JuD will continue to operate in Pakistan: Spokesperson

[Areesh]

You yourself admitted, that you support JuD ( a terrorist organisation) in this thread itself , where as Indian minister has nowhere admitted to supporting any terrorist organisation..may that be TTP or JuD.

I support a charity organization. Your minister explicitly wishes to support terrorists. I am far better. And you haven't answered my question yet.

 

[Peshwa]

The National Action Plan also includes hate speech laws, as shown in the quote below this one. If it does not say JuD was banned for hate speech or instigation, neither does it say JuD was banned for terrorism specifically.
Where did our spokesperson say it was a terrorist outfit? The word being used is 'proscribed'. Applies to a lot of things.

The National Action Plan is aimed at curbing Terrorism...very specific..
So if an outfit is banned under the law, of course it is inciting terrorism or involved in activities..

Shouldnt be that hard to connect the dots.

Either ways, JuD is involved in certain objectionable things (aside from the alleged terrorism), such as hate speech and quite a lot of mullah-cracy, which we don't appreciate (I personally never did). The ban is a reasonable action but since there isn't enough evidence to arrest them, statements like in the OP would, as expected, be floating around.

I suppose we can agree on something...
The reason for the ban we may not agree on...the end result aka banning their activities I do appreciate...

 

[ares]

I support a charity organization. Your minister explicitly wishes to support terrorists. I am far better. And you haven't answered my question yet.

Your charity organisation is a banned terrorist outfit as per international and Pakistani law..which makes you a terrorist sympathiser.

Where as show me where he has said, he wishes to support terrorist and which one? I have already debunked your hypothesis. you keeping up the same rant, will not change anything.

And your question is moot, since your conclusion is wrong.

 

[TankMan]

The National Action Plan is aimed at curbing Terrorism...very specific..
So if an outfit is banned under the law, of course it is inciting terrorism or involved in activities..

There you go, that's the point I was making. It was indirectly inciting terrorism through hate speech, that does not mean it was itself directly involved in those activities. 'Or' means you have to choose one of the options. The former is a lot more likely than the latter.

The reason for the ban we may not agree on......

We can agree to disagree on that.

 

[Peshwa]

Chuck Hagel seems to believe it. And the Balochi groups are banned and designated as terrorist groups the Taliban already are. What do you expect the UN to do if it was convinced by the evidence, ban India?
Balochistan Liberation Army - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Well if Chuck Hagel believes it, good for him...Where are the actions that state that the UN or the US (Country that he represents) believe his views?

To your point about the BLA...
Thats for you to decide...
Have India declared a terrorist state...Simple!
or at least get the UN to stop the support from whatever imaginary place in India or Afghanistan its coming from...wouldnt that be the most obvious next step? Wonder what Pakistan is waiting for?

There you go, that's the point I was making. It was indirectly inciting terrorism through hate speech, that does not mean it was itself directly involved in those activities. 'Or' means you have to choose one of the options. The former is a lot more likely than the latter..

Thats a massive assumption...

For now we know that JUD is involved in terrorist activities...whether its fund collection, hate speeches, mullah-giri is irrelevant...key word being "terrorism"

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

We thought Pakistan's stance including the courts was that JUD and HS as its leader were not involved in terrorism...

So why has Pakistan banned the organization? Seems we dont need to provide the proof as your govt. agrees with our assertion..

simple.....the govt. is spineless and wanted to please the Americans

the order will be rescinded most likely - as it was in the past. It's not the first time this happepend

Bodos and Maoist are not attacking its neighbors, where are LeT/JuD are.

they're killing YOUR citizens in droves!!!! all the more reason for you to get your priorities in order and quit obcessing over some charity movement whose leader issues lots of anti-indian statements but not a terrorist

 

[Peshwa]

simple.....the govt. is spineless and wanted to please the Americans

the order will be rescinded most likely - as it was in the past. It's not the first time this happepend

Actually TBH, I dont believe anyone in India thinks this will hold...

I wouldn't be surprised if we all are arguing about Pakistani court's decision to lift the ban in a month...this shit is cyclical!

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

PAK should not do anything under pressure. The indian PM is a genocidal criminal and Indians boast abt it. Why should PAK go after one of its citizens based on some baseless allegations made by Indians?

the government is spineless and that's why its deeply unpopular, especially among the youth who are much more patriotic than the dead-beat older generations.

it's hard for most countries - especially a developing one - not to succumb to US pressure but i'm fairly confident that JuD ban will be lifted

the organization (JuD or FeI) is still operating normally - according to their spokesperson. It's just a formal drama just to shut up Uncle Sam

Actually TBH, I dont believe anyone in India thinks this will hold...

I wouldn't be surprised if we all are arguing about Pakistani court's decision to lift the ban in a month...this shit is cyclical!

probably less than a month but lets see

 

[TankMan]

Where are the actions that state that the UN or the US (Country that he represents) believe his views?

Where are the actions that state that the UN believes India's views? They banned an outfit too, with words and paperwork. No difference, pointless argument.

Have India declared a terrorist state...Simple!

Yeah, right, 'simple'. Has the UN or US declared Pakistan a terrorist state yet, despite all of India's magical evidence?
Again, pointless arguments as it's the same for both the sides. Neither of us can actually prove anything, it's Pakistan's word vs India's.

Thats a massive assumption...

No, it isn't.

