Muslim Ban: Saudi Arabia not banned because they are now closer to Israel and U.S.

[Anaoshak]

I know this will stir up some drama probably and bring trolls out. Since apparently anyone that is against the Government of KSA, Wahhabis,Salafists,Extremism and etc is anti-arab or a Mullah these days.
But try and keep it civil.

Even though I'm not a fan of fox news, i thought it was interesting that the brain behind the Muslim ban, Rudy Giuliani, justified the reason SA is not amongst the countries, is because they have a close relationship to Israel now which he mentions first and then also the U.S. (Clip below, he mentions it at around 4:53).
Now, most people that know anything about global politics, know that Israel and SA have been close for a while. But to have a U.S White House member to say it, doesn't happen too often.

Every intelligence report so far has SA and other countries in the Arabian Peninsula complicit in most terrorist attacks in the West. Whether it be directly or indirectly. Yet they managed to stay out of the Muslim ban in the U.S. Now I'm not saying that the ban is right at all, but the fact that Iran is on it and SA is not, doesn't make sense and quite a number of intellectuals have pointed this out as well as random people on social media since Trump did talk about 9/11 a lot when he signed the order but literally none of the countries from which people came from and committed terror attacks on US soil (that includes 9/11), is in the ban. (And coincidentally Trump has business in most of those countries that avoided the ban).

Another thing he mentions that he shouldn't have, is that despite Trump saying that this is not a Muslim Ban, which could get him into trouble, Rudy Giuliani says that when Trump called him and asked him to find a loophole so that he could do it, he specifically wanted a Muslim Ban. (See the clip from the beginning to see that).

Edit: Fixed typo.

 

[lonelyman]

Ironic none of the 911 attackers came from the banned country

 

[Mrc]

None of attacks since 9 11 were carried out by any of citizens of banned countries... their fault seems to be they are too weak to do any thing

 

[Anaoshak]

None of attacks since 9 11 were carried out by any of citizens of banned countries... their fault seems to be they are too weak to do any thing

Ironic none of the 911 attackers came from the banned country

This article was interesting, when they looked at statistics in regards to the Muslim ban,
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...countries-linked-businesses-article-1.2957956

About the countries in the Muslim Ban,
"Not a single American was killed on U.S. soil by citizens from any of those countries between 1975 and 2015, according to statistics tallied by the conservative-leaning CATO Institute.

However, the same set of statistics show that nearly 3,000 Americans were killed by citizens from Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and Egypt in the same time period — with the bulk of those killed being victims of the 9/11 attacks. Yet, people from those three countries are still welcome to apply for U.S. visas and travel permits."
And coincidentally, Trump has business in all 3 of those countries.

Now banning anyone on the basis of their religion is wrong in my opinion, but the ban right now makes so little sense when you actually look at the facts.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

The answer is extremely simple.

Saudi Arabian citizens were never a burden on the US or the Western world. All Saudi Arabians in the US or the West are either students, tourists, businessmen or patients looking for a special medical treatment as my brother @Gasoline rightly put it in another thread.

In fact Saudi Arabian students in the US are only outnumbered by 1.3 billion big China and 1.2 billion big India. Per capita KSA has the highest number of students at US universities and other learning centers.

Millions of Saudi Arabian citizens have visited, lived, studied, worked etc. in the US since the 1960's and 15 hijackers are not going to change that picture, no matter how much Iranians or others want it to be the case.

November 2016:

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-study-abroad-students-20161124-story.html

November 2013:

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/nov/24/local/la-me-saudi-student-20131125

Moreover KSA and the US have never been enemy states in recorded history. KSA and the US are investing 100's of billions of dollars in each other economies and countries.

Outside of 15 brainwashed hijackers (mostly of Yemeni origin) in their 20's with no prior criminal record and proven, even in US courts, without having any ties to the Saudi Arabian government, there have been no terrorist attacks done by Saudi Arabians in not only the US but the entire Western world. Moreover the mastermind OBL was a Saudi Arabian citizen of Yemeni (father) and Syrian (mother) origins who was stripped of his Saudi Arabian citizenship in the early 1990's way before him becoming a "bad terrorist" in the eyes of West and dare I say the world, expect for Russia/Soviet Union.

In fact the same West praised him as a great humanitarian when he was based in Sudan. That was AFTER he was stripped of his Saudi Arabian citizenship and AFTER the Saudi Arabian government warning the West.



As for the nonsense talk of "Wahhabism" (something that does not exist and something that nobody calls himself) it did never inspire Islamism but rather Qutbism and other "sects/political movements" within Islamism did that. Which is evident of the fact that virtually every single terrorist group in the region's primary/most important goal is the removal of the House of Saud and the clergy which they demonize at every single opportunity. Much more than they would ever think about doing with Iran and the Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah's in power.

The difference is that Iran is ruled by a terror regime that actively spreads terror internationally and regionally hence Iran's political isolation since 1979 and sanctions by the world community. In KSA there is a small minority of radicals who indeed support militant Islamists (mostly attacking KSA proper and finding safe heavens in war-torn/failed countries in the region or outside of it) but they are by all means dealt hardly with whenever possible. Therein lies the difference.

