Mao Zedong's 120th birthday anniversary

[itaskol]

Even he has made lot of big mistake.
He was a greatest leader of china. I miss him

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Chairman Mao did great things for China, even he did make some mistake later.

But if the history can repeat, we will choose him again to kick those invaders' ***.

 

[vostok]

Do not renounce your heroes, comrades. Do not let the West to defame them and trample in the mud their names. They lived for you and for all people of the planet.

 

[tranquilium]

Please, the Great Leap Forward may have the highest annual death rate in the PRC history, but it is actually much lower than the AVERAGE annual death rate of China under KMT rule.

You do realize that during KMT's political purges was way more brutal than the cultural revolution can dream to be. For example, before April 1927, KMT has 650 thousand members and after its political purge, there are less than 220 thousand members left----this is how KMT treat their own members, let alone other people.

The "intellectual class will be well treated" bit is utter BS. First of all, you are talking about "intellectual" regarding a nation that had less than 20% of the people literate. Of those, only a few so-called "intellectual masters" are actually well treated. For example, Hu Shi's monthly salary was 240 dayang (a silver coin which is the currency at the time). In comparison, a common libarian's salary is 8. Essentially these few elites are making 30 to 50 times more money of the average intellectual. They sure are having a good time while the ordinary people are having problem just to get enough food. To make the matter worse, none of these "intellectual masters" are scientists, engineers, doctors or anything that is even remotely useful for building a modern nation. While these liberal arts majors were feasting on what little wealth China could spare at the time, the scientific and technology progress suffered and stagnated. Was it any surprise that when CCP took over, these "intellectual masters" lost their privilege and money was instead devoted to produce scientists, engineers, doctors, technicians and other professionals that are actually useful?

Similarly land owners' life is way worse under KMT rule by a Himalayan sized margin. The average land owner back in those days are frankly, not much better off the peasants. This is because with all the warlords, bandits and invaders, the average landowners' life is in as much jeopardy as the average peasantry. Without the backing of a powerful industry, these land owners are also barely producing enough to feed themselves. The only ones enjoying it are the few mega-elites who have so much land and wealth that they are essentially warlords themselves.

I don't get why people would ever try to put KMT and CCP at the same level. The former ran one of the darkest period in Chinese history while the latter is capable of propelling a backwater nation into one of the most powerful nation in this world. This like comparing a student that is barely scraping by with someone who can jump three or four grades ahead.

 

[tranquilium]

Hongkong was under British rule Mao never dared to go against British. They have this thought of attacking Hongkong But their priorities changed.

Partition of India is based on Religion , Pakistanis wanted a country based on religion, even though we have won the war in 1971 India never tried to take the lands of Pakistan.

Right...I guess it must be fairies who shelled HMS Amethyst as well as nullified all the concession territories. The 16 nation UN force in Korea must also have gotten lost by themselves all the way from Chinese border back down to 38 degree parallel.

Hong Kong is kept that way due to the fact China needs a port of exchange. After Korean War, the cold war went on in full effect. While Americans and Russians are at each other's throat, the Chinese and Europeans are not willing to just follow their command like obedient children. The China needs an outlet to communication and trade with Europe and Europe needs the same. This is why UK and China started exchange goods right after Korean war. Frances soon followed and it also become the first European nation to recognize PRC. The rest of Europe followed afterwards. This is the entire reason why China waited until 1997 to reclaim Hong Kong, because it is a necessary port of communication and exchange.

 

[Lux de Veritas]

Please, the Great Leap Forward may have the highest annual death rate in the PRC history, but it is actually much lower than the AVERAGE annual death rate of China under KMT rule.

You do realize that during KMT's political purges was way more brutal than the cultural revolution can dream to be. For example, before April 1927, KMT has 650 thousand members and after its political purge, there are less than 220 thousand members left----this is how KMT treat their own members, let alone other people.

The "intellectual class will be well treated" bit is utter BS. First of all, you are talking about "intellectual" regarding a nation that had less than 20% of the people literate. Of those, only a few so-called "intellectual masters" are actually well treated. For example, Hu Shi's monthly salary was 240 dayang (a silver coin which is the currency at the time). In comparison, a common libarian's salary is 8. Essentially these few elites are making 30 to 50 times more money of the average intellectual. They sure are having a good time while the ordinary people are having problem just to get enough food. To make the matter worse, none of these "intellectual masters" are scientists, engineers, doctors or anything that is even remotely useful for building a modern nation. While these liberal arts majors were feasting on what little wealth China could spare at the time, the scientific and technology progress suffered and stagnated. Was it any surprise that when CCP took over, these "intellectual masters" lost their privilege and money was instead devoted to produce scientists, engineers, doctors, technicians and other professionals that are actually useful?