For now we know that JUD is involved in terrorist activities...whether its fund collection, hate speeches, mullah-giri is irrelevant...key word being "terrorism"

Collecting funds is not terrorism and neither is hate-speech or mullah-giri. There is no evidence that the funds go to terrorist activities. The only thing that is certain is that hate-speech and Mullah-giri does indirectly give support to terrorists and it has been banned [presumably] for that.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Well then that should be enough to tell you that your allegations are baseless if no one believes the evidence..
On the other hand, the UN banned JUD with our evidence....what does that tell you eh?

you dont have any evidence....if you did you would have shared it with us without making drama and tamasha to the media

if evidence exists, then please explain this

the indians are the ones who should be pissed off....not us. They are being taken for a ride

(Pakistanis using a VPN w/TOR will be able to access the link as well)

 

[Areesh]

Your charity organisation is a banned terrorist outfit as per international and Pakistani law..which makes you a terrorist sympathiser.

Where as show me where he has said, he wishes to support terrorist and which one? I have already debunked your hypothesis. you keeping up the same rant, will not change anything.

And your question is moot, since your conclusion is wrong.

It is a charity organization. Banned or not. It is apparently a charity organization. As for show me where your minister said that. You can go to post number 23 of this thread where I have already quoted what your minister said. When he wished to use certain individuals which himself call terrorists against Pakistan. That is why I said I am far better than your minister. If a PM with a blotted past like Modi was not enough, you also have a defense minister which openly wishes to use terrorists against its neighbors.

And again what should we think of your country which has such defense minister in addition to modi as a PM? It is not that hard of a question in my opinion.

 

[ares]

they're killing YOUR citizens in droves!!!! all the more reason for you to get your priorities in order and quit obcessing over some charity movement whose leader issues lots of anti-indian statements but not a terrorist

And we are killing them in return, they neither have resources nor global ambitions unlike terrorist outfits operating from Pakistan. they have existed for five decades and haven't achieved squat.

Entire world are not idiots to ban a charity organisation if they weren't terrorists.

It is a charity organization. Banned or not. It is apparently a charity organization. As for show me where your minister said that. You can go to post number 23 of this thread where I have already quoted what your minister said. When he wished to use certain individuals which himself call terrorists against Pakistan. That is why I said I am far better than your minister. If a PM with a blotted past like Modi was not enough, you also have a defense minister which openly wishes to use terrorists against its neighbors.

And again what should we think of your country which has such defense minister in addition to modi as a PM? It is not that hard of a question in my opinion.

A charity organisation, which designated as terrorist organisation by every country in the world.

You can go to post no 50 where I have debunked your theory ..he talks about using the people who attacks us.

Nowhere has he explicitly supported terrorist or any particular terrorist organisation by any name!!

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

And we are killing them in return, they neither have resources nor global ambitions unlike terrorist outfits operating from Pakistan. they have existed for five decades

Global or regional - doesnt matter. They've killed one hell of a lot more indians than Pakistanis/Kashmiris have. Get your priorities in order.

and haven't achieved squat.

thanks for proving my point even more....on the other hand, bodos naxals and other groups are "achieving" more than squat....do something about them, they've killed more indians than we have

 

[ares]

Global or regional - doesnt matter. They've killed one hell of a lot more indians than Pakistanis/Kashmiris have. Get your priorities in order.

Wrong, they haven't.

 

[Peshwa]

Where are the actions that state that the UN believes India's views? They banned an outfit too, with words and paperwork. No difference, pointless argument.

Huge difference...
BLA was banned for its activities...had nothing to do with India or any Indian organization..

JUD was banned after 26/11...a direct result of our efforts diplomatically and with the evidence we shared with the UN...

Now you tell me...as a result of Pakistan's lobbying, did the UN ban any Indian organization or bring India into the fold as an accused?

Yeah, right, 'simple'. Has the UN or US declared Pakistan a terrorist state yet, despite all of India's magical evidence?
Again, pointless arguments as it's the same for both the sides. Neither of us can actually prove anything, it's Pakistan's word vs India's.

No we can prove that Pakistanis are involved in terrorism against India...JUD being banned as an outfit by the UN is evidence enough...
Have any Indians been implicated in terrorism against Pakistan? Has the UN endorsed your position?

Collecting funds is not terrorism and neither is hate-speech or mullah-giri. There is no evidence that the funds go to terrorist activities. The only thing that is certain is that hate-speech and Mullah-giri does indirectly give support to terrorists and it has been banned [presumably] for that.

Collecting funds is terrorism if it goes towards funding terrorist activities...

Like I said, the law is aimed at curbing terrorism...JUD has been banned under the overarching law..its as simple as that..
Its you assuming that their involvement is limited to hate speeches...but if those hate speeches lead to terrorist activities, thats terrorism right there...
We are going around in circles now...so lets end it here as I dont think we will see eye to eye on this..

you dont have any evidence....if you did you would have shared it with us without making drama and tamasha to the media

if evidence exists, then please explain this

the indians are the ones who should be pissed off....not us. They are being taken for a ride

(Pakistanis using a VPN will be able to access the link as well)

Please read before replying in the future...

My post clearly states wrt JUD as a terrorist organization...
UN bans Jamaat-ud-Dawa; declares it a terror outfit - The Times of India

The video you posted speaks to specific evidence against Hafiz Saeed...

Neverthelesss, if the UN security council (US included) believe the organization is a terrorist, then it wouldn't be too far to think that the terrorist activities are being hidden from its leader HS or does not have his approval and support...
The terror designation was provided based on India evidence against the involvement of the group...

Its like saying that the SS is accused of war crimes, but since we dont have any direct evidence against Himmler, he is scott free of any wrong doing..