Mass protests sweep Gilgit Baltistan

[waz]

I agree...the article needs to have stronger basis in statistics...
But it was hard to find a newspaper that wouldnt be labeled as a crony, since most newspapers that pick up such stories would be non-Kashmiri, India based...

Nevertheless,...its an ongoing discussion Im having with Armstrong about the lack of existence of a religion based census for the army...so of course you wont see the Indian army with its secular traditions publicizing its muslim army men..





Kashmiris are in a tough place man...I feel for ya...
But at the same time, I meant better in the term of protests....In 2011, I believe there were an insane number of them and some unfortunate teenage deaths too..

India needs to do better about law and order and riot control...


I hear ya...you speak from a boots on the ground situation, I understand. But its still hard to put numbers behind any of this...from my side or urs.

I wish the Kashmiris the best...






Well...individual faith and the collective faith is different...

Pakistan as an Islamic Republic can claim to be a muslim army....Indian army is fiercely secular!

Good post mate. Thanks for your thoughts. You are right we probably strayed a little too much off-topic.

 

[Peshwa]

And you are quoting words of Mr . Hasan ....... Genius
You don`t even know what is the "charter of demands" of AWC and still you are blabbering on and on ....

The point stands whether I quote mr. Hasan or not!
The pretext under which these people are protesting is that GB doesn't fall under the ambit of Pakistani federal law, but international law as it is a disputed territory....
The demands in the charter starting with the imposition of taxes is illegal because GB is a disputed territory! What other legal basis do these people have to demand revoking of taxes??!!

The Sino Pak border agreement was signed in 1963 .... Simla Agreement in 1972 ... So your argument is invalid .......

Im man enough to admit when I was wrong...

I dropped the ball on the sequence here...the argument that the move was illegal since its a bilateral issue between India and Pak only was wrong the way I positioned it...

And your opinion carries no weight My friend ........ You don`t know anything

Feel free to disregard my comments in the future then.....nevertheless I will continue to voice my opinions...simple!

 

[M. Sarmad]

The demands in the charter starting with the imposition of taxes is illegal because GB is a disputed territory!

Please show us where does it say so ??

It states : As per the internationally recognized principle of "No taxation without representation" , All taxes imposed by GB and Federal Govt. should be abolished and the 2009 price of wheat be restored ....

The very next demand is : "Protection of GB frontiers must be ensured" .....

People of GB have repeatedly demanded representation in the Federal Govt. and integration with Pakistan , but these demands have been rejected on the grounds that it would prejudice Pakistan`s international obligations with regard to the Kashmir dispute.

The people of GB are protesting "When no representation , then why taxation ?

And now the govt. has accepted their rightful demand and has promised to remove taxes ......

So all your efforts to pull things out of thin air are pointless .....

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

Every authority on the subject abroad holds that Pakistan did not cede any land; on the contrary it was China which ceded to Pakistan 750 square miles of administered territory..!!!

Bro can you create separate thread in South Asia section for this? Because hindutvas believe Pakistan sold that part of Kashmir.

 

[Black Eagle 90]

NESPAK and FWO should work on developing newer dams and cities in this region.

 

[Informant]

So all this hooplaover wheat?

Wtf.

 

[saikumar]

raw is watching

 

[M. Sarmad]

Bro can you create separate thread in South Asia section for this? Because hindutvas believe Pakistan sold that part of Kashmir.

What We Know and What We Do Not Know, The SINO-PAK Boundary Agreement

 

[Armstrong]

Well...if India Today did get this information, the question is from where?? It is clear that except for the GOI, no other entity including India Today magazine has the resources nor the authority to conduct such a census of the armed forces...
So what is the basis for this number then?

Any such numbers thrown around MUST have a reference...in the case of India today, it claims "the army"...without any clarification of who in the army with the legitimate authority nor links to such a census...

The dawn report even though an editorial quotes the defence minister Pranab Mukherjee (2006)....a direct reference!
Also, it is not the responsibility of the army, navy or air force to defend random accusations and numbers...they simply dont acknowledge the figure is how i take this.

It is evident that the numbers you have been quoting (even though referenced by some reputed news sources) have no point of origin!
With such a weak basis of argument, unfortunately we cant continue down this path with the implications in your previous posts....