Similarly land owners' life is way worse under KMT rule by a Himalayan sized margin. The average land owner back in those days are frankly, not much better off the peasants. This is because with all the warlords, bandits and invaders, the average landowners' life is in as much jeopardy as the average peasantry. Without the backing of a powerful industry, these land owners are also barely producing enough to feed themselves. The only ones enjoying it are the few mega-elites who have so much land and wealth that they are essentially warlords themselves.

I don't get why people would ever try to put KMT and CCP at the same level. The former ran one of the darkest period in Chinese history while the latter is capable of propelling a backwater nation into one of the most powerful nation in this world. This like comparing a student that is barely scraping by with someone who can jump three or four grades ahead.

You need to verify your numbers that KMT killed so many in 1927 purges. Do not bullshit by denigrating Chiang Kai Shek, who is one of the best leader. So tell me where you get the numbers. The Great Leap Forward is the single peace time event that killed the most people surpassing war time, 30 millions killed.

The intellectual class is well treated is true. I am not talking about peasant class. You talk about lack of scientist and engineers, but at its not KMT fault. KMT took over from Qing which has none of these at all, and she provide a basic education to many people, that allow PRC to quickly train engineers and scientist when she took over. Mao was destroying a lot of intellect.

Give me evidence saying landlord is miserable under KMT, and how you define landlord, on how big area of land. In comparison, landlord got massacre in land reform under Mao. Few millions died and even more was tortured. A lot of their women folks raped. Mao is a scumbag.

In old China, landless peasants are hired by landlords. How can "landlord not much better than" peasants as you claim?

While there are lack of modern farming under Chiang and that is not Chiang's fault. He took over from a dinasaur Qing dynasty. Under Mao, 30 million died in his experiment before he managed to figure out how to farm better.

KMT running one of the darkest period? You better study more. Without Chiang, China will be overrun by Japan.

Do not lie. I hate dishonest Chinese like you.

Chiang Kai Shek, a great leader

 

[Edison Chen]

Without Mao zedong, China will be the ally of U.S to contain USSR, Japan would be different from now it is, maybe poorer.

 

[Edison Chen]

The reason KMT failed to CPC is that the KMT has less control over the grass roots of China, like the peasants. This control could be ideology, administration or military. CPC is good at fooling peasants, while KMT don't rule by extreme ideology and personality cult（not the Three People's Principles）.

KMT did have party organization on roots level, but the leader of party never outmatched government leader. In CPC, the interest of party is the most essential！ Everyone in CPC should be loyal to the party and then next to our country. CPC leader is No.1 and then it's government leader, this is CPC's secret weapon to control China ever since its foundation and development. KMT concentrated on upper level party administration, they didn't care about the actual control by the party on lower or roots level. That's the reason why KMT failed. Or we could say, KMT didn't try to the manipulate public opinion.

Now those CPC said: KMT member has no faith, discipline, respect for the party.

 

[INDIC]

That is not true.

India is dreaming to annex Tibet and so easily lured by the CIA offer at the time.

Can you prove it.

This is imperialism. The princely states are given a choice to vote out just like Pakistan. If Pakistan did not control substantial military units upon partition, she could be invaded.

China despite having the ability does not even invade Hong Kong and Macau. India invaded Goa.

I have to admit you are right in the atrocities committed by Mao.

You did sent military to interfere in Korea. Goa was our land, so we fought to take back our land just like Angola and Mozambique fought against Portuguese rule.

 

[Sasquatch]

Stick to the topic.

 

[Armstrong]

Happy Birthday, Mao Zedong !

 

[Viet]

I want to know why Mao Zedong did not support the re-unitification of Vietnam?

It is really tragic, especially for Vietnam. The history of China and Vietnam would have taken another path if China honestly backed Vietnam when Ho Chi Minh negotiated with the French and America on the negotiation table in Geneve.

