Absolutely nothing.

Conclusion: Better believe what sounds most reasonable and sane, and not risk appearing low on sanity.

 

[S.M.R]

You seem to desperately want to believe that the Americans are lying, esp about the OBL raid.

Okay - for a moment let us not believe them, and let us give in to the piece of history that you desire: -

"The Seals that died in the Chinook yesterday were the same that killed OBL, and were deliberately killed by their own government to hide the truth".

There you go...

Q: Now what are you going do with it? Or, for that matter, what could the Pakistani government ever do with it?

A: Absolutely nothing.

Conclusion: Better believe what sounds most reasonable and sane, and not risk appearing low on sanity.

It has nothing to with Pakistan's Govt. and they really don't care what do others think about that. These type of stories are part of great game that is to be achieved by the main players. For the purpose they need lives of few of its own people. So they need to justify their own people, that whatever they are doing is 'right' and to protect them.

They know that the tool of labeling 'Conspiracy Theorist' is always there and will be used as and when required.

 

[gambit]

The propaganda machine in the West, against the PA and ISI, has replicated similar sentiment in the case of Americans against the PA/ISI ....

You can't really complain about 'outlandish and illogical anti-US Establishment sentiment in the Muslim world', when 'outlandish and anti-Pakistan Establishment sentiment' permeates American society.

That was not a complaint but an expectation. There are a lot of muslims who believe that Jews consume human blood in some religious rituals. I do not see similar in the quite liberal American press about Pakistan. What I am saying is that Americans -- at least from my perspective -- have gotten quite used to hearing about these things from the muslim world. We are no longer surprised.

 

[Kashmiri Nationalist]

That was not a complaint but an expectation. There are a lot of muslims who believe that Jews consume human blood in some religious rituals. I do not see similar in the quite liberal American press about Pakistan. What I am saying is that Americans -- at least from my perspective -- have gotten quite used to hearing about these things from the muslim world. We are no longer surprised.

Never heard of anything like that; also, what is a "lot of", if you're talking into the good few millions, then I'd agree, but if it's only a few thousand, you can hardly compare it to the Amerca's sentiment of Pakistan.

 

[Devil Soul]

SEALs killed in Afghan crash on rescue mission
By KIMBERLY DOZIER - Associated Press,RAHIM FAIEZ - Associated Press | AP – 1 hr 53 mins ago
KABUL, Afghanistan (AP) — The U.S. Navy SEALs and other troops whose helicopter was shot down in eastern Afghanistan had rushed to the mountainous area to help a U.S. Army Ranger unit that was under fire from insurgents, two U.S. officials said Sunday.
The rescue team had completed the mission, subduing the attackers who had the Rangers pinned down, and were departing in their Chinook helicopter when the aircraft was apparently hit, one of the officials said.
Thirty Americans and 8 Afghans were killed in the crash, making it the deadliest single loss for U.S. forces in the decade-long war in Afghanistan. The Rangers, special operations forces who work regularly with the SEALs, afterward secured the crash site in the Tangi Joy Zarin area of Wardak province, about 60 miles (97 kilometers) southwest of Kabul, the other official said.
Both officials spoke on condition of anonymity to describe the event, as the investigation is still ongoing. The SEAL mission was first reported by CNN.
On Sunday, NATO began an operation to recover the remains of the large transport helicopter, while Afghan and American forces battled insurgents in the region of the crash. The clashes Sunday did not appear to involve the troops around the crash site.
"There have been a small number of limited engagements in the same district as yesterday's helicopter crash, however those clashes have not been in the direct vicinity of the crash site," NATO said in a statement. "As of now, we have no reporting to indicate any coalition casualties resulting from these engagements."