Speaking about what some Americans say or don't say, according to the same US, Iran is the greatest terrorist sponsor in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terrorism

The same Iran that hosts several internationally wanted Al-Qaeda members and other terrorists that they use for their own interests whenever convenient.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/sep/8/al-qaedas-iran-connection/

Including OBL relatives that are stateless.

Also another factor, KSA is not a failed/unstable state at war unlike all the countries banned, expect for Iran, which some would claim to be a failed state but that is for another topic.

So please scream and shout all you want to. Saudi Arabian citizens are not banned. Iranians are. The same Iranians that BTW were close to getting an collective orgasm when Trump was elected because he was supposedly going to invade KSA and do what not. Tragicomical is the best description, I believe.

Those above are the facts. I can't/any sane person cannot say the same about your empty drivel and empty rhetoric.

P.S: Am I fine with KSA being an ally/a non-hostile state to the US (sole superpower) Of course I am. As for Israel, KSA is neither an ally nor an hostile country. I can tell you that I much rather want to belong to that camp than in the camp of North Korea, Iraqi Shia terrorist militias, Hezbollah, Al-Qaeda, Al-Assad, Houthis, Ali Abdullah Saleh, branches of the MB, Northern Alliance etc. The list is endless.

 

[Anaoshak]

@Saif al-Arab
Again, this is about terrorist attacks on U.S Soil, and i asked trolls not to write here, so not sure why you are writing in this thread, as you are a troll and like to derail threads.

Fact,
""Not a single American was killed on U.S. soil by citizens from any of those countries in the ban between 1975 and 2015, according to statistics tallied by the conservative-leaning CATO Institute.

However, the same set of statistics show that nearly 3,000 Americans were killed by citizens from Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and Egypt in the same time period — with the bulk of those killed being victims of the 9/11 attacks. Yet, people from those three countries are still welcome to apply for U.S. visas and travel permits." And he used 9/11 as the basis for the executive order.

I don't care about what Iran or anyone else in the ban does in the Middle east, in Tonga or even on Mars. All i care is about what the ban is supposed to do, protect U.S from terrorist attacks. And that's why it doesn't make any sense.

And as mentioned, most terrorist attacks in the U.S, Saudis have been either directly or indirectly involved.
You can twist and turn truths as much as you want but that's something you can't disprove.

But you are right, the answer is simple, Rudy Giuliani, who came up with the implementation of the Muslim ban, says it in the clip above, when he boasts about the ban. The reason Saudi Arabia is not on it, is because they are close to Israel and the U.S. That's why they weren't banned.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I know this

Does any of this surprise you? Do you recall the Iraqi Airforce Exocet missile attack on USS Stark in 1987 that killed 37 US sailors on aboard?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Stark_(FFG-31)#Missile_attack


And what happened to Iraq? Nothing. However who did get 'payback' from US? USS Carl Vinceness and Iran Air Flight 665?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

So this mismatched American policy should not be a surprise. I was expecting Pakistan to get slapped but it escaped. It might be due to Sajid Tarrar a Pakistani-American who is part of Trump's inner circle.

 

[Anaoshak]

Does any of this surprise you? Do you recall the Iraqi Airforce Exocet missile attack on USS Stark in 1987 that killed 37 US sailors on aboard?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Stark_(FFG-31)#Missile_attack


And what happened to Iraq? Nothing. However who did get 'payback' from US? USS Carl Vinceness and Iran Air Flight 665?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

So this mismatched American policy should not be a surprise. I was expecting Pakistan to get slapped but it escaped. It might be due to Sajid Tarrar a Pakistani-American who is part of Trump's inner circle.

Nah, it doesn't surprise me at all.
The moment the DNC picked Hillary instead of Sanders, i knew Trump was gonna win. And I always knew Trump would be very anti-Iran and very pro-Zionist, Pro-hawkish GOP.

But yeah, i thought it was interesting that the guy behind the ban in the U.S actually comes out and says "KSA isn't banned because they are close to Israel and us now".

 

[livingdead]

KSA and USA have important strategic relationship... and that itself is big enough for them to avoid any sactions... israel matters zero here... why was not pakistanis banned then? it does not even have trump business interest.
it is possible though that iran was banned to keep israel happy.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

"KSA isn't banned because they are close to Israel and us now".

Human beings are remarkable. They can deny what is in front of them but accept what is never seen by them. You know KSA and GCC are pro Israel. The GCC plus Israel plus USA trioka is obvious to anybody with a functioning brain. You will find few people that hate Israel more than Pakistani's. I think Pakistani's are the premier world Anti-Semites. No kidding. They are so averse to Israel that if you touch a Israeli, then you touch another, the another touches me, I have become 'na-pak' in their eyes. Yet if you tell them that GCC/KSA are apologetic of Israel they will slam their heads in the sand and do a ostrich. They will simply refuse to accept it.

I and afraid this is how it is.

why was not pakistanis banned then?

