Kerala High Court helps Hindu-Muslim couple who got death threats, get married

[haviZsultan]

It doesn't matter whether my country is a better place for me to live or not. But it will remain my home irrespective of that. Is it not the same with you in spite of all the violence in your country? Would you prefer leaving your country because of all the hardships you face? And no I am not a "typical head nodding" Indian Muslim and you can see that through my posts on this forum.

Your loyalty to India is touching and I have seen it in some muslims there. My uncle had the same attitude. Even defended India though he did admit that there was a time when muslims left there unequivocally defended Pakistan. He said this was changing. Anyway look how that went. A loyal Indian muslim was not left alone.

I think an improvement of India Pakistan relations will help minorities in each country. The fundamental cause or root problem of this is mostly that the view that minorities are traitors to land, people and nation (A thinking existing in Pakistan too which we must fight: I will never let any member of my adopted countries minority community be affected negatively while living in Pak like we were in India.) and defeating this is the first step for muslims loyal to India.

I think there should also be consensus that raising the issue of their rights does not mean that the muslims are not loyal to India. In my nana's case or the case of other relatives that is different as they were always loyal to Pakistan but it will help you guys who as you said wouldn't leave the country because of loyalty to it.

I am not loyal to India and have had khandaan members killed by them, so obviously I will have views on them that are negative. That does not mean there are no good things about said nation or that all muslims in said nation suffer/suffered the same oppression as my family there. But do note that when a persons rights are just not taken away from him but also his loved ones (lets say a muslims) he seeks asylum elsewhere which is actually better than picking up arms.

Note that I am a Pakistani regardless of my background. But it is not my job anymore to volubly defend interests of muslims left there. It is their job which I believe they haven't done well. You can't find halal food in Lucknow and what some Islamophobe like Tasleema Nasreen we can't tolerate. Muslims left there don't have the right priorities.

Anyway the fact that Pakistan has given asylum and a home to many migrants means for us Pakistan will always be a friend of muslims left. I advise you to look at Pakistan more favorably because what I have seen of the Indian loyalist muslims is that they at times tend to bash Pakistan. I don't know the reason. Perhaps its because to prove their loyalty to India and Hindus they have to be hostile to Pakistan-they have to adopt the way some Hindus see Pakistan.

Anyway keep posting. Damn I'm starting typing on dozens of pages.

Strangely I have a question for a mallu right wing @$$hole that I wish to ask confidentially. This relates to religious conversions.

I can't believe I'm asking this @Marxist this one might be up your alley

@SpArK someone calling you.

 

[ravi kiran]

That is what you want to believe. You believe that you automatically qualify as a patriot because of your religion and also get to judge my patriotism. So who gave you the authority to judge me?

sorry to say but it is fact what i stated earlier. there are exceptions to every thing. but most muslims praise and love pakistan.
its not because my religion that i am patriot but its because i consider nation above my religion.

but muslims consider Islam more important than nation. they believe in muslim brotherhood(ummah). thats why they consider pakistani brothers and Indians(hindus) as kafirs.

Political Jihad in India: Barkati (Imam, Tipu Sultan Mosque, Kolkata), calls a Jihad. Bukhari (Imam, Jama Mosque, Delhi), boosts Communal Separatism.

Inviting Sharif, not Modi to Jama Masjid: Shahi Imam

Indian Muslims love for Pakistan

67 Indian Muslims celebrates Pakistan victory against India in Cricket | Most Intolerant Religion

 

[jamahir]

What do you think India is heaven for us? We are also suffering here but we don't bash our nation.

if you too are suffering then you should be questioning your nation's establishment and culture, instead of screaming patriotic words whenever someone else questions... questioning is the only way to improvement.

india is now officially "suicide capital of the word" and yet you shout "bharat mata ki jai"... why??

 

[The_Showstopper]

sorry to say but it is fact what i stated earlier. there are exceptions to every thing. but most muslims praise and love pakistan.
its not because my religion that i am patriot but its because i consider nation above my religion.

but muslims consider Islam more important than nation. they believe in muslim brotherhood(ummah). thats why they consider pakistani brothers and Indians(hindus) as kafirs.

Political Jihad in India: Barkati (Imam, Tipu Sultan Mosque, Kolkata), calls a Jihad. Bukhari (Imam, Jama Mosque, Delhi), boosts Communal Separatism.

Inviting Sharif, not Modi to Jama Masjid: Shahi Imam

Indian Muslims love for Pakistan

67 Indian Muslims celebrates Pakistan victory against India in Cricket | Most Intolerant Religion

And how do you prove that, well with the help of Hindutva propaganda sites.... Is that how you support your "facts"? Common man, Is that all you can come up with?

 

[ravi kiran]

And how do you prove that, well with the help of Hindutva propaganda sites.... Is that how you support your "facts"? Common man, Is that all you can come up with?

It's not because hindutva propaganda.
Tell me one thing why muslims hate to say vande ma taram??
And please give me logical answer. Don't tell me religious bs.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

It's not because hindutva propaganda.
Tell me one thing why muslims hate to say vande ma taram??
And please give me logical answer. Don't tell me religious bs.

