M-270 USA : Are we getting it or not ?

[ares]

$ 100 Billon 'losses' are not actual material losses, but severely inflated and projected GDP losses.

Basically Pakistani economists take their GDP figures from 2002 and then compare to a projected GDP of 2014,( had their been no WOT) and apply the principle of 'Money not made is money lost' and give us this severely inflated 100 billion figure

But what they do not consider is..

Before WOT Pakistan was under severe sanctions it economy was averaging 2% growth.

After WOT Pakistan started growing 6-7% till 2008(when the world economy slowed down and WOT actually made its way to Pakistani cities).

And this huge growth in Pakistani economy(b/w 2002 and 2008) where it almost doubled was direct result of Pakistani decision to participate in US WOT.
1) Sanction on Pakistan were removed.
2) Pakistan got huge amount of economic and military aid from US.
3) Most of Pakistani debt to multilateral institutions like IMF, world bank etc were either written off or rescheduled with American help.

This freed up Pakistani capital, which was invested and led to a temporary consumer driven growth in Pakistan.

However Pakistani economist do not give heed to economic boom they had due to WOT..just blame WOT on its economy tanking after 2008, which was mainly due to world economy slowing down.

 

[Kompromat]

But none of your comments have anything to do with the fact that the desire for US military hardware remains high simply because of its quality, and the easy financing terms available, right?

US is a gunsmith, we don't like him but we do go to him when we need guns. Pure business!

If the US refuses to cell, we can go to buy from China or develop Hatf IX further along with CF bomblets.

 

[VCheng]

@C130 - The real price we have paid for this war is incalculable. The biggest price was our sovereignty and the mercenary state we have come to become, killing our own kin to please a superpower we share nothing with.

Please note that the Pakistani sovereignty was lost as a mercenary state way back when General Zia decided to participate in the Afghan jihad. Pakistan's kinship with USA goes back to the days of SEATO and CENTO, and that was a voluntary choice made by Pakistan back then. All of this is nothing new.

US is a gunsmith, we don't like him but we do go to him when we need guns. Pure business!

If the US refuses to cell, we can go to buy from China or develop Hatf IX further along with CF bomblets.

Of course, that is a fair comment. Business is business!

 

[C130]

@C130 - The real price we have paid for this war is incalculable. The biggest price was our sovereignty and the mercenary state we have come to become, killing our own kin to please a superpower we share nothing with.

let's be real Pakistan harbors terrorists and terrorists camp right??
you all are selling yourself to the Chinese right now, and look the Chinese are pretty interested in what goes in Pakistan tribal regions since terror attacks happening in Xinjing are probably being trained in Pakistan

so this is a problem you all were going to half to deal with sooner or later U.S states involvement in or not.

strings comes attached just as much for Chinese assistance as U.S

 

[VCheng]

Dont quote me insect.

Quoted to preserve the record.

 

[Kompromat]

$ 100 Billon 'losses' are not actual material losses, but severely inflated and projected GDP losses.

Basically Pakistani economists take their GDP figures from 2002 and then compare to a projected GDP of 2014,( had their been no WOT) and apply the principle of 'Money not made is money lost' and give us this severely inflated 100 billion figure

But what they do not consider is..

Before WOT Pakistan was under severe sanctions it economy was averaging 2% growth.

After WOT Pakistan started growing 6-7% till 2008(when the world economy slowed down and WOT actually made its way to Pakistani cities).

And this huge growth in Pakistani economy(b/w 2002 and 2008) where it almost doubled was direct result of Pakistani decision to participate in US WOT.
1) Sanction on Pakistan were removed.
2) Pakistan got huge amount of economic and military aid from US.
3) Most of Pakistani debt to multilateral institutions like IMF, world bank etc were either written off or rescheduled with American help.

This freed up Pakistani capital, which was invested and led to a temporary consumer driven growth in Pakistan.

However Pakistani economist do not give heed to economic boom they had due to WOT..just blame WOT on its economy tanking after 2008, which was mainly due to world economy slowing down.