Wardak provincial spokesman Shahidullah Shahid confirmed the helicopter recovery mission was under way and said there were reports of Taliban casualties overnight.
"There is a joint operation going on by Afghan and NATO forces. A clearing operation is ongoing in the district and there are reports of casualties among insurgents," Shahid said. "The area is still surrounded by American forces."
Elsewhere in Afghanistan, NATO said insurgents killed four alliance service members in two separate attacks in the east and the south. It did not provide their nationalities or any other details.
The deaths bring to 369 the number of coalition troops killed this year in Afghanistan and 46 this month.
The downing of the helicopter Saturday was heavy setback for the U.S.-led coalition as it begins to draw down thousands of combat troops fighting what has become an increasingly costly and unpopular war.
Of the 30 Americans killed, there were 22 Navy SEALs, three Air Force combat controllers and a dog handler, his dog and four crew members, a current U.S. official and a former U.S. official said on condition of anonymity because military officials were still notifying the families of the dead.
Most of the SEALs belonged to the same elite unit that killed Osama bin Laden, although they were not the same people who participated in the May raid into Pakistan that killed the al-Qaida leader. The downing was a stinging blow to the lauded, tight-knit SEAL Team 6, months after its crowning achievement.

 

[MM_Haider]

You seem to desperately want to believe that the Americans are lying, esp about the OBL raid.

Okay - for a moment let us not believe them, and let us give in to the piece of history that you desire: -

"The Seals that died in the Chinook yesterday were the same that killed OBL, and were deliberately killed by their own government to hide the truth".

There you go...

Q: Now what are you going do with it? Or, for that matter, what could the Pakistani government ever do with it?

A: Absolutely nothing.

Conclusion: Better believe what sounds most reasonable and sane, and not risk appearing low on sanity.

looks like Mr. Chankia is speaking from your within.. lolzz

 

[Irfan Baloch]

I fear that this incident might be used by the American “kill teams” and CIA drone operators to commit those “isolated” incidents yet again that have resulted in deliberate killing of civilians and even severing their body parts as trophies, while the likes of Fox News and NYT will bombard the senses of the people with the stories of this Taliban ”atrocity” , the troops in Afghanistan will use this moment as a free pass to commit murder as a revenge for their downed comrades, knowing every well that the US media will mute any voice of protest from the human rights organisations or usual Karzai babbling after the NATO strikes on civilians.

It pains me to see that the US military command and the administration is so generous in condemning the likes of Gadafi and Bashar Al Asad for their human rights violations and targeted killing of civilians but when its own troops are found again and again since the invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq to this day committing murder & celebrating it openly with pictures and videos of themselves killing Iraqis and Afghans and I am not even talking about collateral damage (through artillery or air strikes but targeted & deliberate killing of civilians.

While the decent Americans gasp with disbelief and voice their “concern” over such incidents but when American forces suffer any casualties in double figures such sentiments are harshly muted out by the NeoCons and their media outlets.

I wont be surprised if very soon we don’t see yet another revenge attack by the “rouge” soldiers which I think work under the instructions and approval of the high command because there is a pattern and consistency suggesting some policy that includes killing civilians because might is right and no other nation in the world dares to question the American Empire.

Looks like the Taliban responded in kind to the Americans, because on one hand Americans are going through different channels opening a dialog with the Taliban to ensure stability and some workable solution after their departure but on the other hand their covert operations by the military and CIA are intensified to kill as many Taliban as they can so as to have a weaker and subdued opponents then the parlays reach the final stage.

I am sure that the stories that have come out are as they say, tip of the iceberg, there might be unexplained mass graves found later on which might tell stories of the perpetrators, the truth eventually comes out.

Lastly , to be I will like to pay respect to the dead soldiers, they died for the cause of their country and the oath they took and they believed in what they were doing in that part of the word was right. And I wish that their deaths are not marred by the actions of their comrades that lack professionalism and look more like rouges and undisciplined militia rather than a disciplined army.

 

[pak-marine]

taliban hand made kitchen launcher....

haha ... good one dude

 

[Donatello]

Anyway, The SEALs were brave men who died fighting for Israel.

 

[T90TankGuy]

Anyway, The SEALs were brave men who died fighting for Israel.

Israel ? i thought they were Americans . !! or is it your contention that there is a world wide Jewish conspiracy to kill Muslims?

