Jinnah Was Right

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

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Who Cares

Indian Muslims decided to stay in India after the partition, so they need to pay the consequences. It's obvious that they are second class citizens now, and are on their way to be slaves of their Hindu Masters. They made their bed, now they need to sleep on it. Unfortunately, they have no place in Pakistan and they cannot be settled in Pakistan.

We can thank Jinnah who had the foresight to see this issue long before.

Why would they? Pakistanis ARE NOT indian so called "Muslims".

 

[KediKesenFare3]

Pakistan is complete. Neither a unification with Afghanistan - which would turn Pakistan into a Muslim replica of modern-day India - nor a second British India are worth debating.

We all know that Jinnah was right by creating Pakistan; but he wouldn't want you to be obsessed with the past. If he were still alive, he wouldn't care at all about the past giving Pakistan's current state of affairs.

We're indulging in reminiscences while our enemies and rivals are shaping our future.

By creating Pakistan, Jinnah looked ahead of his time but we're looking back to find the perfect nation, state and society. Jinnah started this project for us to go ahead with this great idea but we're turning it back to reach Jinnah's point. We need to clear up this misunderstanding.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Why would they? Pakistanis ARE NOT indian so called "Muslims".

So tell me who are we, we are mixed race but some how we are related to India genetically

 

[Chhatrapati]

What secularism you have rss type organisation roaming around raping women when an religious organisation is formed in Pakistan its suddenly called terrorism have some logic you Indians are the most retarded species I've seen on the face off this planet

Again, whoever rules the nation state, the state is secular irrespective of the rulers. RSS Communist or Congress.

The demographic advantage at the constituency level would have still been against Muslims even without the Muslims migrating out of India, and without a rallying cry of bigotry & religious nationalism (like the BJP) the Muslim vote would continue to be split further.

How many Muslim legislators (MNA’s) were elected in the last 2 elections in India?

Nothing is clearer than looking at actual facts on the ground, and the facts on the ground are that, despite having close to 200 million Muslims in India, the recent elections resulted in barely 20 odd Muslims being elected in a house of 545 members.

Jinnah had the foresight to recognize all of this and thank goodness that he fought tirelessly for Pakistan’s independence.

Past 70 years Jinnah's Pakistan is in quite a lot of trouble, your nation as a whole is comparable to Bihar in India. If Jinnah was alive, he'd probably migrate to his house in Mumbai, which has a helluva lot better standard than land of pure.
You're repeating your pov without even considering what will be the state of migration. How do you distribute 40% of population without getting majority in a single constituency? Do tell me the math of that.

Who cares how many Muslim legislatures are elected. Did all Muslims vote for another Muslim? No. Maybe in your imagination that's how it works, not so much here.
Pakistani's scale of secularism is defined as how many MNA's from one community elected. Dayum!

Yeah, he might as well as had the foresight of Pakistan going into a religious dominated kleptocracy. Thank you Jinnah indeed.

There is no rule that ‘such agreements are for countries’. A nation is a compact between its people - a compact that they agree to live as citizens under one flag (or more) and under certain conditions. You cannot force allegiance at the barrel of a gun - that only results in acquiescence and resentment. Primarily the compact that the Kashmiris have with both India and Pakistan is that they be allowed to determine their nationhood via a UN Referendum. Secondly, till that referendum occurs, the compact of the Kashmiris with India was via article 370.

India has violated both compacts with the Kashmiris.

If you're talking about China, sure. They have particular types of states and unions, or if you're talking about gulfies who come in agreement with other Arabs to send laborers from Egypt or Jordan, yes. Such arrangement don't work in India. People migrate from place to place, after all we all are Indians first and foremost.

There is no contract between Kashmiris and India that'd give them any right to self determination. Don't make things up, art 370 is no contract, it was a temporary arrangement as is written in the article itself which granted the state a level of autonomy which are now repealed in a legal way defined by the constitution.

India has violated no compacts with anyone, Kashmiris are Indians as much as I or any other person who owns the citizenship as it should be the case.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

An El Fatiha for Rahmet-li Jinnah...

Ruh-unuz shad olsun....

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

But the real concern is that, we aren’t.
What a pity !!!


Get out of the world of ‘IF’.
No one makes singular decisions/deductions based on IFs. History has proven right that UNFORTUNATELY, the Hindu REGIME of subcontinent will always be hostile to others. Prime example is Current India, Rajputs during Mughal era, those who betrayed Mughals in favor of EI Company and eventually got a well deserving dark fate and a slap on the face by the EIC themselves.

You guys can never mend your mentality of HATRED.

Are you an idiot or do you lack comprehension skills.Do i need to spoon feed here what i said..

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

So tell me who are we, we are mixed race but some how we are related to India genetically

Not really. At MOST less than 5% of modern day indians have ANY sort of genetic link to modern day Pakistanis. Are far greater percentage of Afghans and Iranians have a stronger genetic link to Pakistanis. Doesn't mean to say that we are the same or should form a single nation with Afghanistan or Iran.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Not really. Less than 5% of modern day indians have ANY sort of genetic link to modern day Pakistanis. Are far greater percentage of Afghans and Iranians have a stronger genetic link to Pakistanis. Doesn't mean to say that we are the same or should form a single nation with Afghanistan or Iran.

