Naswaristan

[JonAsad]

@arp2041 @JonAsad PDF kay tharki @Alpha1 was banned for 24 hrs coz he requested it ...

he should extend his request-
Really at his age he should focus more on his studies- than to be here 24-7-

 

[A.Rafay]

@A.Rafay Dont slap pandas?

I dont slap pandas! but my panda slaps and kicks everyone who annoy him!

 

[Slav Defence]

@WebMaster......Get Well Soon

 

[janon]

@janon : Because that thread got closed while I was away I'd like to answer here !

I don't feel the slightest bit of begrudge when admitting that North Indian & Pakistani Punjabi culture has certain similarities & more so the Muslim majority areas of Kashmir in their similarity with Upper Punjab, AJK & slightly Gilgit Baltistan ! However at the same time I would not want to be clubbed as if both are similar to the point of being interchangeable with each other, saying that doesn't begrudge me in the least, but nor can I ignore the very real fact that our respective cultures have diverged quite a bit due to Persian, Pukhtoon & Central Asian influences on our lands especially the lands west of the Indus & because there has been a significant immigration of people within Pakistan our culture that already went a paradigmatic shift or diversion from the culture of Indian Punjab & Northern India (baring Kashmir) with it being embellished, like all cultures, with their Vedic past & present unlike ours which sees an indelible mark of Islam on our cultural practices, values & traditions. Therefore, we've evolved in much the same way Urdu & Hindi did - Same roots but evolved, over a period of time, due to a plethora of reasons in different unique directions !

As for your ever so presumptions assertion that somehow Pakistanis have been led to believe that we must define ourselves as anything 'Not-India' whereas such is not the case of India, then please pay Pakistan a visit, talk to the people therein, live amongst themselves, see our National celebrations & then tell me how do we define ourselves instead of formulating your opinion from provocative & absolutely unsubstantiated BS that passes for Journalism these days. If there is anything that defines us - It is Islam ! A Pukhtoon of KP, a Baluch of Baluchistan, a Sindhi of Sindh or a Punjabi of Punjab are very conscious of their identity as Muslims first & then anything else; luckily for us we defined the notion of 'Pakistan' in the exact same terms for ourselves ! India doesn't figure in - Our narrative is there...why we went for a country of our own but India doesn't define us for better or for worse...Islam does that job for us !

However at the same time we are very much conscious of our linguistic & ethnic identities but under the banner of our overarching identity as Muslims. And that is precisely why a Punjabi from Lahore can & does marry a Pukhtoon from Peshawar, is friends with each other & acts like Pakistanis for all intents & purposes.

Its sometime quite humorous to see how much you Indians know about us & still have the temerity of writing entire treatises on what is wrong with Pakistan !

Thank you for your reply.

However, I cannot respond to all this right now, since I do not want to write anything on this thread. (Simply because this thread is different from the way the rest of the forum works, and people who regularly comment here have a different dynamic with each other. Also because of how helter skelter this thread is; as you can see, there are already 90+pages between your post and this reply.) I had already made up my mind to leave this particular thread well alone, and indeed, this is my first post here.

So I'll respond to your points if an occasion for that arises - if a similar topic comes up in another thread. As for your charge that I made a "presumptuous assertion" that Pakistanis have been taught to define themselves as "not Indian", I will say that I did not mean that that is the ONLY way they define themselves, or that that is the ONLY way they see themselves. I only said that Pakistanis hate it when anybody talks about shared cultural heritage with India, an attitude you could see on that thread too. I know fully well that islam was the reason for its creation, and that most of them see themselves as muslim first. Indians are taught to think of themselves as Indians first, and anything else later. In fact, that point only reaffirms the point of my post, which is that people think of themselves as something because they are taught to do so, and that it is a matter of choice, what identity one wants to assume.

There are quite a lot of statements in your second para that I would like to counter, but I will leave it for another thread that deals with those topics.

About the last line in your post, I did not write a treatise on what is wrong with Pakistan. I was only pointing out the difference between Indians and Pakistanis, in that Pakistanis cringe at being associated with Indians, although they do share a lot of cultural heritage with them, but south Indians or east Indians do not. I was simply pointing out that fact, that difference between the attitude of Indians and Pakistanis. It wasn't meant as a critique of Pakistan. Also, I was trying to put out the idea that all such "identities" are artificial, and a matter of choice. If Pakistanis all view themselves as muslims first, and if Indians view themselves as Indians first, all these are a matter of choice. That was the main thrust of my post, to show that people regard themselves as something depending on what they are taught to, or on the matter of choice. It wasn't a critique of Pakistan - I mentioned Indians in the same breath, that Indians too assume identities mostly due to what they are taught to.

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to respond, and I promise that I shall take up these issues on some other thread where this question comes up (which I am sure it will). This thread is just too chaotic to discuss anything substantial.

 

[haviZsultan]

Was alpha really banned?

 

[BDforever]

hello All

he should extend his request-
Really at his age he should focus more on his studies- than to be here 24-7-

he is still in pdf and watching us, so whats the point of asking 24hrs banned, hey @Alpha1 ..

 

[Amaa'n]

Salam eveeyone, it was a lobg and tiring day, just hit the bed since last night, my fewt are really numb now,...i need a massage

 

[Amaa'n]

@Alpha1....go away shushh

 

[Slav Defence]

asalaam alaikum
@Talon @balixd @Alpha1 @Hyperion

and others........whatss up???

hi.. @BDforever....
hey @Mirzay

 

[haviZsultan]

Empty at the moment.

 

[Mani2020]

Dil ko behlane ko ye khyl acha hai A.M sahab



@Mani2020

tujhe tau mera name bhi pta ha another proof

mirzay

 

[Slav Defence]

 

[Huda]

tujhe tau mera name bhi pta ha another proof

mirzay

Apne khud he to btaya tha yad nhi "Hey A.M here phr may logo se apki durgat krwa di thi k he is irritating me

 

[Dubious]

@Pboy on the roll

hi @Hermione G

 

[arp2041]

Hello @Talon @Mirzay ---->

@Alpha1