Kargil War hero's book narrates how Indian Army surpised the enemy and won

[SSGcommandoPAK]

Indian jets after entering Pakistani territory .....

 

[Jamwal's]

So we what if you have our stingers and riffles , we have your shot down jets

Yes no point,these are just war trophies for regiments,who captured them.

The real issue is not stingers,not rifles but land, we lost jets but recaptured the posts including tiger Hill.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

There were some elements of SSG,who fought and martyred/died in Kargil war.


Like Capt Ammar hussain SSG,I think his body was not recovered.

View attachment 283819

Not true all of the soldiers were of NLI , wait ill upload a video in which the army chief of that tim GEN musharaf even says the same that NLI fought the indian army

Yes no point,these are just war trophies for regiments,who captured them.

The real issue is not stingers,not rifles but land, we lost jets but recaptured the posts including tiger Hill.

Even your media claims that Pakistan still controls the highest and most important peak in that district .


If you captured Tiger hil , than why does Indian media cry that pakistan still control the highest peak including tiger hill 5353

I have been telling u again and again but your not believing me now you'll surely believe me cause this is not Pak media but Indian media
LOL members you need to see this video ..

 

[dadeechi]

Funny thing, Mahmud of Ghanzi never had any major territorial conquests in modern India, despite some of his victories

But what Ghaznavids did do was, exterminate Umayudd presense in Sindh

The same kingdom from which Pakistan's savior Muhammad bin Qasim hailed from

Pakistanis need to decide if they are Arab or Turkic or Persian. The only thing they seem to agree on is that they are not Indian/Desi.

 

[Pak_Sher]

Bad tactical and strategic planning along with diplomatic pressure resulted in Pakistani Forces retreating. Now the question? Is Pakistan Army brave enough to invade Indian occupied territory or does Indian Army have the same guts to invade Pakistani held territory is pretty clear. Musharraf gets an F for bad planning missing the core compnent of the exit strategy. Regarding winning? 2,900 Pakistani Northern Light Infantry against 90,000 Indian Troops and IAF was an unbalanced situation to begin with, but the planners are to be blamed for it.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

Pakistanis need to decide if they are Arab or Turkic or Persian. The only thing they seem to agree on is that they are not Indian/Desi.

Please focus on the topic

 

[dadeechi]

Please focus on the topic

The below OT post was made by a Paistani member. I was just responding.

Kargil War hero's book narrates how Indian Army surpised the enemy and won | Page 3

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Funny thing, Mahmud of Ghanzi never had any major territorial conquests in modern India, despite some of his victories

But what Ghaznavids did do was, exterminate Umayad presense in Sindh

The same kingdom from which Pakistan's savior Muhammad bin Qasim hailed from

People like him had zero morality. Barbarians. And he s a hero to Pakistan. While it is true most of the kings were like that during that era, he was a speciality.
Day by Day the definition of who is a Pakistani keeps changing

Bad tactical and strategic planning along with diplomatic pressure resulted in Pakistani Forces retreating. Now the question? Is Pakistan Army brave enough to invade Indian occupied territory or does Indian Army have the same guts to invade Pakistani held territory is pretty clear. Musharraf gets an F for bad planning missing the core compnent of the exit strategy. Regarding winning? 2,900 Pakistani Northern Light Infantry against 90,000 Indian Troops and IAF was an unbalanced situation to begin with, but the planners are to be blamed for it.

I doubt even Musharaf had an exit plan. I mean did he expect IA not to retaliate at so called Freedom Fighters who had been debunked long back as Pakistani regulars.?
He didnt have any plans for any defence if India had declared full scale war considering PAF and PN werent informed of any plans. He has blood on his hands. Bloods of 2000 odd Pakistani soldiers.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

The below OT post was made by a Paistani member. I was just responding.

Kargil War hero's book narrates how Indian Army surpised the enemy and won | Page 3

Forget

The below OT post was made by a Paistani member. I was just responding.

Kargil War hero's book narrates how Indian Army surpised the enemy and won | Page 3[/QUOT
Hahah okay no problem , that's one sided . Your media is saying that Indian army tried many times to recapture Tiger hill point 5353 but were unsuccessful , they could only recapture the small peaks ,and Point 5353 is the most important peak as we can stop your supplies going from Kargil to Kashmir by attacking the highway . Few duck shots from 5353 can inflict heavy loses on your peaks and the highway .

