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Make In India - Fighter Jet musings - News, Developments, Updates - F16,F18, Gripen, Any other

Cross posting


HWF - SU-30MKIs, FGFA (2024 onwards)

MWF - M2K, MIG-29s, RAFALEs (2019-2022), AMCA ( 2027 onwards)

LWF - LCA, LCA MK1A (2019 onwards), LCA MK2 (2024 onwards)

So if LFW is post 2019, does it make any sense unless it is a 5th generation fighter replacing the LCA MK2 program? This is where LSA program replacing LCA MK2 makes sense.

What does LCA Mk2 bring on top of LCA MK1A? Isn't too little and too late?

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/dassault-rafale-tender-news-discussions-thread-2.230070/page-384#ixzz4LJpeU8ka

@Nilgiri What I know is that LCA MK2 is suppose to sport an indigenous AESA while MK1A would use an upgraded Israeli EL/M-2052 AESA radar.

The other change could be use of Kaveri engine

I do not see any value in pursuing LCA MK2 after MK1A has been conceived and approved.

@PARIKRAMA @RICK @randomradio @Ankit Kumar 002 @cerberus @Abingdonboy @MilSpec your thoughts?
 
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There was a news earlier that F18 has not yet received clearance from the US govt. so only F16 is on the table right now.

So the only realistic offer on the table is either the Grippen (if they make a delicious offer) or the Rafale. Needless to say, Grippen do not have the engine tech.

Everything else is just cacophony.
 
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There was a news earlier that F18 has not yet received clearance from the US govt. so only F16 is on the table right now.

So the only realistic offer on the table is either the Grippen (if they make a delicious offer) or the Rafale. Needless to say, Grippen do not have the engine tech.

Everything else is just cacophony.


RAFALE MII deal is assured now after the 36 deal has been signed and the French offer to partner on Kaveri engine program which is critical for the AMCA program.

F-16s deal would be part of DTTI and is needed to close CISMOA & BECA agreements

Gripen is proposing a JV for Gripen NG (5th gen). This would replace LCA MK2 program.
 
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RAFALE MII deal is assured now after the 36 deal has been signed and the French offer to partner on Kaveri engine program which is critical for the AMCA program.

F-16s deal would be part of DTTI and is needed to close CISMOA & BECA agreements

Gripen is proposing a JV for Gripen NG (5th gen). This would replace LCA MK2 program.

Yes, you are only rehashing what others have said earlier.

F16 is not happening.

Gripen engine is still made in USA. So unless they have a plan to make it in India, SAAB will be hard pressed.
 
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Cross posting


HWF - SU-30MKIs, FGFA (2024 onwards)

MWF - M2K, MIG-29s, RAFALEs (2019-2022), AMCA ( 2027 onwards)

LWF - LCA, LCA MK1A (2019 onwards), LCA MK2 (2024 onwards)

So if LFW is post 2019, does it make any sense unless it is a 5th generation fighter replacing the LCA MK2 program? This is where LSA program replacing LCA MK2 makes sense.

What does LCA Mk2 bring on top of LCA MK1A? Isn't too little and too late?

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/dassault-rafale-tender-news-discussions-thread-2.230070/page-384#ixzz4LJpeU8ka

@Nilgiri What I know is that LCA MK2 is suppose to sport an indigenous AESA while MK1A would use an upgraded Israeli EL/M-2052 AESA radar.

The other change could be use of Kaveri engine

I do not see any value in pursuing LCA MK2 after MK1A has been conceived and approved.

@PARIKRAMA @RICK @randomradio @Ankit Kumar 002 @cerberus @Abingdonboy @MilSpec your thoughts?

For me the matter is wide.
The issues are

1) Replacement of equipments which are past their expiry dates.
2) Bringing up the numbers .

The first one , is more important as a man in uniform losing life due to faulty equipment is the greatest shame for any nation.

And coming on numbers , we atleast need

A.) 1.25:1 Ratio in our favor in the western sector , and atleast 1/3rd of PLAAF in the north and east. Means about 450-500.