Ask @levina. ISIS folks will have their reason, but that would be fringe.

I think an improvement of India Pakistan relations will help minorities in each country.

Are you serious? Pakistan has no minorities when compared to India...anymore.

 

[The_Showstopper]

Your loyalty to India is touching and I have seen it in some muslims there. My uncle had the same attitude. Even defended India though he did admit that there was a time when muslims left there unequivocally defended Pakistan. He said this was changing. Anyway look how that went. A loyal Indian muslim was not left alone.

Thank you for your kind words. I would put it this way, some of those Indian muslims are/were never against India as a country but rather had and some still breed hatred for Hindus, So that doesn't mean they are not loyal to India but are rather allergic to Hindus...

I think an improvement of India Pakistan relations will help minorities in each country. The fundamental cause or root problem of this is mostly that the view that minorities are traitors to land, people and nation (A thinking existing in Pakistan too which we must fight: I will never let any member of my adopted countries minority community be affected negatively while living in Pak like we were in India.) and defeating this is the first step for muslims loyal to India.

Yes that would give one less of a reason for bigots to fuel hatred....

I think there should also be consensus that raising the issue of their rights does not mean that the muslims are not loyal to India. In my nana's case or the case of other relatives that is different as they were always loyal to Pakistan but it will help you guys who as you said wouldn't leave the country because of loyalty to it.

Many rational Hindus agree to that...

I am not loyal to India and have had khandaan members killed by them, so obviously I will have views on them that are negative. That does not mean there are no good things about said nation or that all muslims in said nation suffer/suffered the same oppression as my family there. But do note that when a persons rights are just not taken away from him but also his loved ones (lets say a muslims) he seeks asylum elsewhere which is actually better than picking up arms.

Why would you be loyal to India, you are Pakistani and I would expect you to be loyal to Pakistan. Sad to hear about your relatives but that is also the case with Hindus/Sikhs as well. Everyone involved suffered in that rot...

Note that I am a Pakistani regardless of my background. But it is not my job anymore to volubly defend interests of muslims left there. It is their job which I believe they haven't done well. You can't find halal food in Lucknow and what some Islamophobe like Tasleema Nasreen we can't tolerate. Muslims left there don't have the right priorities.

You don't have to, we can do that job by our self, Thank you. I believe we've been doing quite OK in that field. And I am not sure, how did you come to that conclusion that halal food is not available? I did hear you saying that previously in a different thread. Well to correct you my friend, I have friends living in Lucknow and when I asked them the same, they literally laughed at me for that. I can assure you mate that Halal food/meat is easily available over there including the yummy Tunde kabab... And speaking of Taslima Nasreen, well I don't think she is a Islamophobe and I've seen her twitter posts where she equally condemned the Sanghi goons and White Supremacists as much as she does with Islamic radicals. Anyways she has her freedom of Speech(even if she is wrong) and if any one has a problem with her utterances, they can debate, protest, rebut her but banning her is not the answer...

Anyway the fact that Pakistan has given asylum and a home to many migrants means for us Pakistan will always be a friend of muslims left. I advise you to look at Pakistan more favorably because what I have seen of the Indian loyalist muslims is that they at times tend to bash Pakistan. I don't know the reason. Perhaps its because to prove their loyalty to India and Hindus they have to be hostile to Pakistan-they have to adopt the way some Hindus see Pakistan.

I don't have anything against the people of Pakistan, but the government of yours have always acted against your/our interests. Look I am not going to start out with Pakistan terrorism and all that but we do have problems. Whenever there is terrorist attack, my people die. So is that reason not enough for me view your government unfavorably. Now you and me can contest the terrorism claims/counter claims till eternity but the perception would still remain the same.... And No, this perception is not forced on us, not at least on me....

It's not because hindutva propaganda.
Tell me one thing why muslims hate to say vande ma taram??
And please give me logical answer. Don't tell me religious bs.

I don't really understand what you meant by the bolded part. But let me try explaining you, Now many muslims believe that Vande Mataram literally means Mother, I bow to you. Its a blasphemy in Islam to bow to anyone else except God. Now this answer of mine is as logical as it can be.... And please do care to explain me why does chanting/singing this song matter so much that not singing it literally raises doubts over one's patriotism....

 

[ravi kiran]

Thank you for your kind words. I would put it this way, some of those Indian muslims are/were never against India as a country but rather had and some still breed hatred for Hindus, So that doesn't mean they are not loyal to India but are rather allergic to Hindus...


Yes that would give one less of a reason for bigots to fuel hatred....


Many rational Hindus agree to that...


Why would you be loyal to India, you are Pakistani and I would expect you to be loyal to Pakistan. Sad to hear about your relatives but that is also the case with Hindus/Sikhs as well. Everyone involved suffered in that rot...