 

[Jamwal's]

Not true all of the soldiers were of NLI , wait ill upload a video in which the army chief of that tim GEN musharaf even says the same that NLI fought the indian army


Even your media claims that Pakistan still controls the highest and most important peak in that district .


If you captured Tiger hil , than why does Indian media cry that pakistan still control the highest peak including tiger hill 5353

I have been telling u again and again but your not believing me now you'll surely believe me cause this is not Pak media but Indian media
LOL members you need to see this video ..

Not all out of 453 officially KIA,some were SSG like the one above who was awarded some sitara,i don't know the name,while Pak never accepted the bodies of 250 ~ Soldiers/Mujahideen.

As for 5353,yes it's under pak but what purpose it serving,it's situated directly on the LOC,not inside,beside we captured 100s of peaks back from pak including Tiger Hill and Tololing,thus securing the National Highway and ultimately Siachen,The objective of Kargil war.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

A question that no Pakistani wants to answer:

Objective: Take control of key heights in Kashmir overlooking key Roads used by India army.

Was this achieved by Pakistan.....

Answer :NO


Pakistan Lost.

Kargil was not a full fledged war so dont know about your parameter of judging the victory or lost and it could be label as stalemate as the border before and after this conflicts remained the same. How Pakistan lost when your intelligence agencies were failed to notice any movement and capturing of these important strategic posts for months until some local shepard opened your eyes and India mobilised a large number of troops to reclaim their lost territory with the aid of Indian air force, heavy Bofors guns and heavy artilleries to give all possible support to their infantries

The big blunder of Pakistani Generals was to deny their involvement and leave these troops at mercy of Indian even after they managed to captured those strategic points

We all know the fate of every Kargil thread.........


For some : It was an absolute victory, but NS screwed it
For some : It was a victory because PA still hold 1 peak
For some : It was brilliant plan but poorly executed by mushraff
For some : It was a Political and Military blunder by an over ambitious over confident COAS
For some : It was embarrassment for Indian intelligence agencies and final victory for IA in the end.
For some : It was a victory over over ambitious enemy
For some : It was a victory for airforce since few IAF planes/choppers where shot down.
For some : It was a diplomatic victory for GoI and military victory for India
For some : It was back stabbing by Pakistan immediately after spectacle peace effort by both nations
For some : It was an unnecessary war fought by 2 nuclear countries

You can select what ever suits your thoughts and beliefs and be happy. Let the moderator close down the thread before it becomes a troll fest.

Good and there is slight truth in most of these points

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

You guys bombed are troops like hell thats the reason of high casualties but still less than u guys , Gen Musharaf did a mistake of not involving the regular army +SSG +PAF . If we would have fought with our full force u couldn't have gotten a single peak back i assure u . Unlike The Indian army which was even struggling with full might .
3000 NLI soldiers vs 30,000 Indian army , w8 ill give u an example , i am creating a situation for u indians imagine this
The Pakistan army fighting your BSF with airsupport , aviation and commandos , and your government saying we dont know the BSF soldiers , this was happening with the NLI during the Kargil war[/QUOTE]

 

[Jamwal's]

2000 are just rumors its actually 400 martyred . while your 600 guys killed . I know you will argue with me on the casualties but then i can also claim on basis of rumors that 4000 indians were killed , so stick to the facts .
I have to admit Indian army standard has fallen having so much casualties fighting a paramilitary force .



Whats the use of captuing back 100 useless peaks when u couldn't get the main peak back .
Khair its a good topic , i am having fun debating with u guys ....



You guys bombed are troops like hell thats the reason of high casualties but still less than u guys , Gen Musharaf did a mistake of not involving the regular army +SSG +PAF . If we would have fought with our full force u couldn't have gotten a single peak back i assure u . Unlike The Indian army was even struggling with full might .

Your official figure of KIA is 453,it does not count the bodies which was not accepted by Pak,i have pics in which the bodies were buried by Indian Army with proper Military honor.

Meanwhile, the Indian Army today said the bodies of 249 Pakistani soldiers were recovered from the Kargil sector during Operation Vijay, 150 of them in the Drass and Mushkoh Valley sectors.