This means if I take 21 aircrafts to be a squadron , we need atleast 52 squadrons.

Now comes the two questions
1.) Money
2.) Options

Coming to first even if we are looking to spend 20-30 billion USD(not defence budget ,but budget for capital purchase) each year , for next 15 years , it is quite possible and money won't be a problem.

Now coming to options.

1.) Su30MKI
As of today we would be having ~232 of them. And the present order of 272 will be competed by 2019. Now here is what is disappointing. We have one working option here , and clowns at HAL have been "Successful in bringing down the production rate" from 15 in 2014-15 to 12 in 2015-16 , so as to extend the production .

What we need is to drill some arses, and get the production upto atleast 18 aircrafts a year.

And the Su30MKI line is the most probably one which will be transformed by 2024 to build FGFA.

So it gives us a window to utilise this option more.Order atleast 4-5 more squadrons , 2 for Strategic needs , and two more to get 2 Mig 21 squadron replaced. ( Which by the 18/Year rate from mid 2018, to 2024 is possible ) [Here I am taking that 18/year from next year we will compete the present orders earlier. ]

This is possible, economically good idea too.

If we actually utilise this option we would be able to operate 18 Full Strength Su30MKI squadrons .

The Spare Parts Manufacturing in India and Super Sukhoi upgrade is also important.

2.) Rafale

36+18 from France should be aimed by 2022.
And meanwhile a MII deal , to ensure that we have a manufacturing unit by 2020 in India ready to roll out Rafale by 2021.

We should not wait to negotiate the MII deal , rather compete it by 2017-18 start constructing the manufacturing unit , capable of at least 1 aircraft every two weeks , meaning atleast 24 a year. 33 A year would be still better.

And order 198 more , so as to have 12 compete squadrons.


Now when we opt for the above two we already have 30 squadrons by 2030. (Assuming Super Sukhoi upgrade adds a minimum of 15 years to the very first Su30MKI ).

EVEN IF WE OPT THE TWO , problem remains with the quick replacement of over 150 Mig21s.

Here I would choose the cheaper option which is not even being thought about.

They are

3.) More Mig29SMT

Yes , order 2 full squadrons straight and add them all before 2021, which is all possible.

Its 1.) Cheap 2.) Damm Effective , and given the low numbers and direct G2G deal it will be easier to sign ( as there will be little pressure from other big companies here ) , and will also ensure Russia is in our side for at least 5 more years.

These along with present UPG will mean 5 modern 4+ gen multirole aircrafts , capable of taking on any aircraft which our enemy posses as of today.

4.) Second one is 2nd Hand Mirages .

Yes , you read it right.
We have an infrastructure in place ,capability to MLU too , and the experience too. And it will surely be cheaper .

Now you would think , where do we get the 2nd hand airframes from , answer is Egypt, Qatar and UAE. You will ask why would they sell us ?

Now let me take them one by one , Qatar as known is getting Rafales , to replace its seldom used fleet of 12 Mirage 2000, which it wants to get rid off. Second is Egypt , which too is getting Rafales , but you would say , how can I say that they want to get rid of their too ? Because UAE in 2014-15 offered Egypt 24 UAE airframes to strengthen their Mirage Fleet of 1 squadron , but they didn't , this also shows that how they are looking to replace the small fleet.

Now coming to UAE , the case is well known , and the new closeness too. 36 of their 67 are almost only a decade old.Also they are not going to sell all before any new deal signed , its better to negotiate and get the half.

Adding 12(Qatar) + 16( Egypt) + 36( UAE), to our 50, we will have 5 Squadrons.
And please , no , buying second hand if it serves our purpose is not shameful . Don't bring that type of crap to me.


And you can see , together the 3 and 4 , we are going to add 5 squadrons very early , replacing almost 5 Mig21 squadrons. They are cheaper options as of today .

5.) Su35 MKI

Now you would think why I am bringing this ? The answer is J31, 3 Squadrons of improved Su35 MKI , ( Which has been discussed with our top brass quite a few times by Russians) is the solution of the gap which may happen if PAF manages to get J31 before we get FGFA.

