Mahmud Ghaznavi, the Afghan-Pak Sultan

[MultaniGuy]

Interesting bit of history you have there.
Well those times were better than today's.

 

[Hamza913]

Being at war does not justify the killing of innocents and destruction of religious sites (from the Prophet PBUH's last sermon). Don't know where you read that it's allowed in Islam. And even if it was can you think of anything more disgraceful than to plunder and loot them ? It is most certainly a crime against humanity. How would you feel if Israeli's were glorified for their actions against Muslims ?
As for your arguement about secularism (youve resorted to whataboutism btw) could you quote one incident where mosques were destroyed by the govt of a secular country ?

Innocent people? No, it doesn't (other than collateral, but even then you should be very conservative in your acceptance of collateral).

Religious sites? Islamically, it does kinda say otherwise AFAIK. Feel free to correct me if you wish.

Plundering and looting is literally what war was back then, you used it to develop your empire. It's how Mahmud Ghaznavi transformed Ghazni and Lahore into great cities.

Israelis do glorify their actions, and I see no qualms in them doing so, provided they don't mind others doing the same. They have performed well enough to get the right to gloat.

It's not against secularism, rather, certain countries that claim to be secular but act otherwise in practise (e.g Hindustan).

Ghaznawi was a Persianised Turk and king of Khorasan. His army consisted overwhelmingly Pashtuns, Turks and Persians of current day Afghanistan. His kingdom consisted of entire of present day Afghanistan, entire of present day Tajikistan, parts of Iran, parts of Pakistan, small part of Uzbekistan and some minor Turkic countries.

He wasn't an ethnic Afghan, and definitely not Pakistani. He was a Turk from then Khorasan.

His army also had a significant number of Punjabis in it.

He was born in Afghanistan, so that makes him Afghan. Ethnically, he was a Persianised Turk, you have many Farsiwans and Turks in Afghanistan so yes he does count as Afghan even ethnically.

He ruled over modern day Pakistan, developed it significantly, had many Pakistanis work for him in his military and administration, has influenced Pakistani culture immensely, and many of his people migrated to Pakistan under his rule. He also established Islam in the region, which allowed Pakistan to exist in the first place. Lahore was his 2nd largest city and the winter capital, not to mention a significant chunk of Pakistan (KPK, Baluchistan and FATA) has historically been associated with Afghanistan/Khorasan. He's just as much a Pakistani hero as he is an Afghan or Turkic one.

 

[Ray-of-Hope]

His army also had a significant number of Punjabis in it.

He was born in Afghanistan, so that makes him Afghan. Ethnically, he was a Persianised Turk, you have many Farsiwans and Turks in Afghanistan so yes he does count as Afghan even ethnically.

He ruled over modern day Pakistan, developed it significantly, had many Pakistanis work for him in his military and administration, has influenced Pakistani culture immensely, and many of his people migrated to Pakistan under his rule. He also established Islam in the region, which allowed Pakistan to exist in the first place. Lahore was his 2nd largest city and the winter capital, not to mention a significant chunk of Pakistan (KPK, Baluchistan and FATA) has historically been associated with Afghanistan/Khorasan. He's just as much a Pakistani hero as he is an Afghan or Turkic one.

Just because someone shaped our modern history doesn't mean he was a Pakistani.

Prophet Muhammad was an Arab from Saudi and he can still be classified as an Saudi Arab simply because A, the terminology of "Arab" hasn't changed and B, the geographic location of his place of birth, Saudi, hasn't changed either. It'll be ridiculous to claim him as Pakistani, Afghan, Iranian, Turkish, etc etc just because Islam has shaped history of 1.6 billion people for past 1400 years

Pashtuns and Baloch are Iranic people, but the term Iranian has been so influenced by other factors that you won't find any Baloch or Pashtun call himself an Iranian. Even though ethnically they are

Yes he was a Muslim hero and I can see where you are coming from, but ethnic terminology and nationality (which didn't even exist back then) have been changed and influenced a lot everywhere

 

[Fawad alam]

Mahmud Ghaznavi was a powerful ruler of the Ghaznavid Empire. He was born in Ghazni, and ruled over the Ghaznavid Empire for a period of 32 years, from 998 to 1030 AD. He was the first ruler to use the title of Sultan, which reflected the fact that he recognised the Abbasid Caliphate as being suzerain over him. He was also the first major Muslim leader to come from South Asia.