The maximum number of bodies, 35, were retrieved from a position called Helmet in Drass. Twenty-seven bodies were buried as per military custom by Indian troops at Point 4812 in the Batalik sector where 99 bodies were found.

Twenty bodies were recovered at Pimple II in Drass and 20 each at Point 5140 and south of Point 5287 in the Batalik sector.

While 18 bodies were found in Khalubar and 17 at Point 5203, 14 each were retrieved at Point 4700, Point 4875/Flat Top and Twin Bump.

Ten bodies were taken away from Three Pimples/Lone Hill, nine from Dog Hill, seven from Tololing Ridge, six from The Hump, four from a mortar position, three each from Rock Fall, Point 5287 and Rocky Knob, two from 'Y' Junction and Spur, and one from Point 4040.

Three bodies recovered from Twin Bump and one each from Helmet and Point 4875/Flat Top were handed over to Pakistan.

The remaining 244 bodies were buried as per military tradition and with Islamic rites by Indian troops.

You guys bombed are troops like hell thats the reason of high casualties but still less than u guys , Gen Musharaf did a mistake of not involving the regular army +SSG +PAF . If we would have fought with our full force u couldn't have gotten a single peak back i assure u . Unlike The Indian army which was even struggling with full might .
3000 NLI soldiers vs 30,000 Indian army , w8 ill give u an example , i am creating a situation for u indians imagine this
The Pakistan army fighting your BSF with airsupport , aviation and commandos , and your government saying we dont know the BSF soldiers , this was happening with the NLI during the Kargil war

[/QUOTE]

The point of capturing 100s of peaks is the preservation of Sovereignty apart from saving siachen.

And what good is 5353 with Pak,when Siachen is still in Indian control and along with the national Highway,we already constructed a second Highway and tunnel after kargil,which bypass point 5353 and even Tiger Hill.


"Come October, we shall walk in to Siachen - to mop up the dead bodies of hundreds of Indians left hungry, out in the cold," Ahmad is quoted as having said during the briefing, adding that "I have Stingers on every peak" to counter the threat of Indian air strikes against Pakistani intruders.

"The target was a vulnerable section of Drass-Kargil road, whose blocking would virtually cut off the crucial lifeline which carried the bulk of supplies needed for daily consumption as well as annual winter stocking in Leh-Siachen sector. He (Lt Gen Ahmad) was very hopeful that this stratagem could choke off the Indians in the vital sector for up to a month, after which monsoons would prevent vehicular movements and also suspend airlift by IAF," Tufail writes on details of the briefing.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

Your official figure of KIA is 453,it does not count the bodies which was not accepted by Pak,i have pics in which the bodies were buried by Indian Army with proper Military honor.

Meanwhile, the Indian Army today said the bodies of 249 Pakistani soldiers were recovered from the Kargil sector during Operation Vijay, 150 of them in the Drass and Mushkoh Valley sectors.

The maximum number of bodies, 35, were retrieved from a position called Helmet in Drass. Twenty-seven bodies were buried as per military custom by Indian troops at Point 4812 in the Batalik sector where 99 bodies were found.

Twenty bodies were recovered at Pimple II in Drass and 20 each at Point 5140 and south of Point 5287 in the Batalik sector.

While 18 bodies were found in Khalubar and 17 at Point 5203, 14 each were retrieved at Point 4700, Point 4875/Flat Top and Twin Bump.

Ten bodies were taken away from Three Pimples/Lone Hill, nine from Dog Hill, seven from Tololing Ridge, six from The Hump, four from a mortar position, three each from Rock Fall, Point 5287 and Rocky Knob, two from 'Y' Junction and Spur, and one from Point 4040.

Three bodies recovered from Twin Bump and one each from Helmet and Point 4875/Flat Top were handed over to Pakistan.

The remaining 244 bodies were buried as per military tradition and with Islamic rites by Indian troops.

The point of capturing 100s of peaks is the preservation of Sovereignty apart from saving siachen.

And what good is 5353 with Pak,when Siachen is still in Indian control and along with the national Highway,we already constructed a second Highway and tunnel after kargil,which bypass point 5353 and even Tiger Hill.


