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JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

That is article translation
http://zqb.cyol.com/html/2017-09/28/nw.D110000zgqnb_20170928_1-11.htm

"Eagle-VI" China-Pakistan Air Force joint training, air force a brigade deputy brigadier Xin Xin, with superb flying skills, won the same as Pakistan's southern air force commander Major General Haxi Bu praised. Liu Yinghua / photo

At the foot of the Tianshan Mountains, in the desert Gobi, the afternoon sunshine penetrated the clouds. An aircraft fighter whistled and landed lightly. September 24, "Eagle-VI" China-Pakistan Air Force joint training last flight day, 12 am, red and blue against a wave after the end, the fighter returned.

Just before the conclusion of the joint training, there was a stirring scene.

Far, a J-11BS flew from the clouds, it is necessary to close to the runway, but to a whistling height of 50 meters. The front of the aircraft was occupied by Major Xin Xin, the pilot of the Chinese Air Force, and Rear Admiral Haseb, commander of the Pakistani Air Force of the South, in the rear cabin.

People's eyes follow the warplanes, and saw the limit jumped to 200 meters, and then began to roll, once, twice, three times, and then rapidly declined. People's nervous mood has not yet recovered and it has come to an ultra-low level. "The word, it seems that still unresolved, and then with less than 600 meters radius of rotation, a small landing route.

More than 20 tons of heavy fighters flirted like swallows, leaping, hovering, rewinding, rolling ... a series of wonderful moves dizzying, people can not help but muster the palm.

War Eagle Triumph, cockpit cover open, white hair Habib revealed a satisfactory smile, as an expert proficient in BFM (fighter basic air tactical action), he gave Xin Xin thumbs up: "Xin, you have put The ultimate performance of the aircraft flew. "

In this "Eagle-VI" joint training of Pakistani Air Force, the proportion of Chinese young pilots has increased substantially. Pilots born after 1985 have become the main force. For these new faces, Commander War Fighting Commander of the Western Theater Air Force said: "I am confident of our young pilots!"

The actual generation tempered, full emboldened

The joint training of Pakistani Air Force, pilot Zhu Zhenhua's first encounter encountered unexpected challenges.

This is a 2 to 2 air combat confrontation, he and his comrades opposed two Pakistani "Fierce Dragon." However, just before taking off his comrades aircraft appeared a small situation.

2 pairs of 2 into a pair of 2, Zhu Zhenhua did not apply to cancel the confrontation. After the fighter jet rose, he let go of his hand and dare to fight daringly. After several rounds of "fierce fighting", he finally seized the fledgling fighter jet to win the air war. "Mr.ZHU, good job!" Hearty confrontation, Pakistani pilots patting Zhu Zhenhua shoulder, not only for his skills and tactics, but also for him bloody.

This actual combat level of the joint training of China and Brazil surpassed the previous ones with the addition of close combat support, night-time night training, joint anti-terrorism and other practical operational issues, and the contents of the courses are even more abundant. Among them, the day and night air combat confrontation are canceled height difference, blitzkrieg set a complex unfamiliar threat to the environment, combat targets cover mobile and fixed, plane and three-dimensional, system confrontation hybrid linkage, multiple fusion, offense and defense quick, more difficult intensity closer to actual combat. This is a test for young Chinese pilots, but the usual actual combat training adds to their strength.

Boundless sand, a latent parachute squadron, reconnaissance found the "terrorist" hiding point. They sent back the blow request through the Beidou Navigation System. At this point, pilot Wang Chi Bo is driving "Flying Leopard" air cruise, receiving the information, he quickly locked target. A few minutes later, a precision-guided bomb fired from "Flying Leopard" fighter hit the target accurately and the "terrorist" camp instantly turned into a sea of flames.

This is a scene from the joint training on offensive by the Chinese and Pakistani seismists on September 20. When the real-time screen reached the command lobby, suddenly thunderous applause, Pakistani commanders repeatedly praised.

Close Support Support (CASA), the Air Forces (CAA), is an additional aviation training program for supporting the ground, sea forces, amphibious forces and special forces. This course also uses live-fire attacks. In this joint training, the first live ammunition course was organized to project more than 60 live ammunition targets.

Behind the hair hit is the hard work of the Air Force to grasp actual combat training.