I am sure your Ganga lobby will be trying to do it in USA. Must have cramped you guy's seeing Pakistan escape the net ... lol !

 

[somebozo]

Saudis and as a matter of fact whole gulf arabs dont live their life for Islam..they live it for themselves..the social understanding of gulf is hierarchical and roughly divided into three level as follows...

 

[Gasoline]

The answer is extremely simple.

Saudi Arabian citizens were never a burden on the US or the Western world. All Saudi Arabians in the US or the West are either students, tourists, businessmen or patients looking for a special medical treatment as my brother @Gasoline rightly put it in another thread.

In fact Saudi Arabian students in the US are only outnumbered by 1.3 billion big China and 1.2 billion big India. Per capita KSA has the highest number of students at US universities and other learning centers.

Millions of Saudi Arabian citizens have visited, lived, studied, worked etc. in the US since the 1960's and 15 hijackers are not going to change that picture, no matter how much Iranians or others want it to be the case.

November 2016:

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-study-abroad-students-20161124-story.html

November 2013:

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/nov/24/local/la-me-saudi-student-20131125

Moreover KSA and the US have never been enemy states in recorded history. KSA and the US are investing 100's of billions of dollars in each other economies and countries.

Outside of 15 brainwashed hijackers (mostly of Yemeni origin) in their 20's with no prior criminal record and proven, even in US courts, without having any ties to the Saudi Arabian government, there have been no terrorist attacks done by Saudi Arabians in not only the US but the entire Western world. Moreover the mastermind OBL was a Saudi Arabian citizen of Yemeni (father) and Syrian (mother) origins who was stripped of his Saudi Arabian citizenship in the early 1990's way before him becoming a "bad terrorist" in the eyes of West and dare I say the world, expect for Russia/Soviet Union.

In fact the same West praised him as a great humanitarian when he was based in Sudan. That was AFTER he was stripped of his Saudi Arabian citizenship and AFTER the Saudi Arabian government warning the West.



As for the nonsense talk of "Wahhabism" (something that does not exist and something that nobody calls himself) it did never inspire Islamism but rather Qutbism and other "sects/political movements" within Islamism did that. Which is evident of the fact that virtually every single terrorist group in the region's primary/most important goal is the removal of the House of Saud and the clergy which they demonize at every single opportunity. Much more than they would ever think about doing with Iran and the Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah's in power.

The difference is that Iran is ruled by a terror regime that actively spreads terror internationally and regionally hence Iran's political isolation since 1979 and sanctions by the world community. In KSA there is a small minority of radicals who indeed support militant Islamists (mostly attacking KSA proper and finding safe heavens in war-torn/failed countries in the region or outside of it) but they are by all means dealt hardly with whenever possible. Therein lies the difference.

Speaking about what some Americans say or don't say, according to the same US, Iran is the greatest terrorist sponsor in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terrorism

The same Iran that hosts several internationally wanted Al-Qaeda members and other terrorists that they use for their own interests whenever convenient.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/sep/8/al-qaedas-iran-connection/

Including OBL relatives that are stateless.

Also another factor, KSA is not a failed/unstable state at war unlike all the countries banned, expect for Iran, which some would claim to be a failed state but that is for another topic.

So please scream and shout all you want to. Saudi Arabian citizens are not banned. Iranians are. The same Iranians that BTW were close to getting an collective orgasm when Trump was elected because he was supposedly going to invade KSA and do what not. Tragicomical is the best description, I believe.

Those above are the facts. I can't/any sane person cannot say the same about your empty drivel and empty rhetoric.

P.S: Am I fine with KSA being an ally/a non-hostile state to the US (sole superpower) Of course I am. As for Israel, KSA is neither an ally nor an hostile country. I can tell you that I much rather want to belong to that camp than in the camp of North Korea, Iraqi Shia terrorist militias, Hezbollah, Al-Qaeda, Al-Assad, Houthis, Ali Abdullah Saleh, branches of the MB, Northern Alliance etc. The list is endless.

Well said brother. What concerns us about 9/11 is the U.S nobody else. Settlement of this matter is between U.S & KSA no third party. In this regard, the U.S recently released the secret pages of 9/11 investigations and it showed that our government has no relevance to the alleged terrorist attack. If there is a further need for discussion or clarification about this matter it will be only with the U.S nobody else, others better for them to " shut up ", as nobody care about what they say in this matter.


Regarding the ban, it's the U.S who recognized their countries as " terrorist states" and banned them, so no body can blame the Americans for protecting their citizens. Their country & their laws.


You don't have to waste your time with them. Let them bark as much as they can. Who cares... now they say KSA is Zionist because we are not included in the ban. lol

 

[Full Moon]

Israel has nothing to do here. They can ban us if they want as we currently don't have refugees anywhere in the World. Studying, business, tourism can be done elsewhere other than the US. The truth is that larg number of US corporations have direct interest and business in KSA. Therefore, the ban will not make complete ecnomic sence. Don't by the way teach Uncle Sam how to do his own things. Trust me, they don't do anything as a free lunch. They calculate whatever they do in every step of the way.