 

[Donatello]

Israel ? i thought they were Americans . !! or is it your contention that there is a world wide Jewish conspiracy to kill Muslims?

Sarcasm intended, if you didn't get it.

Look at the bigger picture and how the Israel Lobby works in the power circles of Washington D.C.

 

[President Camacho]

looks like Mr. Chankia is speaking from your within.. lolzz

Zaid Hamid fans like you should avoid reading my posts... lolzz

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Q: Now what are you going do with it? Or, for that matter, what could the Pakistani government ever do with it?


A: Absolutely nothing.

you got that right. this is a discussion forum and we will only share differing thoughts to form an opinion. as far as Pakistan government is concerned, we are not the spokesmen for the government maybe you check with the Pakistani foreign office. The likely comment will be” no comment“. if not content with that then check what Indian government is going to do what it/

Conclusion: Better believe what sounds most reasonable and sane, and not risk appearing low on sanity.

Indeed, it applies to your respected self as well. don’t get too overworked over different opinions, its an open discussion forum and if you find something against your view point then give your self a chance to think why and how something can be different from a general perception. Its called free thinking and that’s how societies evolve and visionaries and philosophers are born who think outside the box and refuse to accept the “sane” and well known “fact” like “Earth” is flat and is the centre for the universe.

Such conformity requirement is a trait of repressive regime that demands its subjects to accept the official line because it is the only “sane” explanation. But even the “free world” is not immune to it hence the sound explanation and case for war against Iraq goes from alleged weapons of Mass destruction to weapons of mass destruction programs. To date since the mysterious death and unexplained death of David Kelly, neither the WMDs not their programs have been uncovered by the forces of the free world.

 

[Juice]

you got that right. this is a discussion forum and we will only share differing thoughts to form an opinion. as far as Pakistan government is concerned, we are not the spokesmen for the government maybe you check with the Pakistani foreign office. The likely comment will be” no comment“. if not content with that then check what Indian government is going to do what it/



Indeed, it applies to your respected self as well. don’t get too overworked over different opinions, its an open discussion forum and if you find something against your view point then give your self a chance to think why and how something can be different from a general perception. Its called free thinking and that’s how societies evolve and visionaries and philosophers are born who think outside the box and refuse to accept the “sane” and well known “fact” like “Earth” is flat and is the centre for the universe.

Such conformity requirement is a trait of repressive regime that demands its subjects to accept the official line because it is the only “sane” explanation. But even the “free world” is not immune to it hence the sound explanation and case for war against Iraq goes from alleged weapons of Mass destruction to weapons of mass destruction programs. To date since the mysterious death and unexplained death of David Kelly, neither the WMDs not their programs have been uncovered by the forces of the free world.

C'mon Ifran, I gave you more credit than that. The WMD's were real, ask the Iranians who got to huff a lungful of gas. They were never the real reason to invade Iraq (after 9/11 it became clear we couldn't leave this region to its own devices, unsupervised Islam is too nutty). The only suprise is that the were well hidden or shipped out (Syria perhaps?). To anyone with any thought it is well known Iraq got hit for its central position (bordering many states we like to keep tabs on) The fact we fought them before made it only that much easier.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

C'mon Ifran, I gave you more credit than that. The WMD's were real, ask the Iranians who got to huff a lungful of gas. They were never the real reason to invade Iraq (after 9/11 it became clear we couldn't leave this region to its own devices, unsupervised Islam is too nutty). The only suprise is that the were well hidden or shipped out (Syria perhaps?). To anyone with any thought it is well known Iraq got hit for its central position (bordering many states we like to keep tabs on) The fact we fought them before made it only that much easier.

I wont respond to you unless you accept my friend request

you are honest I must give you that.
dont you remember how the word WMD morphed into WMD programs? Saddam was a bad man and ran a country he didnt deserve and had KSA and Iran as neighbours and that region needed American forces to safeguard its long term objectives fair enough

by the way back to the subject, is there any suggestion of Haqqani's network in this shooting down of the Chinook?