A month ago, pilot Wang Chih-bo just attended a joint exercise with the Navy and completed his exact target hits in the attack on the offshore targets. He and his comrades-in-arms arrived later than the Pakistani joint training camps in Pakistan. After a short period of targeted training, they were targeted and successfully completed the attack.

Live-fire training is a miniature of the actual training of the Air Force. In recent years, the Air Force has stepped up its efforts in conducting live-ammunition training, ranging from simulating a target to a solid target, moving targets from a fixed target to a target, and the degree of difficulty is greatly enhanced. The air force stationed in the Air Corps a brigade to complete all the pilots have been modified rocket, aviation bombs, precision guided bombs and other types of ammunition.

In recent years, the intensity of actual combat training of the Air Force has surpassed that of the past. The Chinese PLA Air Force continued to organize its air-to-air combat and blitzkits contests, carried out extensive training in difficult courses such as valley flight, low altitude at low altitude and real-time target shooting under the boundary conditions. The actual combat capability of the PLA troops is getting stronger and stronger.

This change was seen by Pakistani pilots. Ali, Captain Pilgrim of Pakistani Phantom Squadron, said: "Chinese pilots have made great strides in handling, energy utilization and judgment of the situation. Each time a move is a challenge and an enjoyment. "

The reform and transformation of the generation, dare to break through

Pakistani Lieutenant Colonel Omar is the fourth to participate in the CMBU training. "Every time they are together, they have all been newly increased. Every joint training, they are all very impressive." Omar admits that from the Chinese side Pilots learn more and more things.

New equipment, new training methods, new system, this generation of pilots is undoubtedly lucky. In the recent five years, a batch of new equipment has been deployed to the armed forces and a large number of new training methods have been put into force. The military reform has also increased the troop training vitality. This age background makes this generation of pilots more creative, which has also made Pakistan's good practices quickly learned from our actual training.

Bold and bold style, frequent use of the throttle, large amount of maneuver "in place", which is the intuitive experience of the pilots and Pakistani pilots after the exchange.

An example is the "landing of a small airline." Landing on a small route is the pilot landing in the safest and controllable conditions in the shortest time under visual conditions. This not only shortens the time for re-dispatching the aircraft, but also effectively saves resources on occupied routes. This is actually a kind of training to adapt to the war.

Although the small route is also a training course for Chinese pilots, most of the flights in the past are still controlled by large routes. Due to their different training concepts, Chinese pilots are very specific and detailed in their take-off, departure, collection and return flights.

"You Fight Like You Train!" The concept emphasized by Pakistani pilots benefits Chinese pilots.

In 2015, an Air Brigade opened its daily training "Small Airline Landing," and Liu Zhankun, the deputy chief of staff of the brigade, told the author that aircraft landing time has now been reduced by two-thirds, which is close to the aircraft's extreme performance.

The joint training, our harvest both tangible, dominant, but also implicit, invisible, more attention to the latter training officers and soldiers. Major General Gu Qingyou, secretary of the temporary party committee of the Chinese joint training unit, said: "What we need more is the collision of training concepts, the agitation of operational thinking and the promotion of awareness."

"Difficult is to break the shackles of ideas." Air Force deputy brigadier Wang Xiaojun brigade told the author, "CMB is a" touchstone "like" looking in the mirror "can show our deficiencies, such as 'medical treatment' can be treated Illness. "

Striving for innovation is a trait of young pilots of this generation. As soon as they talked about flying and their eyes sparkled, they did not talk about their own shortcomings. The most talked about how to improve the actual combat level. Pakistani pilot Fassim said: "They (Chinese pilots) are hungry for learning and are bent on seeking new breakthroughs in joint training so as to enhance their tactical accomplishments and combat capabilities."

Major General Wang Yanshi, commander of the Chinese training unit, introduced that "since the joint training exercises were conducted in Pakistan, each time there has been a major breakthrough."

Participate in the "Eagle-VI" Pakistani Air Force joint training of nine aircraft models, a total of more than 40 aircraft, the same airport group training, courses difficult, take-off and landing density, confrontation strength. Such a campaign-class training like the past requires the former military air force first-level organs and organizations, but now led by the Air Force to take charge of a base in Xinjiang, "base - Brigade" institutional elements of integration, system integration, smooth and efficient advantage highlights.