These are not random accusations and numbers nor did the Army relinquish its responsibility in commenting when there was a call for census along religious lines to determine whether the pitiful situation of Muslims representation in India's other Institutions was ever present in the Army as well during the course of the writing of Sachar Report.

At any rate it is the responsibility of the Ministry of Defense to issue a clarification on the veracity of figures quoted by a leading newspaper in India as part of its Editorial piece when that piece and the Minority Report (as it is titled) goes on to be referenced by other reputed news sources; not by any standard practice that I know of either in Legal terms or in terms of Administrative Policy is 'silence' or the 'failure to acknowledge' taken as a rebuttal of asserted facts.

I would've even given credence to the argument that you present had the Ministry of Defense and the Indian Army remained silent throughout the course of this debate but they did not; their failure to issue a clarification on this only adds credibility to the asserted claim it does not, however, take away credibility from it.

Furthermore, the argument wasn't just about the Indian Army, it was about representation in the Indian State Security Apparatus of which one component is the Indian Army therefore a look at the Indian Police Services and Security Agencies like the CRPF, CISF, BSF, SSB and other agencies some of which have been stationed and operated in Occupied Kashmir especially the CPRF and the BSF might be worthwhile.

The Sachar Report on page 168 categorically mentions that in the above mentioned Security Agencies (and other agencies excluding the Armed Forces) the share of Muslims is around 4%.

Additionally on page 172 the Sachar Report reads as : Andhra Pradesh is the only State that shows a representation of Muslims in the Home Department more than their population share; all other states have huge deficits in the presence of Muslims in their police forces.

With the overall share being stated (on the same page) as 6% of the Police Constables with the share in the office cadre being even lower.

I was under the impression that because Kashmir is a Muslim Majority Region; the Muslims would be in the Majority in the Police Forces as opposed to having 'huge deficits' proportionate to their population.

Either way the point still stands - Muslims in Kashmir are neither joining your Police nor your Paramilitary Forces and if the findings of India Today are to be believed (which have not been rebutted by the Defense Ministry who seems to have an Opinion about the Issue) then neither are they joining the Indian Armed Forces.

 

[pursuit of happiness]

The Longest protest in history of the territory is just like any protest on hike of petrol prices in Lahore ??? You are better than that But Sahib ......

---

different perspective

From the fringes: Gilgit-Baltistanis silently observe elections - Newspaper - DAWN.COM

From the fringes: Gilgit-Baltistanis silently observe elections - DAWN.COM

Our fate-politically, economically, legally — remains in the hands of Islamabad, thanks to the quirks and tragedies of history,” says Tahir Hussain, a Skardu resident. “We might have nothing to say — we will not be voting — but the next election will matter. The new government in Islamabad could help enshrine, or remove, our rights

While the rest of the country goes to the polls, the two million-strong population in this northern mountain range will have nothing to say when it comes to deciding who gets to sit in power in Islamabad.

instead, Perwana argues,
the Pakistan government has colonised Gilgit-Baltistan, and mishandled and misrepresented the real situation to the international community.

“This region Baltistan, which operates under the de facto administration of Pakistan, has no identity, no constitution, no system, no freedom of expression, no impartial judiciary, no free media, no free movement, no human rights, no rights of vote and no freedom of expression. I

nstead, it is one of the last colonies of the 21st century, and what Baroness Emma Nicholson, a member of the European Parliament, called a ‘Black Hole’,” says Perwan

 

[Zarrar Alvi]

raw is watching

keep watching coz ISI is doing its work in indian occupied kashmir and chattishghar

 

[M. Sarmad]

---

different perspective

From the fringes: Gilgit-Baltistanis silently observe elections - Newspaper - DAWN.COM

From the fringes: Gilgit-Baltistanis silently observe elections - DAWN.COM

Our fate-politically, economically, legally — remains in the hands of Islamabad, thanks to the quirks and tragedies of history,” says Tahir Hussain, a Skardu resident. “We might have nothing to say — we will not be voting — but the next election will matter. The new government in Islamabad could help enshrine, or remove, our rights

While the rest of the country goes to the polls, the two million-strong population in this northern mountain range will have nothing to say when it comes to deciding who gets to sit in power in Islamabad.

instead, Perwana argues,
the Pakistan government has colonised Gilgit-Baltistan, and mishandled and misrepresented the real situation to the international community.