Under Ghaznavi, the empire expanded to include most of Afghanistan, Pakistan, Central Asia and Iran, however, the main territories of the Ghaznavid Empire were considered to be Afghanistan and Pakistan, which is reflected by the fact that the two largest cities of the empire existed within the boundaries of those two nations (Ghazni and Lahore). Mahmud Ghaznavi also launched numerous raids into Hindustan, looting and depopulating numerous cities as well as destroying/damaging many statues and temples, such as the famous Soomnath Temple. He even went as far as to vow he would raid Hindustan on a yearly basis for as long as possible.

Ghaznavi maintained a large and powerful army, which mostly consisted of Turks, Pashtuns and Punjabis. Ghaznavi would often use these different ethnic groups to keep each other in check, e.g if Pashtuns started causing trouble he would send Punjabis to deal with them. What's most notable about his military is that it had many people of Hindu origin fighting within it, and even several of his generals were of a Hindu background. However, it can be assumed with relative certainty that these people were only Hindu by birth, and were unlikely to have actually practised the religion since Ghaznavid soldiers we involved in frequent attacks on Hindu holy sites as mentioned earlier. The Ghaznavid army was also the first Muslim army to make use of war elephants.

It was also under Mahmud Ghaznavis rule that Islam and Persian culture was firmly established in Pakistan, with many people from Pakistan converting to Islam (thanks to missionaries) and many foreign Muslims migrating to the region. Since these Muslims were mostly of a Persian background, this also allowed for Persian culture to be established in Pakistan, particularly Lahore which became a hub for Persian culture. The effects of this are still seen today, e.g Urdu has many Farsi loan words and is written in Nastaliq script.

Mahmud Ghaznavi is remembered most fondly by people from Afghanistan and Pakistan. He is liked in Afghanistan because he was born there, developed the region significantly (especially Ghazni) and had many Afghans working in his army and administration. He is liked in Pakistan because he firmly established Islam in the region (which allowed for Pakistan to exist in the first place), developed the region significantly (especially Lahore), brought Persian culture which influenced Pakistan immensely, had many Pakistanis work in his army and administration, brought along with him many people who settled and intermarried with the local population of Pakistan, and because the areas of Baluchistan, KPK and FATA have also been historically associated with Afghanistan. The Pakistani military has also named a missile after him. Many Turks also speak fondly of him as he had Turkic ancestry and employed many Turks in his army and administration.

He is most hated by Hindustanis as he looted and depopulated their country on a regular basis.

Ghaznavid Empire under Mahmud Ghaznavi:

View attachment 464565

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmud_of_Ghazni
http://storyofpakistan.com/mahmud-ghaznavi
http://historypak.com/mahmood-ghaznavi/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghaznavids

Unable to find rulers like him these days, he was a real super hero with high courage, braveness and down to earth same time
We need to inform our new generation about these real life super heroes,
Please share more info like this.

 

[Hamza913]

Just because someone shaped our modern history doesn't mean he was a Pakistani.

Prophet Muhammad was an Arab from Saudi and he can still be classified as an Saudi Arab simply because A, the terminology of "Arab" hasn't changed and B, the geographic location of his place of birth, Saudi, hasn't changed either. It'll be ridiculous to claim him as Pakistani, Afghan, Iranian, Turkish, etc etc just because Islam has shaped history of 1.6 billion people for past 1400 years

Pashtuns and Baloch are Iranic people, but the term Iranian has been so influenced by other factors that you won't find any Baloch or Pashtun call himself an Iranian. Even though ethnically they are

Yes he was a Muslim hero and I can see where you are coming from, but ethnic terminology and nationality (which didn't even exist back then) have been changed and influenced a lot everywhere

I know, I was only justifying why Pakistanis view him as a hero, and why we are perfectly right to do so.

 

[Imran Khan]

calling ghaznavi paksitani is like calling next door nighbor old man father . wo afghaniyoo ka baap tha hamara nhi

 

[Ray-of-Hope]

I know, I was only justifying why Pakistanis view him as a hero, and why we are perfectly right to do so.