6.) LCA MK1A.

HAL at present is severely screwing this for its benefits , which is criminal.

Two lines , one Private and one HAL , with orders of 5 squadrons each.

These will replace the remaining gap.



And these 6 options , do solve our problem.

Untill we want to pay more , with more delays and more lives lost , I don't feel necessity of any 2nd foreign fighter jet.

@PARIKRAMA @anant_s @Abingdonboy
I don't feel we should shell out another 20 billions for an aircraft whoes importance is only for next 5-7 years for replacing Mig21s , when we have very cheaper and very quick options.
 
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Cross posting


HWF - SU-30MKIs, FGFA (2024 onwards)

MWF - M2K, MIG-29s, RAFALEs (2019-2022), AMCA ( 2027 onwards)

LWF - LCA, LCA MK1A (2019 onwards), LCA MK2 (2024 onwards)

So if LFW is post 2019, does it make any sense unless it is a 5th generation fighter replacing the LCA MK2 program? This is where LSA program replacing LCA MK2 makes sense.

What does LCA Mk2 bring on top of LCA MK1A? Isn't too little and too late?

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/dassault-rafale-tender-news-discussions-thread-2.230070/page-384#ixzz4LJpeU8ka

@Nilgiri What I know is that LCA MK2 is suppose to sport an indigenous AESA while MK1A would use an upgraded Israeli EL/M-2052 AESA radar.

The other change could be use of Kaveri engine

I do not see any value in pursuing LCA MK2 after MK1A has been conceived and approved.

@PARIKRAMA @RICK @randomradio @Ankit Kumar 002 @cerberus @Abingdonboy @MilSpec your thoughts?
The LCA MK.2 isn't simply a MK.1A with the indigenous UTAAM AESA radar fitted in place of the EL/M-2052. The MK.2 is a substantial redesign of the the LCA MK.1 with increased wingspan, internal fuel capacity, uprated engine, improved EW systems and avionics.

Now with the tech coming from the Rafale deal and with French help the MK.2 can be further optimised as a significant step up on the MK.1 and can truly eclipse the Gripen E as far as India's needs are concerned.


With SAAB having very little in the way of IPRs on critical tech (propulsion and sensors) on the Gripen I am waiting for a coherent argument as to why it is in the slightest bit attractive to India when the LCA MK.2 will be on par with it in most areas and will naturally be a greater boost to India's industrial development.

So the F-18 the IAF might be somewhat interested in (ASH) is not cleared for export to India and the F-16 offers next to no real industrial or strategic gains for India.

Once again one comes back to the natural (and cleanest) force structure:

LCA/LCA MK.2
Rafale
MKI
FGFA

----

AMCA (somewhere down the line)

A SIGNIFICANT streamlining of the IAF and a multiplying of capabilities that really would be radical.


As @GuardianRED rightly says, keep it simple.



By the way guys. Let us not lose sight of what the LWF is meant to be to the IAF, it is not meant to be an uber fighter meant to excel in every domain as the country's premier fighter. This is how the Gripen is marketed to smaller airforces but where the IAF is concerned their LWF is a rear guard point defence fighter that would protect Indian airspace/gains to release the "heavies" (MKI, FGFA, Rafale, AMCA) to prosecute targets deep(er) in enemy territory and take the fight to them. On a day to day basis the LWF will be utilised primarily in air policing roles negating the need for the far more expensive to fly twin engined fighters leaving them in their hangers/training for combat.

The IAF DOESN'T NEED anything other than what the Mk.2 will offer; increased on station time, improved sensors for A2A combat and improved availability/maintain ability. It fits perfectly with their needs. Let us not be duped here, the LWF is the very lowest rung of the IAF's firepower index and it needs to be as simple and easy to keep flying as possible. The MMRCA and LFW are VERY different requirements, some simply conflate the two and assume the LWF needs to be the very best in it's class also...NO.

@Nilgiri @PARIKRAMA @anant_s

For me the matter is wide.
The issues are

1) Replacement of equipments which are past their expiry dates.
2) Bringing up the numbers .