Since 2012, the armed forces have begun to push for adjustment and reform. The new organizational structure has effectively promoted the improvement of the combat effectiveness of the armed forces. Air Force stationed in a base in Commanders Major General Liu Wenqi said: "The fingers clenched fist stronger, the new system requires us to be positive, and strive to each unit, each element, each module are training and strong mixing, in order to achieve 1 +1 > 2 benefits. "

Open generation military training generation, international range of children

The 29-year-old Uighur pilot Nigat Kurir was the first to participate in the joint training of China and Pakistan. During the training on the first day of the joint training, he and the Pakistani Mirage fighter jets successfully destroyed the target. After the exercise, Ngati went onto the podium and reported his personal performance to Brigadier General Imran, Pakistani joint training unit commander.

From "can not open the mouth" to "barrier-free exchange," the younger generation of Chinese pilots improve the English proficiency level for the Pakistani counterparts admiration. Nowadays, bilingual commanders have entered our daily training and English proficiency has also become a factor in pilot ratings. Pilot's phone mostly download English learning App. This time, the joint training commanders and mission officers of China and Pakistan all expressed in English and were impressive.

In the confrontation scene, you can also see the pilot "tear name card" picture - this is the ceremony of international air combat, the winner can tear off the opponent's chest name card. Pakistani pilots personality flaunt, after the completion of the collaboration they will take the initiative to declare war: "I'll shoot you!" Its victorious character revealed, which is in sharp contrast with the courteous Chinese. Now, we can see from the joint training that the young Chinese pilgrims face the aggressive momentum of the Pakistani pilots with no fear of self-confidence.

In the past several sessions of the CMBU training, the pilots' exchanges between the two sides required collective organization and translation. Now, both the training camps of China and Pakistan have no walls. Pilots can go there and do not need to translate each other. The content of the exchange also focuses on the cognition of equipment and tactics from the life customs of both parties.

Frequent "open training" broke the past, "left hand right hand" situation. After 2012, China's military exchanges with foreign countries are getting more and more frequent. In the course of "going global", pilots made a series of joint trainings in series such as the "Chinese darts", "the eagles" of China and Pakistan, and the "Eagle Strikes" between China and Thailand. They all came to understand themselves more clearly and positioned themselves at the same time Also gained confidence.

The author found an interesting phenomenon during the interview. During the inter-CMB pilot call, the codes of pilots were all numbers. Now the codes are more interesting - some are called "Saker," and some Called Wolf. Xin Xin's code-named Kratos, it is the name of God of War in Greek mythology.

Pilot Zhou Zhiyong said: "These codes are taken by the pilot himself, only three consecutive successful mission, the code can be fixed."

These codes highlight the personality of the new generation of pilots and the pursuit of victory. This is manifested especially in the confrontation with multiply.

This joint training adopts the "same-type confrontation", that is, taking pilots to participate in the entire process from mission planning and implementation of tactics to flight commentary, learning about each other's flight concepts and equipment performance, and deeply communicating operational concepts and tactical wars law.

Almost every course has set up a mixed formation of both Chinese and Pakistani fighters to accomplish the task. After each course, the joint training office will organize the joint reps of both sides of the two countries in order to implement the tactics from pre-war planning to tactical implementation With the tray out. Among these, a group of Chinese pilots showed very eye-catching performance.

"They are familiar with aircraft performance, good flying skills, strong combat awareness and understanding of the tactics of other Air Force powers and have very high professional qualifications." Omar Bin Rafah commented on the Chinese young pilot in such a way that " Training is a milestone, the Chinese Air Force combat is undergoing qualitative change. "

The great era of reform and strengthening the armed forces gave birth to a new generation of Chinese Air Force pilots. Chinese Air Force Spokesman Shen Jinke said: "Building a world-class air force can not be achieved without the first-class flying talents. The new generation of pilots use the mission to fly, fly with wisdom, fly out of the Air Force, God, flying out of the core ability to fight and win the battle, they will become the new force to win the void. "

Yang Jin Wang Li Source: China Youth Daily (September 28, 2017 Version 11)
 
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The purpose of the exercise is to detect weaknesses and then eliminate them. Learning from mistakes make us perfect in achieving our goal. The exercises are not hold to determine winner and loser. But to devise strategies against adversaries and their weaknesses.
 
screenshot_2017-10-25-22-03-42-png.433373


Nice to see all operations are moving along nicely


What was the target for 31st Oct? 100 Aircraft ?
 