"Come October, we shall walk in to Siachen - to mop up the dead bodies of hundreds of Indians left hungry, out in the cold," Ahmad is quoted as having said during the briefing, adding that "I have Stingers on every peak" to counter the threat of Indian air strikes against Pakistani intruders.

"The target was a vulnerable section of Drass-Kargil road, whose blocking would virtually cut off the crucial lifeline which carried the bulk of supplies needed for daily consumption as well as annual winter stocking in Leh-Siachen sector. He (Lt Gen Ahmad) was very hopeful that this stratagem could choke off the Indians in the vital sector for up to a month, after which monsoons would prevent vehicular movements and also suspend airlift by IAF," Tufail writes on details of the briefing.

[/QUOTE]

You can keep siachen , where your soldiers die everyday due to frostbite and the cold temperature . Enjoy

Your official figure of KIA is 453,it does not count the bodies which was not accepted by Pak,i have pics in which the bodies were buried by Indian Army with proper Military honor.

Meanwhile, the Indian Army today said the bodies of 249 Pakistani soldiers were recovered from the Kargil sector during Operation Vijay, 150 of them in the Drass and Mushkoh Valley sectors.

The maximum number of bodies, 35, were retrieved from a position called Helmet in Drass. Twenty-seven bodies were buried as per military custom by Indian troops at Point 4812 in the Batalik sector where 99 bodies were found.

Twenty bodies were recovered at Pimple II in Drass and 20 each at Point 5140 and south of Point 5287 in the Batalik sector.

While 18 bodies were found in Khalubar and 17 at Point 5203, 14 each were retrieved at Point 4700, Point 4875/Flat Top and Twin Bump.

Ten bodies were taken away from Three Pimples/Lone Hill, nine from Dog Hill, seven from Tololing Ridge, six from The Hump, four from a mortar position, three each from Rock Fall, Point 5287 and Rocky Knob, two from 'Y' Junction and Spur, and one from Point 4040.

Three bodies recovered from Twin Bump and one each from Helmet and Point 4875/Flat Top were handed over to Pakistan.

The remaining 244 bodies were buried as per military tradition and with Islamic rites by Indian troops.

The point of capturing 100s of peaks is the preservation of Sovereignty apart from saving siachen.

And what good is 5353 with Pak,when Siachen is still in Indian control and along with the national Highway,we already constructed a second Highway and tunnel after kargil,which bypass point 5353 and even Tiger Hill.


"Come October, we shall walk in to Siachen - to mop up the dead bodies of hundreds of Indians left hungry, out in the cold," Ahmad is quoted as having said during the briefing, adding that "I have Stingers on every peak" to counter the threat of Indian air strikes against Pakistani intruders.

"The target was a vulnerable section of Drass-Kargil road, whose blocking would virtually cut off the crucial lifeline which carried the bulk of supplies needed for daily consumption as well as annual winter stocking in Leh-Siachen sector. He (Lt Gen Ahmad) was very hopeful that this stratagem could choke off the Indians in the vital sector for up to a month, after which monsoons would prevent vehicular movements and also suspend airlift by IAF," Tufail writes on details of the briefing.

[/QUOTE]

Those must be the bodies of the Locals in other words mujahideen fighting along sides NLi , they were in small numbers 500 -1000 i suppose .

 

[Osiris]

Kargil was not a full fledged war so dont know about your parameter of judging the victory or lost and it could be label as stalemate as the border before and after this conflicts remained the same. How Pakistan lost when your intelligence agencies were failed to notice any movement and capturing of these important strategic posts for months until some local shepard opened your eyes and India mobilised a large number of troops to reclaim their lost territory with the aid of Indian air force, heavy Bofors guns and heavy artilleries to give all possible support to their infantries

The big blunder of Pakistani Generals was to deny their involvement and leave these troops at mercy of Indian even after they managed to captured those strategic points


Good and there is slight truth in most of these points

Material losses and International humiliation for Pakistan aside.

Victory or Loss in a battle is decided by objectives laid down for that battle and their achievement of it.

Kargil was Pakistani misadventure, which failed fulfill its objectives. As Pakistan neither control Kargil nor Siachen.

Where as Operation Vijay was Indian response to Kargil, which succeeded in its objectives, as Pakistan neither controls Kargil nor Siachen.