The first one , is more important as a man in uniform losing life due to faulty equipment is the greatest shame for any nation.

And coming on numbers , we atleast need

A.) 1.25:1 Ratio in our favor in the western sector , and atleast 1/3rd of PLAAF in the north and east. Means about 450-500.

This means if I take 21 aircrafts to be a squadron , we need atleast 52 squadrons.

Now comes the two questions
1.) Money
2.) Options

Coming to first even if we are looking to spend 20-30 billion USD(not defence budget ,but budget for capital purchase) each year , for next 15 years , it is quite possible and money won't be a problem.

Now coming to options.

1.) Su30MKI
As of today we would be having ~232 of them. And the present order of 272 will be competed by 2019. Now here is what is disappointing. We have one working option here , and clowns at HAL have been "Successful in bringing down the production rate" from 15 in 2014-15 to 12 in 2015-16 , so as to extend the production .

What we need is to drill some arses, and get the production upto atleast 18 aircrafts a year.

And the Su30MKI line is the most probably one which will be transformed by 2024 to build FGFA.

So it gives us a window to utilise this option more.Order atleast 4-5 more squadrons , 2 for Strategic needs , and two more to get 2 Mig 21 squadron replaced. ( Which by the 18/Year rate from mid 2018, to 2024 is possible ) [Here I am taking that 18/year from next year we will compete the present orders earlier. ]

This is possible, economically good idea too.

If we actually utilise this option we would be able to operate 18 Full Strength Su30MKI squadrons .

The Spare Parts Manufacturing in India and Super Sukhoi upgrade is also important.

2.) Rafale

36+18 from France should be aimed by 2022.
And meanwhile a MII deal , to ensure that we have a manufacturing unit by 2020 in India ready to roll out Rafale by 2021.

We should not wait to negotiate the MII deal , rather compete it by 2017-18 start constructing the manufacturing unit , capable of at least 1 aircraft every two weeks , meaning atleast 24 a year. 33 A year would be still better.

And order 198 more , so as to have 12 compete squadrons.


Now when we opt for the above two we already have 30 squadrons by 2030. (Assuming Super Sukhoi upgrade adds a minimum of 15 years to the very first Su30MKI ).

EVEN IF WE OPT THE TWO , problem remains with the quick replacement of over 150 Mig21s.

Here I would choose the cheaper option which is not even being thought about.

They are

3.) More Mig29SMT

Yes , order 2 full squadrons straight and add them all before 2021, which is all possible.

Its 1.) Cheap 2.) Damm Effective , and given the low numbers and direct G2G deal it will be easier to sign ( as there will be little pressure from other big companies here ) , and will also ensure Russia is in our side for at least 5 more years.

These along with present UPG will mean 5 modern 4+ gen multirole aircrafts , capable of taking on any aircraft which our enemy posses as of today.

4.) Second one is 2nd Hand Mirages .

Yes , you read it right.
We have an infrastructure in place ,capability to MLU too , and the experience too. And it will surely be cheaper .

Now you would think , where do we get the 2nd hand airframes from , answer is Egypt, Qatar and UAE. You will ask why would they sell us ?

Now let me take them one by one , Qatar as known is getting Rafales , to replace its seldom used fleet of 12 Mirage 2000, which it wants to get rid off. Second is Egypt , which too is getting Rafales , but you would say , how can I say that they want to get rid of their too ? Because UAE in 2014-15 offered Egypt 24 UAE airframes to strengthen their Mirage Fleet of 1 squadron , but they didn't , this also shows that how they are looking to replace the small fleet.

Now coming to UAE , the case is well known , and the new closeness too. 36 of their 67 are almost only a decade old.Also they are not going to sell all before any new deal signed , its better to negotiate and get the half.

Adding 12(Qatar) + 16( Egypt) + 36( UAE), to our 50, we will have 5 Squadrons.
And please , no , buying second hand if it serves our purpose is not shameful . Don't bring that type of crap to me.