You don't have to, we can do that job by our self, Thank you. And I believe we've been doing quite OK in that field. And I am not sure, how did you come to that conclusion that halal food is not available? I did hear you saying that previously in a different thread. Well to correct you my friend, I have friends living in Lucknow and when I asked them the same, they literally laughed at me for that. I can assure you mate that Halal food/meat is easily available over there including the yummy Tunde kabab... And speaking of Taslima Nasreen, well I don't think she is a Islamophobe and I've seen her twitter posts where she equally condemned the Sanghi goons and White Supremacists as much as she does with Islamic radicals. Anyways she has her freedom of Speech(even if she is wrong) and if any one has a problem with her utterances, they can debate, protest, rebut her but banning her is not the answer...


I don't have anything against the people of Pakistan, but the government of yours have always acted against your/our interests. Look I am not going to start out with Pakistan terrorism and all that but we do have problems. Whenever there is terrorist attack, my people die. So is that reason not enough for me view your government unfavorably. Now you and me can contest the terrorism claims/counter claims till eternity but the perception would still remain the same.... And No, this perception is not forced on us, not at least on me....


I don't really understand what you meant by the bolded part. But let me try explaining you, Now many muslims believe that Vande Mataram literally means Mother, I bow to you. Its a blasphemy in Islam to bow to anyone else except God. Now this answer of mine is as logical as it can be.... And please do care to explain me why does chanting/singing this song matter so much that not singing it literally raises doubts over one's patriotism....

Because many freedom fighters gave their lives singing that song. Both hindus and muslims. Do you think today's muslims are true muslims and those muslim freedom fighters were kafirs because they sang vande ma taram????do you think Those muslim freedom fighters were kafirs because they sang vande ma taram???
My honest opinion is every Indian should consider nation before religion. What is wrong in it?
It is not about singing vande ma taram but why muslims don't want to bow before their(our)mother(India)??

 

[SarthakGanguly]

some of those Indian muslims are/were never against India as a country but rather had and some still breed hatred for Hindus, So that doesn't mean they are not loyal to India but are rather allergic to Hindus...

Quoted for posterity. No one could have put it any better.

No politically correct terms like Sanghi, Hindutva - just plain hatred for Hindus. I will appreciate your honesty...the first and only metric I use to judge a person. Honestly ... respect.

 

[jaatram]

I don't really understand what you meant by the bolded part. But let me try explaining you, Now many muslims believe that Vande Mataram literally means Mother, I bow to you. Its a blasphemy in Islam to bow to anyone else except God. Now this answer of mine is as logical as it can be.... And please do care to explain me why does chanting/singing this song matter so much that not singing it literally raises doubts over one's patriotism....

No one puts the land where they were born and live above anything else. Many Muslims believe in the concept of Ummah, will they stand with Mother India if a war between Ummah and India comes knocking on our doorstep?

 

[The_Showstopper]

Because many freedom fighters gave their lives singing that song. Both hindus and muslims. Do you think today's muslims are true muslims and those muslim freedom fighters were kafirs because they sang vande ma taram????do you think Those muslim freedom fighters were kafirs because they sang vande ma taram???
My honest opinion is every Indian should consider nation before religion. What is wrong in it?
It is not about singing vande ma taram but why muslims don't want to bow before their(our)mother(India)??

The first couple of lines of your post is your opinion and you are free to hold one but that doesn't mean that others have to follow it.... And as I said earlier, it is blasphemy in Islam, so many muslims avoid it. Do you think the muslims in their respective nations(muslim majority countries) are not patriotic since they don't bow to their country? How does me/anyone not bowing to mother India make me/them unpatriotic? I love my country and will defend it when need arises but for doing so I don't have bow to some imaginary mother...

 

[jaatram]

Quoted for posterity. No one could have put it any better.

No politically correct terms like Sanghi, Hindutva - just plain hatred for Hindus. I will appreciate your honesty...the first and only metric I use to judge a person. Honestly ... respect.

You evil Yindoo picking on semantics. he obviously meant Sanghi knickers there not the ones voting for AAP or MIM.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

You evil Yindoo picking on semantics. he obviously meant Sanghi knickers there not the ones voting for AAP or MIM.

Nope. He was clear in the past, but still used the word Sanghi/chaddi etc. Never was the term 'Hindu' explicitly used. It honestly is nice of him to speak openly...so that it helps all reach a better understanding. Or at least an understanding that no understanding can be reached.

I don't have bow to some imaginary mother...

The motherland is more 'real' than... imaginary God almighty...regardless of faith/religion...

 

[The_Showstopper]

No one puts the land where they were born and live above anything else. Many Muslims believe in the concept of Ummah, will they stand with Mother India if a war between Ummah and India comes knocking on our doorstep?

I don't speak for all muslims but yes some do believe in this Ummah concept only until the adversary is a non-muslim else we have seen how Ummah has fought against each other. Kuwait-Iraq, Syria-Lebanon etc to name a few...

 

[jaatram]

I don't speak for all muslims but yes some do believe in this Ummah concept only until the adversary is a non-muslim else we have seen how Ummah has fought against each other. Kuwait-Iraq, Syria-Lebanon etc to name a few...

Indians are KAFIR, idolaters on top of that. So tell me where would be the loyalty of those Ummah dreamers would lie if Ummah and India fought?