All of that remains the darkest hour of our nation's existence.

 

[nangyale]

let's be real Pakistan harbors terrorists and terrorists camp right??
you all are selling yourself to the Chinese right now, and look the Chinese are pretty interested in what goes in Pakistan tribal regions since terror attacks happening in Xinjing are probably being trained in Pakistan

so this is a problem you all were going to half to deal with sooner or later U.S states involvement in or not.

strings comes attached just as much for Chinese assistance as U.S

The people you are calling terrorist today were the best buddies of the US when they were fighting against the USSR. They were not only trained in Pakistan but also in the west. The money and weapons were mostly supplied by the CIA.
So please spare us your lectures about terrorist and terrorist camps.

What Pakistan has with China is a strategic partnership. Where both the parties gain something.
The anti-Chinese terrorists might have more connections with the US intelligence than with the Pakistanis. After all the US hasn't really stopped using AQ type of organisations to further it's objective (Syria is a case in point).

 

[Kompromat]

let's be real Pakistan harbors terrorists and terrorists camp right??
you all are selling yourself to the Chinese right now, and look the Chinese are pretty interested in what goes in Pakistan tribal regions since terror attacks happening in Xinjing are probably being trained in Pakistan

• Soviet Union wanted a dry transit to Karachi which the US didn't want, since they were engaged in Vietnam and they didn't want the USSR to access warm water ports. Pakistan's democratically elected PM Bhutto agreed to USSR which was in our interest. The USSR built a huge steel mill in Karachi out of their own pocket to sweeten the deal.
  
  
• US threatened Bhutto if he didn't refuse the transit, he refused.
• US then supported a rogue General, Zia ul Haq to mount a military coup which removed Bhutto establishment which was elected by 70% votes and replaced it with an American funded military junta which destroyed our society within 10 years. (Similar to what the US did in Iran with President Mussadaq)
  
  
• Zia did what he was brought to do, he refused the USSR a transit to Karachi, they got pissed and vowed to take it by force.
  
  
• They wanted to use Afghanistan which was their ally to attack Pakistan, which didn't work so they staged an assassination of the Afghan leadership to create a pretext of invasion and later entered Afghanistan with an objective in mind to cease Pakistan's coastal areas in coordination with India which was its ally. Pakistan was in a position where it couldn't have held a two front war against India and a Superpower.
  
  
• That war killed 1 Million Muslims, displaced 7 million and it was all done to please a Christian supower we have nothing to do with.
  
  
• Pakistan was the US's mercenary in Afghanistan and we were forced into that war by the US. Our best interest was to cooperate with the USSR to build our economy so we can give our people the basic necessities of livelihood.
  
  
• The 'extremism' started in 1979 and it was a direct consequence of the US imperialist thought.

so this is a problem you all were going to half to deal with sooner or later U.S states involvement in or not. strings comes attached just as much for Chinese assistance as U.S

Strings come with all deals, however unlike American Christians, the Chinese Buddhists don't make Muslims kill Muslims.

 

[ares]

All of that remains the darkest hour of our nation's existence.

Darkest hour of Pakistani existence was, when it created such Jihadi group on it soil to either fight against Soviets and subsequently nurtured them for Indians.

It was just a matter of time, either Pakistan would have to clean them up themselves or be consumed by them and become another Afghanistan.

9/11 was just the catalyst, which sped up the inevitable ,ingredients were already all there in Pakistan.

 

[VCheng]

US then supported a rogue General, Zia ul Haq to mount a military coup which removed Bhutto establishment which was elected by 70% votes and replaced it with an American funded military junta which destroyed our society within 10 years. (Similar to what the US did in Iran with President Mussadaq)
Zia did what he was brought to do, he refused the USSR a transit to Karachi, they got pissed and vowed to take it by force.

So wait a minute, did the Army do what was best for Pakistan, or did it put its own self-interest before country?