And you can see , together the 3 and 4 , we are going to add 5 squadrons very early , replacing almost 5 Mig21 squadrons. They are cheaper options as of today .

5.) Su35 MKI

Now you would think why I am bringing this ? The answer is J31, 3 Squadrons of improved Su35 MKI , ( Which has been discussed with our top brass quite a few times by Russians) is the solution of the gap which may happen if PAF manages to get J31 before we get FGFA.

6.) LCA MK1A.

HAL at present is severely screwing this for its benefits , which is criminal.

Two lines , one Private and one HAL , with orders of 5 squadrons each.

These will replace the remaining gap.



And these 6 options , do solve our problem.

Untill we want to pay more , with more delays and more lives lost , I don't feel necessity of any 2nd foreign fighter jet.

@PARIKRAMA @anant_s @Abingdonboy
I don't feel we should shell out another 20 billions for an aircraft whoes importance is only for next 5-7 years for replacing Mig21s , when we have very cheaper and very quick options.
Sorry bro I have to disagree with respect to your Mig-21 replacement options (although fully fully agree on the MKI production uptake and Rafale MII orders).

I understand what you are suggesting and understand the logic behind it but really this is short termism. Sure the 150 MiG-21s need replacing ASAP but does that mean you screw the IAF for the next 30-40 years with rash decisions that they will have to pay for (literally)?

Two of your fixes are heavy twin engined Russian fighters, as India knows from it own experience this is not a good combination. The whole point of the LWF/MiG-21 replacement is to be a point defence fighter with quick reaction times and high availability, neither the MiG-29 nor Su-35 offers a solution here. Get ready for a lifetime of pain in this scenario. There is a reason Russian equipment is being rejected in many areas by the Indian military these days.

On the second hand Mirages I think the boat has long since sailed. It's a short term fix that would lead to long term pain. I'm assuming in your plan these second hand M2ks would not be upgraded to the IAF's -5 Mk.2 standard meaning there were commonality issues with the rest of the IAF's M2k fleet and also these birds would be rather dated in terms of on board systems. Furthermore by the time the IAF had signed the deal, inducted and operationalised these birds they would be close to needing to be retired. There is a reason the Indian military rarely goes for second hand options. It is penny wise but pound foolish.


The solution lays in fixing the production issues of the LCA (whether HAL likes it or not give L&T a production line of their own)
 
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By the way guys. Let us not lose sight of what the LWF is meant to be to the IAF, it is not meant to be an uber fighter meant to excel in every domain as the country's premier fighter. This is how the Gripen is marketed to smaller airforces but where the IAF is concerned their LWF is a rear guard point defence fighter that would protect Indian airspace/gains to release the "heavies" (MKI, FGFA, Rafale, AMCA) to prosecute targets deep(er) in enemy territory and take the fight to them. On a day today basis the LWF will be utilised primarily in air policing roles negating the need for the far more expensive to fly twin engined fighters in their hangers/training for combat.

The IAF DOESN'T NEED anything other than what the Mk.2 will offer; increased on station time, improved sensors for A2A combat and improved availability/maintain ability. It fits perfectly with their needs. Let us not be duped here, the LWF is the very lowest rung of the IAF's firepower index and it needs to be as simple and easy to keep flying as possible. The MMRCA and LFW are VERY different requirements, some simply conflate the two and assume the LWF needs to be the very best in it's class also...NO.

Yup, now only if they don't sewer the whole thing by having only HAL produce it with its measly capacity and attitude.

If this can be changed along with a prompt MII for Rafale....I will be soaring so high hehe.
 
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If this can be changed along with a prompt MII for Rafale....I will be soaring so high hehe.
If it can be done (and I'm fairly confident it will be) this govt will have turned around the fortunes of the IAF and ensured their superiority in the region. In other words they have done in 2-5 years what the UPA couldn't do in decades.
 
