Kashmir | News & Discussions.

[SpArK]

Brilliant article.. could use as a reference if the thread is not deleted soon.

Waiting for trolls now.

 

[somebozo]

a) Pakistan has carved out the Northern Areas (now called Gilgit-Baltistan, almost 72,971 Sq km) from Kashmir into a separate administrative and political unit. This area, which was part of the undivided Kashmir at the time of independence, has been 'annexed' by Pakistan, as it were, and separated from Kashmir.

The maharaja never controlled the whole of disputed area which India claims today. Indian claim extends up till northern Pakistan in a cunning move to have a border with Afghanistan and hence a direct route to central Asia. These are the same areas where Nehru was stoned for advocating union with India so how can they be advocated at part of india today?? Lies have no grounds!

Secondly, being a muslim majority state, it was logically to accede Pakistan.

b) In 1963, Pakistan illegally ceded 5,800 sq km in the Trans-Karakoram Tract to China. The Tract was part of the original state of Jammu and Kashmir.

Pakistan did not accede anything, the map already denoted it Chinese territory and China already controlled the territory. Pakistan simple recognized the Chinese sovereignty over the land and demarcated permanent border. Guaranteeing our own security and shutting down potential front of future conflict.

c) Pakistan actively encourages "other people" to settle in *** and have even allowed the Chinese a huge presence in Gilgit-Baltistan, ostensibly for developing the infrastructure of the region.

Pakistan does not consider Kashmir and Kashmirs as Pakistani. They have separate flag, passports and political system. A Pakistan cannot buy lands or run business in Kashmir. A Kashmir identity holder doing business in mainland Pakistan is treated under different law. But due to years of intermingled family ties these differences are easily run over as people find work around. Does not mean GoP is officially over running Kashmir with population displacement. If Kashmir was that easy and free to buy land and settle, the whole of Pakistani wealthy brass would have owned estates there and GoP would have turned it into one massive tourist haven. Heck you even need a pass from local government to go on a hiking trip in AJK.

b) The Freedom House Report, 2010, on the level of 'freedom' in *** characterised it as "not free', while the Indian side of Kashmir was defined as "partly free".

An area guarded by 700K armed personals and rife with violence, dissapearene, murder and stone pelting cannot be described as peaceful by sane person. Shameful is it that after killing over a 100 innocent Kashmiris, the indians have balls to come out next week and declare victory over terrorist killing..shameful and cowardly. Freedom house is definitely on crack that too of cheapest grade.

c) No non-Kashmiri can buy as much as an inch of land in the state of Jammu & Kashmir. There has been no attempt by India to change the demographics or the state's ethnic character. The only demographic change that has happened in the state has been the "ethnic cleansing" of the Kashmiri pundits from the Valley. A mass exodus which has largely been ignored by the media and the powers-that-be.

And exactly this is what is being enforced in pakistan as well...whats a big deal.. India has always maintained "kashmir belongs to all indians" and in up in arms with systematic forced "indianization" of Kashmiris at the expense of eroding their national identity. Exactly what the Kashmiris are fighting for. The day kashmir accede to India, whole of brahmin pundits will be up in arms for grabbing premium properties of the valley for some good tourism business. The explusion of pundits happend because they were the most hardcore advocates of Indian union running contrary to wishes of Kashmiri people and would have served the purpose of hindu puppet mouth piece. This alone should express the opinion of Kashmiri people in regards to their identity.

As soon as the Maharaja signed the Instrument of Accession, Kashmir's accession to India was complete in the legal and formal sense —

Well and so was accession of Junagarth!

 

[Omar1984]

New Delhi: China remains adamant and will continue to issue stapled visas to Indians living in Kashmir. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is expected to share his concerns on China's stance when he meets Chinese premier Wen Jiabao on the sidelines of the East Asia Summit later this week.

India suspended military exchanges with China after it issued a stapled visa to Northern Army Commander Lt Gen BS Jaswal in July

But Beijing provoked New Delhi once again by saying it will not relent on the issue of stapled visas to Indians from Kashmir.

"Though China has friendly relations with India, its policy towards the stapled visas for residents of Kashmir remained unchanged," said Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Ma Zhaoxu.


The war of words over the contentious issue came three days ahead of a meeting between Singh and Wen on the sidelines of East Asia Summit in Hanoi.

The practice of issuing stapled visas, which amounts to questioning Jammu and Kashmir's accession with India, was started by China about two years ago.

India has already made it clear to China that the defence exchanges will remain on "pause" till Beijing reverts to its long-held position on Jammu and Kashmir.