They have minimal less than 5% as you say

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

They have minimal less than 5% as you say

Typo, only 5% MAXIMUM of indians have ANY sort of genetic link to Pakistan WHATSOEVER.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Typo, only 5% MAXIMUM of indians have ANY sort of genetic link to Pakistan WHATSOEVER.

but in previous threads we have none, at least you agreed in some degree, that we have minimal genetic links to Indians

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

but in previous threads we have none, at least you agreed in some degree, that we have minimal genetic links to Indians

More like a small minority of indians have a genetic link to us. But that does not matter or mean anything. A FAR greater percentage of Afghans/Iranians have a greater genetic link to Pakistanis than indians do. Doesn't mean we are the same or should create a single nation together.

 

[313ghazi]

Was it ever in doubt? Not in my mind.

 

[macnurv]

LOL Are you affirming that Muslims cannot co-exist with any other group? @hussain0216 coz citizen amendment bill fast track citizenship process to minorities from Afg, Pak and BD.

Are you born this stupid or youre a proud graduate of Whatsapp university? We know the answer, youre both.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Past 70 years Jinnah's Pakistan is in quite a lot of trouble, your nation as a whole is comparable to Bihar in India. If Jinnah was alive, he'd probably migrate to his house in Mumbai, which has a helluva lot better standard than land of pure.

Completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Whatever Pakistan's flaws, they are our flaws, and we are responsible for fixing them. At least we're not suffering under the yoke of a bigoted & hate driven genocidal maniac like Modi.

You're repeating your pov without even considering what will be the state of migration. How do you distribute 40% of population without getting majority in a single constituency? Do tell me the math of that.

Who cares how many Muslim legislatures are elected. Did all Muslims vote for another Muslim? No. Maybe in your imagination that's how it works, not so much here.
Pakistani's scale of secularism is defined as how many MNA's from one community elected. Dayum!

Yeah, he might as well as had the foresight of Pakistan going into a religious dominated kleptocracy. Thank you Jinnah indeed.

I never said 'there wouldn't be a Muslim majority in a single constituency' - I said that merely throwing the 40% number around is misleading, since the existing Indian Muslim population is too spread out in India to make much of a difference at the constituency level (barring a handful of constituencies) and that even on the Pakistani & Bangladeshi side the number of constituencies that would have a Muslim majority would be reduced because millions of people wouldn't have migrated.

Overall, the number of Muslim seats in the National Assembly would be significantly lower than the actual population of Muslims in a hypothetical 'United India'. You just have to look at how many seats Muslims have currently in India despite a 200 million population. Add in regional ethno-cultural-sectarian political dynamics and the Muslim vote would be split even further. There would be no Muslim answer to the kind of Hindu nationalism that the BJP spouts other than a party that argued for Muslim nationalism, which would logically conclude in a demand for a separate country - and that is exactly what Jinnah had the foresight to recognize and thank goodness for that.

Imagine a Muslim nationalist movement years after the British left, demanding a homeland akin to the Khalistan movement - the bloodshed & civil war it would have caused. It may very well have made the violence during partition look insignificant.

If you're talking about China, sure. They have particular types of states and unions, or if you're talking about gulfies who come in agreement with other Arabs to send laborers from Egypt or Jordan, yes. Such arrangement don't work in India. People migrate from place to place, after all we all are Indians first and foremost.

There is no contract between Kashmiris and India that'd give them any right to self determination. Don't make things up, art 370 is no contract, it was a temporary arrangement as is written in the article itself which granted the state a level of autonomy which are now repealed in a legal way defined by the constitution.

India has violated no compacts with anyone, Kashmiris are Indians as much as I or any other person who owns the citizenship as it should be the case.

It has nothing to do with China or the 'gulfies' - the suggestions I made can be implemented within any country. Migration occurs between nations under a legal framework so it can also occur within nations under a legal framework.

India made a compact with the Kashmiris, Pakistan and the UNSC/international community, to allow the Kashmiris to determine their own nationhood by means of a plebiscite when it herself went to the UNSC and committed to the UNSC Resolutions MULTIPLE times. It made a second compact with the Kashmirs when it agreed to article 370 as an interim arrangement till the resolution of the J&K dispute in accordance with the UNSC Resolutions.

Kashmiris are not Indian, they never have been - the UNSC Resolutions are a clear statement to that effect. What you have is India occupying millions of Kashmiris and forcing them to become Indians at the barrel of a gun - that is the example of a weak, insecure & fascist State, which is why it shouldn't surprise anyone that the BJP is bringing the bigotry and fascism that has always existed in India out into the light for everyone to see.

 

[SIPRA]

Imagine a Muslim nationalist movement years after the British left, demanding a homeland akin to the Khalistan movement - the bloodshed & civil war it would have caused. It may very well have made the violence during partition look insignificant.

In fact, it was the clear and present danger of a disastrous Hindu-Muslim civil war, right in the presence of British rule, and consequent total fragmentation of the subcontinent, which forced both British and Congress to concede the demand of Pakistan.