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By the way guys. Let us not lose sight of what the LWF is meant to be to the IAF, it is not meant to be an uber fighter meant to excel in every domain as the country's premier fighter. This is how the Gripen is marketed to smaller airforces but where the IAF is concerned their LWF is a rear guard point defence fighter that would protect Indian airspace/gains to release the "heavies" (MKI, FGFA, Rafale, AMCA) to prosecute targets deep(er) in enemy territory and take the fight to them. On a day to day basis the LWF will be utilised primarily in air policing roles negating the need for the far more expensive to fly twin engined fighters leaving them in their hangers/training for combat.

The IAF DOESN'T NEED anything other than what the Mk.2 will offer; increased on station time, improved sensors for A2A combat and improved availability/maintain ability. It fits perfectly with their needs. Let us not be duped here, the LWF is the very lowest rung of the IAF's firepower index and it needs to be as simple and easy to keep flying as possible. The MMRCA and LFW are VERY different requirements, some simply conflate the two and assume the LWF needs to be the very best in it's class also...NO.
Right and there is no point in spending more then 40-45 million dollars apiece for such aircrafts until we want some specific tech going into our light fighters. $70 million or $85 million for gripen or F-16 or even the ASH is not a very viable option after the rafales.
 
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Right and there is no point in spending more then 40-45 million dollars apiece for such aircrafts until we want some specific tech going into our light fighters. $70 million or $85 million for gripen or F-16 or even the ASH is not a very viable option after the rafales.
Exactly. What's the point in spending >$60m on a plane that will only really be used to secure Indian airspace?
 
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Sorry bro I have to disagree with respect to your Mig-21 replacement options (although fully fully agree on the MKI production uptake and Rafale MII orders).

I understand what you are suggesting and understand the logic behind it but really this is short termism. Sure the 150 MiG-21s need replacing ASAP but does that mean you screw the IAF for the next 30-40 years with rash decisions that they will have to pay for (literally)?

Two of your fixes are heavy twin engined Russian fighters, as India knows from it own experience this is not a good combination. The whole point of the LWF/MiG-21 replacement is to be a point defence fighter with quick reaction times and high availability, neither the MiG-29 nor Su-35 offers a solution here. Get ready for a lifetime of pain in this scenario. There is a reason Russian equipment is being rejected in many areas by the Indian military these days.

On the second hand Mirages I think the boat has long since sailed. It's a short term fix that would lead to long term pain. I'm assuming in your plan these second hand M2ks would not be upgraded to the IAF's -5 Mk.2 standard meaning there were commonality issues with the rest of the IAF's M2k fleet and also these birds would be rather dated in terms of on board systems. Furthermore by the time the IAF had signed the deal, inducted and operationalised these birds they would be close to needing to be retired. There is a reason the Indian military rarely goes for second hand options. It is penny wise but pound foolish.


The solution lays in fixing the production issues of the LCA (whether HAL likes it or not give L&T a production line of their own)

On the Su35, well that's exclusively in case western state here gets its hands on J31.

2 Squadrons of Mig29s , if opted for has its own benefits.

1. The cost, No other option is so close.
2. And I am not telling to replace all Mig21s with it. Its two squadrons from me for a reason.

a) If we opt for such a deal , it won't be under pressure from the biggies due to its size and cost involved , means quick decision.

b) Deliveries , quick deliveries , here this is the key . The reason I suggest this is because they will come quick.

See the timeline between 2017-2023, only Su30MKI and to some extent Tejas will be produced. We will be left with a big hole to cover.

Two Squadrons of Mig29s here will mean 2 squadrons replaced.

And here I have taken in account
1.) The most optimistic scenario with Tejas.
2.) with Rafale and 3.) Su30MKI production.

Coming to second hand Mirages , I am not simply suggesting to buy them , but to upgrade them too. Of course the UAE ones won't need them as they are new and have had a upgrade too.

This option too is quick , means before 2022, we will havev all of them upgrade and inducted.

And no , Mig21s do not only mean a simple LWF , today lack of aircrafts means they are used as air superiority aircrafts while escorting Strike Aircrafts and even strike aircrafts in some cases.
There are 3 squadrons as of today placed such that you can guess how they are intended to be used.

Those are better replaced by a proper Air Superiority Fighter and a strike fighter.