China to continue with stapled visas for Kashmir - India News - IBNLive

 

[third eye]

Pakistan did not accede anything, the map already denoted it Chinese territory and China already controlled the territory. Pakistan simple recognized the Chinese sovereignty over the land and demarcated permanent border. Guaranteeing our own security and shutting down potential front of future conflict.

Kashmir: Legal Documents

The above link is worth a visit.

This subject has been dealt here

http://www.defence.pk/forums/strate...-sino-pakistan-frontier-agreement-1963-a.html

 

[Areesh]

Somethings are more important than so called trade and $$ and that thing is strategic superiority and border disputes. It is better that Indians also realize this.

Thanks China.

 

[KALKI]

Somethings are more important than so called trade and $$ and that thing is strategic superiority and border disputes. It is better that Indians also realize this.

Thanks China.

Where was this importance before last two years or so when one fine day China suddenly decided to issue stapled visas?

 

[somebozo]

Every time Indians talk about beating China they get a fresh "Made in China" needle up their buxoms and crying starts once again. Ohh and its better to be quiet right now. 15000 Chinese engineers are teaching Indian building vital industries and infrastructure. These might be PLA spies as well which will take GPS co-ordinates of every important project. Then viola..something bigger than needle my pierce their bums!

India has already made it clear to China that the defence exchanges will remain on "pause" till Beijing reverts to its long-held position on Jammu and Kashmir.

Ohh the Chinese are soo desperate to demonstrate their new J-10 to India they will die if they dont get a military exchange with India! The Asian tiger!!! (sarcasm)

 

[Areesh]

Where was this importance before last two years or so when one fine day China suddenly decided to issue stapled visas?

It was always there. Overtly or covertly.

 

[RobbieS]

I think Maharaja Hari Singh was a Sikh not a Hindu, as stated in the article.

Am I right?

Fighter

Hari Singh's forefathers were Dogra Sikh converts and Generals in Ranjit Singh's army. They began ruling their governorship of Kashmir as an independent kingdom after the Sikh Empire disintegrated. Somewhere between then and now, they converted back to Hinduism.

 

[StingRoy]

The Chinese by giving stapled visas are essentially denying the Kashmiris from traveling into China since the MEA and customs officials have already declared that stapled visas are not a valid travel document.
China might as well refuse visas to the Kashmiris... it will essentially be the same.

 

[Urbanized Greyhound]

Somethings are more important than so called trade and $$ and that thing is strategic superiority and border disputes. It is better that Indians also realize this.

Thanks China.

and somethings are more important than so called trade and $$ and good relations and that thing is Territorial integrity for Indians.It would be better that the Chinese also realize this or rather openly acknowledge that they have realized this instead of pretending......

 

[nomi007]

well done china

 

[Areesh]

and somethings are more important than so called trade and $$ and good relations and that thing is Territorial integrity for Indians.It would be better that the Chinese also realize this or rather openly acknowledge that they have realized this instead of pretending......

They do care about India's integrity if it isn't about the disputed territories like IOK.

 

[roach]

Every time Indians talk about beating China they get a fresh "Made in China" needle up their buxoms and crying starts once again. Ohh and its better to be quiet right now. 15000 Chinese engineers are teaching Indian building vital industries and infrastructure. These might be PLA spies as well which will take GPS co-ordinates of every important project. Then viola..something bigger than needle my pierce their bums!


Ohh the Chinese are soo desperate to demonstrate their new J-10 to India they will die if they dont get a military exchange with India! The Asian tiger!!! (sarcasm)

So the Great Game continues.

My Pakistani friends should realize by now that J&K is <earth-shatteringly> important, strategically speaking, to India, China and Pakistan. Let's forget the crocodile tears for 'Kashmiri Brethren' for just a moment, and wake up to the fact that there are always going to be non-Kashmiri army Boots in that region.
Anyone who believes that that place is going to be a DMZ anytime in the future needs a serious reality check.

Meanwhile, the Pakistani obsession with Kashmir continues to their own detriment. No skin off India's back, really-in the big picture, Kashmir is a mere irritant. India and China progress, Pakistan regresses.....but looks like China has many new loyal mouthpieces willing to bend over, aaaaaaaanytime.

 

[third eye]

Hari Singh's forefathers were Dogra Sikh converts and Generals in Ranjit Singh's army. They began ruling their governorship of Kashmir as an independent kingdom after the Sikh Empire disintegrated. Somewhere between then and now, they converted back to Hinduism.

The Royal House of Jammu and Kashmir - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Royal family of J&K belonged to the Jamwal clan of Rajputs.