Well, I want to explain something,
jf-17 is a joint program between China and Pakistan, most of it's component like airframe design, sencers and radar etc are Chinese with some ToT,Chinese can understand the weakness of jf-17, where jf-17 is an alien tech for Indian sukhoi,
Point it if I am wrong
i posted the translation of the artical where did it talked about JF-17
 
Under or Over Estimation are both extreme. Both Forces know they are capable forces. BVR is mostly going to miss targets in the end close combat will show the true results and of course pilot skills. BVR kill capability is very less its not just aircraft's personal jamming capability but AWACS, Ground Jammer's, Temperature and other factors of nature will degrade the performance of BVR missile and also not to ignore the look down shoot down they are also factors. Since both are neighboring countries GOD forbid if war does erupt the jets most probably most of the jets would probably be in radius of under 90 - 100 km if not all most of the jets would.
 
BVR kill capability is very less
Your statement is not very true. BVR hit rate depends on many things.
1- Missile technology
2- Quality control of missile production
3- Shelf life of missile
4- Development & Improvement of counter measures technologies
5- Size of target
6- Distance to target
7- Speed /Altitude /agility of target
8- To some extent terrain as well.
9- Man behind the machine
10- Integration with a/c

Now, AIM-120 is a good BVR with impressive stats. while SD-10 is at par and progressing fast.
 
Your statement is not very true. BVR hit rate depends on many things.
1- Missile technology
2- Quality control of missile production
3- Shelf life of missile
4- Development & Improvement of counter measures technologies
5- Size of target
6- Distance to target
7- Speed /Altitude /agility of target
8- To some extent terrain as well.
9- Man behind the machine
10- Integration with a/c

Now, AIM-120 is a good BVR with impressive stats. while SD-10 is at par and progressing fast.
These Factors are what reduces the kill probability. Most of the amraam kills are over old soviet era technology fighters in modern era with all 4th generation jets are equipped with multiple types of jammers be in face of Jammer Pod or built in and most of the kills are not done at even the 40% of range. and the probability decreased with target range. If stating the AIM 120D and AIM 120C5+ consider that most of the jets since 90's are also upgraded with newer improved jamming and ew capabilities I dont see more than 60% capability for AIM 120 later versions and most of them wont be used before 40 to 50 km range being D variant an exception or even at wvr just like f15 vs mig 25 cases. With the addition of ground jammers, weather and AWACS I believe that BVR wont do much but WVR combat will result who is winner of air battle.
PS Most of kills were after multiple shots fired and most of the engagements were done when numerically US had more jets in that particular area vs the iraqi or other arab jets.
 
*Usefulness of BVR combat*


https://defenseissues.net/2013/04/27/usefulness-of-bvr-combat/

Very informative and detailed read.

Clears so much...

Meanwhile, using active sensors is outright suicidal in combat. Aircraft using active sensors will be quickly detected and targeted by modern defense and EW suites, and unique radar footprint may allow for BVR IFF identification. This can allow passive aircraft to launch BVR infrared or anti-radiation missile, and/or to use data acquired to achieve optimal starting position and speed for following dogfight. Only countermeasure is to turn radar off and rely solely on passive sensors. IRST is especially useful here, as while air temperature at 11 000 meters is -56 degrees Celzius, airframe temperature due to air friction can reach 54,4 degrees Celzius at Mach 1,6 and 116,8 degrees Celzius at Mach 2. It is also very difficult to impossible to jam, and offers greater angular resolution than radar. Result is that flying from cloud to cloud is still a viable combat tactic; but it is not perfect either, as clouds are not always present and may not be close enough for aircraft to avoid detection in the mean time.

This is why IRST should be preferred over AESA for any aircraft that PAF flies or purchases.
 
i posted the translation of the artical where did it talked about JF-17
10th Paragraph:
"This is a 2 to 2 air combat confrontation, he and his comrades opposed two Pakistani "Fierce Dragon." However, just before taking off his comrades aircraft appeared a small situation."

"Fierce Dragon" is what Chinese call JF-17 / FC-1.

But what exactly do you want to know?
 

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