Further I have added these, simultaneously taking that a private line for LCA with 24 aircrafts a year is also set up by 2019.

And one more thing , buying F16s or Gripens won't solve our problem of immediate replacement ,they won't be coming before all our Mig21s have gone ( by crashing themselves ).

Further the IAF expect to operate Mirage 2000 after upgrade for 15 years , and similar plans for Mig29 fleet too. So it can not be said that opting these in small numbers will cost IAF its future.

It will only solve our problems.
 
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On the Su35, well that's exclusively in case western state here gets its hands on J31.

2 Squadrons of Mig29s , if opted for has its own benefits.

1. The cost, No other option is so close.
2. And I am not telling to replace all Mig21s with it. Its two squadrons from me for a reason.

a) If we opt for such a deal , it won't be under pressure from the biggies due to its size and cost involved , means quick decision.

b) Deliveries , quick deliveries , here this is the key . The reason I suggest this is because they will come quick.

See the timeline between 2017-2023, only Su30MKI and to some extent Tejas will be produced. We will be left with a big hole to cover.

Two Squadrons of Mig29s here will mean 2 squadrons replaced.

And here I have taken in account
1.) The most optimistic scenario with Tejas.
2.) with Rafale and 3.) Su30MKI production.

Coming to second hand Mirages , I am not simply suggesting to buy them , but to upgrade them too. Of course the UAE ones won't need them as they are new and have had a upgrade too.

This option too is quick , means before 2022, we will havev all of them upgrade and inducted.

And no , Mig21s do not only mean a simple LWF , today lack of aircrafts means they are used as air superiority aircrafts while escorting Strike Aircrafts and even strike aircrafts in some cases.
There are 3 squadrons as of today placed such that you can guess how they are intended to be used.

Those are better replaced by a proper Air Superiority Fighter and a strike fighter.

Further I have added these, simultaneously taking that a private line for LCA with 24 aircrafts a year is also set up by 2019.

And one more thing , buying F16s or Gripens won't solve our problem of immediate replacement ,they won't be coming before all our Mig21s have gone ( by crashing themselves ).

Further the IAF expect to operate Mirage 2000 after upgrade for 15 years , and similar plans for Mig29 fleet too. So it can not be said that opting these in small numbers will cost IAF its future.

It will only solve our problems.
Why not order some su-35 from Russia.
Few months ago randomradio suggested that the further sukhois after the 272s will be ordered from Russian line i.e. made in Russia. Now we need to conclude super sukhoi program and for that we need to finish the fgfa agreement since a lot of tech will be integrated into the super sukhoi program.

@PARIKRAMA any inside inphormasun:P of the modi-putin meeting in goa and the fgfa contract signing.:smokin:
 
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Why not order some su-35 from Russia.
Few months ago randomradio suggested that the further sukhois after the 272s will be ordered from Russian lines made in Russia. Now we need to conclude super sukhoi program and for that we need to finish the fgfa agreement since a lot of tech will be integrated into the super sukhoi program.

@PARIKRAMA any inside inphormasun:P of the modi-putin meeting in goa and the fgfa contract signing.:smokin:

Su35MKI is a back up plan , when Pakistan gets J31 before our FGFA is ready.

Other than it , we won't need Su35.

Unless of course Indian Navy gets full charge of A&N defence and wants its own shore based heavy air superiority Fighter Jet which can take on everything Indian Ocean Nations and Power can offer.
 
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Su35MKI is a back up plan , when Pakistan gets J31 before our FGFA is ready.

Other than it , we won't need Su35.

Unless of course Indian Navy gets full charge of A&N defence and wants its own shore based heavy air superiority Fighter Jet which can take on everything Indian Ocean Nations and Power can offer.
Not sure about the Su-35 for the navy. They opted for mig-29 rather then the su-33 for viki.

Now we don't need su-35 mki against the j-31 for point defense. Rafales and the super sukhoi will be more then enough.

Su-35 for the A&N islands is an interesting idea but don't you think some good SAM cover and an squadron of LCA navy and rafales/migs stationed there will be a more viable option??
 
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