“This region Baltistan, which operates under the de facto administration of Pakistan, has no identity, no constitution, no system, no freedom of expression, no impartial judiciary, no free media, no free movement, no human rights, no rights of vote and no freedom of expression. I

nstead, it is one of the last colonies of the 21st century, and what Baroness Emma Nicholson, a member of the European Parliament, called a ‘Black Hole’,” says Perwan

Why are you using large red fonts mate ?? It is not a "different perspective " ..... The link you posted says :

In the last election for the GBLA, the people of Gilgit-Baltistan fully supported the PPP and managed to establish a government under its party banner. The election result had many hoping that the PPP would solve its problems. Many, however, feel cheated.

“The former prime minister, Yousuf Raza Gilani, changed the 2009 ordinance into an executive order, which means Gilgit-Baltistan remains vulnerable to the whims of a central government,” says the former deputy chief executive of Gilgit-Baltistan, Haji Fida Mohammad Nashad. “They went ahead and disappointed a lot of those people who supported them — there were hardly any development projects to speak of. Gilgit-Baltistan is hoping for a political change in the country,” he said.

Salik hopes that the PML-N will bring about a major change. “I hope Mian Nawaz Sharif will upgrade the administrative package of Gilgit-Baltistan — he has announced that he will if the PML-N wins. He has also promised to transform Gilgit-Baltistan into a constitutional province by converting the current order from 2009 into an ordinance,” says Salik

 

[Areesh]

raw is watching

Watching?? What? ****???

 

[pursuit of happiness]

Why are you using large red fonts mate ?? It is not a "different perspective " ..... The link you posted says :

In the last election for the GBLA, the people of Gilgit-Baltistan fully supported the PPP and managed to establish a government under its party banner. The election result had many hoping that the PPP would solve its problems. Many, however, feel cheated.

“The former prime minister, Yousuf Raza Gilani, changed the 2009 ordinance into an executive order, which means Gilgit-Baltistan remains vulnerable to the whims of a central government,” says the former deputy chief executive of Gilgit-Baltistan, Haji Fida Mohammad Nashad. “They went ahead and disappointed a lot of those people who supported them — there were hardly any development projects to speak of. Gilgit-Baltistan is hoping for a political change in the country,” he said.

Salik hopes that the PML-N will bring about a major change. “I hope Mian Nawaz Sharif will upgrade the administrative package of Gilgit-Baltistan — he has announced that he will if the PML-N wins. He has also promised to transform Gilgit-Baltistan into a constitutional province by converting the current order from 2009 into an ordinance,” says Salik

--
large font .. to just show.. how people think about there govt..
its clearly says their view on pak govt treatment to them..

Why are you using large red fonts mate ?? It is not a "different perspective " ..... The link you posted says :

In the last election for the GBLA, the people of Gilgit-Baltistan fully supported the PPP and managed to establish a government under its party banner. The election result had many hoping that the PPP would solve its problems. Many, however, feel cheated.

“The former prime minister, Yousuf Raza Gilani, changed the 2009 ordinance into an executive order, which means Gilgit-Baltistan remains vulnerable to the whims of a central government,” says the former deputy chief executive of Gilgit-Baltistan, Haji Fida Mohammad Nashad. “They went ahead and disappointed a lot of those people who supported them — there were hardly any development projects to speak of. Gilgit-Baltistan is hoping for a political change in the country,” he said.

Salik hopes that the PML-N will bring about a major change. “I hope Mian Nawaz Sharif will upgrade the administrative package of Gilgit-Baltistan — he has announced that he will if the PML-N wins. He has also promised to transform Gilgit-Baltistan into a constitutional province by converting the current order from 2009 into an ordinance,” says Salik

--
While the rest of the country goes to the polls, the two million-strong population in this northern mountain range will have nothing to say when it comes to deciding who gets to sit in power in Islamabad.
- is not wrong after so much jihad , war .. they themselves cant teat kashmiris and give their due..

This region Baltistan, which operates under the de facto administration of Pakistan, has no identity, no constitution, no system, no freedom of expression, no impartial judiciary, no free media, no free movement, no human rights, no rights of vote and no freedom of expression
- what the use of election when you cant give above rights

gilgit dont see state sponsored terrorisam like india still they cant give right ?

 

[Zarrar Alvi]

Watching?? What? ****???

no gang bang in red corridor