Oh yeah I don't disagree with that. I guess I misunderstood the whole point here

calling ghaznavi paksitani is like calling next door nighbor old man father . wo afghaniyoo ka baap tha hamara nhi

I guess it were the Afghans who named our missiles after him too then

 

[Imran Khan]

Oh yeah I don't disagree with that. I guess I misunderstood the whole point here


I guess it were the Afghans who named our missiles after him too then

yeah most of them named on afghans sir

 

[Hamza913]

Unable to find rulers like him these days, he was a real super hero with high courage, braveness and down to earth same time
We need to inform our new generation about these real life super heroes,
Please share more info like this.

Asalamu Alaikum

I've made numerous threads on these Islamic historical figures of the region, you can check them out if you wish.

calling ghaznavi paksitani is like calling next door nighbor old man father . wo afghaniyoo ka baap tha hamara nhi

Asalamu Alaikum

I'm not calling him Pakistani, I'm saying it's very understandable as to why many Pakistanis view him as a hero.

yeah most of them named on afghans sir

Only Ghaznavi and Ghauri.

Abdalis birthplace is disputed so he doesn't count.

 

[ashok mourya]

Pakistanis are even bankrupt of heroes...they have to hide behind afghan king..when attacked and made them slaves..no where in the world they honour the attackers...any way name a missile on chengiz khan too....

 

[Ray-of-Hope]

yeah most of them named on afghans sir

Yeah and for a valid reason. Our Islamic history is shaped by MANY non-natives in first place

Abdalis birthplace is disputed so he doesn't count.

According to most history books Abdali was most likely born in Herat. Even if he wasn't then his father was from Kandahar, mother from Herat, the capital of his empire was Kandahar (and after his death Kabul) and formal language spoken to his army and at home was Dari. Plus he was an ethnic Pashtun who were more commonly known as Afghans back in the days.

If anything then Abdali is the only dynasty that was truly Afghan in the past, current and actual sense

 

[AfrazulMandal]

What's most notable about his military is that it had many people of Hindu origin fighting within it, and even several of his generals were of a Hindu background. However, it can be assumed with relative certainty that these people were only Hindu by birth, and were unlikely to have actually practised the religion since Ghaznavid soldiers we involved in frequent attacks on Hindu holy sites as mentioned earlier. The Ghaznavid army was also the first Muslim army to make use of war elephants.

True. But they accepted Islam first.

What's there to be great about him or what he did,unless you think the religion he followed and his god will be proud of him disrespecting others faith.

You will do well to read about the exploits of our Prophet SAW. What Ghaznavi did may hurt you, but he was a practicing Muslim and what he did was totally jaiz.

He is most hated by Hindustanis as he looted and depopulated their country on a regular basis.

Had he proceeded further and established a more permanent rule, we would not be facing this humiliation and injustice. He was not perfect. I get that, but he tried.

 

[Hamza913]

True. But they accepted Islam first.


You will do well to read about the exploits of our Prophet SAW. What Ghaznavi did may hurt you, but he was a practicing Muslim and what he did was totally jaiz.

Asalamu Alaikum

It actually doesn't say if they accepted Islam, but yes it can be assumed that many of them would have or at the very least rejected Hinduism.

Had he proceeded further and established a more permanent rule, we would not be facing this humiliation and injustice. He was not perfect. I get that, but he tried.

He thought it would be more beneficial to raid Hindustan rather than consolidate his rule there.

It was the Ghurids who consolidated Islam firmly within Hindustan.

 

[AfrazulMandal]

Pakistanis are even bankrupt of heroes...they have to hide behind afghan king..when attacked and made them slaves..no where in the world they honour the attackers...any way name a missile on chengiz khan too....

What's the difference between Afghan/Pak/etc? Nations are all temporary. God's religion is permanent.

 

[Ray-of-Hope]

Pakistanis are even bankrupt of heroes...they have to hide behind afghan king..when attacked and made them slaves..no where in the world they honour the attackers...any way name a missile on chengiz khan too....

Nations didn't exist but tribes, ethnicities etc did who formed part of one empire or another.

Think about those Indians that not only honoured their invaders like the British but also tried very hard to become like them. The embarrassment can still be witnessed with 3rd/4th generation Indians here in the UK