 

[C130]

• Soviet Union wanted a dry transit to Karachi which the US didn't want, since they were engaged in Vietnam and they didn't want the USSR to access warm water ports. Pakistan's democratically elected PM Bhutto agreed to USSR which was in our interest. The USSR built a huge steel mill in Karachi out of their own pocket to sweeten the deal.
  
  
• US threatened Bhutto if he didn't refuse the transit, he refused.
• US then supported a rogue General, Zia ul Haq to mount a military coup which removed Bhutto establishment which was elected by 70% votes and replaced it with an American funded military junta which destroyed our society within 10 years. (Similar to what the US did in Iran with President Mussadaq)
  
  
• Zia did what he was brought to do, he refused the USSR a transit to Karachi, they got pissed and vowed to take it by force.
  
  
• They wanted to use Afghanistan which was their ally to attack Pakistan, which didn't work so they staged an assassination of the Afghan leadership to create a pretext of invasion and later entered Afghanistan with an objective in mind to cease Pakistan's coastal areas in coordination with India which was its ally. Pakistan was in a position where it couldn't have held a two front war against India and a Superpower.
  
  
• That war killed 1 Million Muslims, displaced 7 million and it was all done to please a Christian supower we have nothing to do with.
  
  
• Pakistan was the US's mercenary in Afghanistan and we were forced into that war by the US. Our best interest was to cooperate with the USSR to build our economy so we can give our people the basic necessities of livelihood.
  
  
• The 'extremism' started in 1979 and it was a direct consequence of the US imperialist thought.

Strings come with all deals, however unlike American Christians, the Chinese Buddhists don't make Muslims kill Muslims.

muslims have been killing muslims for thousand plus years this is nothing new.
i agree though U.S has done stuff to cause strife all over the planet and we should keep our noses out of it
but to think the Chinese won't do the same to protect it's interests is ignorant.
if the insurgency in China spreads we'll see how they react especially if the terrorists are being trained in Pakistan and fighting in Syria.

 

[Kompromat]

So wait a minute, did the Army do what was best for Pakistan, or did it put its own self-interest before country?

• No Military coup had a reasonable justification to take place.
• All military coups in Pakistan were aided, abetted and funded by America.
• America is the enemy of democracy in Pakistan because it knows that the people of Pakistan will not tolerate an alliance with the US because of the evil role the US has played in establishment and maintenance of tyranny in Pakistan.
  

1: Dictator General Iskander Mirza with American Ambassador Horace A Hildreth in 1955

2: Dictator Field Marshal Ayub Khan received by the US President JFK

3: Dictator General Zia ul Haq with US President Reagan.

4: Dictator President Musharraf with US President Bush.

muslims have been killing muslims for thousand plus years this is nothing new.
i agree though U.S has done stuff to cause strife all over the planet and we should keep our noses out of it
but to think the Chinese won't do the same to protect it's interests is ignorant.
if the insurgency in China spreads we'll see how they react especially if the terrorists are being trained in Pakistan and fighting in Syria.

There is only one thing we want from you.

Please leave us alone!

Your nation's interference in our country creates war, you have screwed our people for way too long. If we get a referendum to decide weather to keep an American embassy in Pakistan or not, it will result in America having a single room consulate in Islamabad instead of a colonial headquarter your nation is building.

 

[HRK]

let's be real Pakistan harbors terrorists and terrorists camp right??

& US is the partner in crime .....

and look the Chinese are pretty interested in what goes in Pakistan tribal regions since terror attacks happening in Xinjing are probably being trained in Pakistan

Be reasonable dear be reasonable ..... from last 30+ years there was no such issue as far as China was concern .... but these events are happening 'now' is a clue itself .... only if you can analysis .....

 

[Ray_of_Hope]

So wait a minute, did the Army do what was best for Pakistan, or did it put its own self-interest before country?

U surely cannot call all the army responsible for the wrong doing of a few men...can u?????

 

[C130]

alright boys let's get out of Pakistan and stay out of Pakistan affairs!!
i couldn't agree more.
don't need a embassy consulate or what not.
the middle east is in turmoil and we had a hand in it.
let them sort it out.