 

[tranquilium]

Chiang Kai Shek, a great leader

Well, we have a saying 美分是立场问题，果粉是智商问题 (5-cent army is a matter of stance and fan of KMT is a matter of IQ). Let's a look at the so called great leader's time shall we?

First of all, let's forget about works by Lu Xun, Lao She and other similar writers of the time for a while. Although their work did reflect the hardship and desperate conditions of the time, literary description isn't as reliable as quantitative facts. Take my example of the Hu Shi and the common librarian for example:

According to 民国经济史, in 1919, 1 dayang can buy roughly 10 kg of rice or 4 kg of pork. With a salary of 8 dayang, a librarian (which already have much income than the common people) has the equivalent income of 50 USD/month. This is less than even the minimum income line in both US and China. In comparison, Hu Shi's salary is equivalent of 1500USD/month plus whatever he gets for anything he writes.

Of course, in a modern society, we see CEOs and politician makes way more than us, but since our income is sufficient for our needs, people are okay with it. The problem is that back then, save for a selective few, even intellectuals themselves would have trouble living on those salaries. For example, from 1920 to 1921, there is a famine in the Huabei provinces, roughly 10 million people died in starvation and generating 30 to 50 million refugees. From 1928 to 1930, the northern province experiences natural disaster including drought, locust and plague, more than 10 million died. Take Shanxi province for example, in 1928, the population of the province is 13 million and during these three years, more than 3 million died from starvation and plague and more than 6 million become refugees. Of course, the 3 million were just the ones that had a corpse. According to journalists from west, many corpses never made it to burial as the starving people succumbing to cannibalism. Take another example, in 1942, a famine happened in Henan province where 3 million died of starvation with 3 million became refugees. Henan province lost 2/3 of its population in a year. Did you really believed that under these circumstances that the land owners are living just fine? You asked for a land size, well, according to investigation in 1930, in order to just to able to eat rice every meal, the landowner needs to own more than 200 Chinese acre of land (roughly 13337 square meter or 33 acre).

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

ROC has killed 200 million Chinese during their 38 years of rule, both Beiyang and KMT were bad, but KMT was even worse than Beiyang.

KMT would make China half of its current size. With 1.4 billion population, what would be the future for Chinese people if our territory is reduced to less than 50%?

Without Mao zedong, China will be the ally of U.S to contain USSR, Japan would be different from now it is, maybe poorer.

Without Mao, China would be one of US lapdogs, while US would still use Japan as another lapdog to make sure China wouldn't become too strong.

KMT sucks and fck Chiang Kai-Shek and his family!!!

 

[Edison Chen]

ROC has killed 200 million Chinese during their 38 years of rule, both Beiyang and KMT were bad, but KMT was even worse than Beiyang.

KMT would make China half of its current size. With 1.4 billion population, what would be the future for Chinese people if our territory is reduced to less than 50%?



Without Mao, China would be one of US lapdogs, while US would still use Japan as another lapdog to make sure China wouldn't become too strong.

KMT sucks and fck Chiang Kai-Shek and his family!!!

You need to verify your numbers that KMT killed so many in 1927 purges. Do not bullshit by denigrating Chiang Kai Shek, who is one of the best leader. So tell me where you get the numbers. The Great Leap Forward is the single peace time event that killed the most people surpassing war time, 30 millions killed.

The intellectual class is well treated is true. I am not talking about peasant class. You talk about lack of scientist and engineers, but at its not KMT fault. KMT took over from Qing which has none of these at all, and she provide a basic education to many people, that allow PRC to quickly train engineers and scientist when she took over. Mao was destroying a lot of intellect.

Give me evidence saying landlord is miserable under KMT, and how you define landlord, on how big area of land. In comparison, landlord got massacre in land reform under Mao. Few millions died and even more was tortured. A lot of their women folks raped. Mao is a scumbag.

In old China, landless peasants are hired by landlords. How can "landlord not much better than" peasants as you claim?

While there are lack of modern farming under Chiang and that is not Chiang's fault. He took over from a dinasaur Qing dynasty. Under Mao, 30 million died in his experiment before he managed to figure out how to farm better.

KMT running one of the darkest period? You better study more. Without Chiang, China will be overrun by Japan.

Do not lie. I hate dishonest Chinese like you.

Chiang Kai Shek, a great leader