JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 6]

[HRK]

All of the weapons have been tested on JF-17 in China this includes, CM-400, CM-101, MAR-1, H-4

this make sense .... but ... but .... but

and Ra'ad (Haft VIII) ALCM

does not make logical sense to test this sys. at foreign land by a foreign company .... (ya I known we have very strong relations with CHINA but even then it is something hard to swallow)

 

[Thunder.Storm]

In order to assure a kill at BVR range you would need to launch 2 BVRs a short time apart. Now there is no reason to have a capability to engage 2 while following 4 if you can only fire 2 BVRs, Therefore the need for 4 BVRs.
Oscar posted that the clearance of the wings needs to be addressed prior to inducting DERs. Considering that the two missiles would be placed side by side would that be a problem?
A

"How do you know if Block III AESA is inferior to J-10B if it will be the same. Block III will get a new nose job to get AESA.
During Paris 2015 the rate of climb of JF-17 from 150 m to 1,300 m was so impressive that the pilots of USAF F-15 were stunned.
How do you know that Block II & III will not get IRST and HMD?
One of the upgrade plan is to have PESA along with IRST on board adding four more external pylons and having multiple racks on the existing pylons.
PAF admits that they believe that the payload of JF-17 is little on the lighter side. But they intend to increase while reducing the original weight of the aircraft using composite material and adding more multi mission weapons. The plan is to have CAP mission of JF-17 with 6AAMs
AVIC said that they have developed a more powerful R-93 engine for twin-seater FC-1/JF-17 with A/B trust increased to 8,600kg. This engine will be available for JF-17 Block III."
The third squadron stood up at PAF AB Masroor and it is dedicated for maritime missions. It is equipped with C-802AK, SD-10, and PL-5 E2. All of the weapons have been tested on JF-17 in China this includes, CM-400, CM-101, MAR-1, H-4 and Ra'ad (Haft VIII) ALCM
PLAAF still not decided if they require FC-1 or not?"
POSTED by Hkhan of pakdef.info .posted here to give people an idea of what is being planned for JFT.
A

Ra'ad (Haft VIII) ALCM is not tested even it is not fully integrated on jf-17.

 

[Bratva]

The Dorsal spine on F-16 ''D'' models used to house some hi tech gadgets which are customer specific, it has little or no effect on the performance of the aircraft....ironically F-16s in USAF service neither have a dorsal spine or CFTs.

Is this a single seater F-16 ?

 

[araz]

Ra'ad (Haft VIII) ALCM is not tested even it is not fully integrated on jf-17.

I have quoted someone else's post. As to Raad it may not have been tested or may be is being tested. The question is not one of whether it is integrated now or not but whether it will be integrated with Bl. 3.
Of more interestis the bit about 4 more hardpoints which I had not heard about . Again the only way I see that happening is by changing the way the wheels fold into the body and getting them to fold into the wing. The gun would also have to be resited. However what would be the cowts involved the delay entailed and whether the changes would require further testing. It may mean some delay in block 3. Secondly Bl. 1 and w might not be upgradable to block 3. So what do we do with them? I merely quoted the post to generate further discussion.
A

 

[aliaselin]

The AVIC website has been updated. The export J-10, yes, FC-20.

They have started talking about the 2-seater FC-1

Fighters

View attachment 270084

Unfortunately, the Chinese version of data is different:

飞机长度:14.5米；

飞机高度:4.6米；

翼展：9.5米；

 

[Tempest II]

Unfortunately, the Chinese version of data is different:

Looks like a difference in decimal places. ... ? if you round off the English version figures, you get the same as the Chinese version.

 

[Thunder.Storm]

I have quoted someone else's post. As to Raad it may not have been tested or may be is being tested. The question is not one of whether it is integrated now or not but whether it will be integrated with Bl. 3.
Of more interestis the bit about 4 more hardpoints which I had not heard about . Again the only way I see that happening is by changing the way the wheels fold into the body and getting them to fold into the wing. The gun would also have to be resited. However what would be the cowts involved the delay entailed and whether the changes would require further testing. It may mean some delay in block 3. Secondly Bl. 1 and w might not be upgradable to block 3. So what do we do with them? I merely quoted the post to generate further discussion.
A

actually i posted about raad because you can't trust paf statements they said aesa will be there in bl-3 but now pesa came into consideration they say in public raad is tested or integrated but after so many years only raad is not even fully integrated. i am confirmed about raad 100%. with time passing i am sure that the configuration of bl- 3 will also change. now paf started backing from aesa who knows what will happen to bl-3 like happened to bl-2.

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan keeps mum on first JF-17 buyer



08 NOVEMBER, 2015 BY: GREG WALDRON DUBAI

Kamra-based Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) is staying tight-lipped on the identity of the first international customer for its JF-17 Thunder fighter, but says marketing efforts for the single-engined type are going well.

“The contract is already signed, but we will leave it to the customer to announce it first,” says Air Marshal Javaid Ahmed. “There is a lot of interest in developing countries. I think almost all developing countries are keen to have a look at the JF-17.”

He says potential clients fall into three classes: ones with which there have been negotiations, a group evaluating data, and a group who have shown some interest in the Thunder.

Increased international engagement about the JF-17 has seen promotional efforts transfer from the country’s air force to PAC, where it is overseen by the organisation’s deputy director.

The JF-17 is a joint development between PAC and Chinese airframer Avic and is powered by a single Russian-made Klimov RD-93 engine.

One strength of the programme, adds Ahmed, is that Pakistan has full access to the JF-17’s source code, which gives it significant flexibility in tailoring the jet for customer requirements.

“Having the ability to do all the programming sends a very good message that whatever weapons they have, they can be integrated onto the aircraft. You don’t have to go China.”

Flightglobal broke news of the JF-17’s first contract signing at the Paris air show in June.

 

[aliaselin]

中巴已与第三方签订购枭龙合同 双座型明年首飞 |枭龙|中国|空军_新浪军事

中巴已与第三方签订购枭龙合同 双座型明年首飞
2015年11月10日 12:15 中国新闻网 微博 我有话说(3人参与) 收藏本文
“枭龙”双座型战机模型
　　11月9日，第14届迪拜国际航空展第2天，中航工业下属中航技与巴基斯坦卡姆拉航空联合体举办“枭龙”战机新闻发布会。发布会现场，中巴双方共同向国内外媒体介绍了这款中巴联合研制战机的最新进展，并向外界公布该机型国际市场开拓蓝图。中航技副总经理刘宇、巴基斯坦卡姆拉航空联合体副主席阿沙德· 马利克少将出席新闻发布会，并就媒体关心的问题做出解答。
　　“枭龙”战机是中航工业和巴基斯坦空军本联合研制和生产的以空空作战为主、兼有较强空地作战能力的，全天候、单发、单座、轻型多用途第三代战斗机。
　　经过中巴几年来的联合研制和市场推广，日前双方已与第三方用户签订了购机合同，此举标志着“枭龙”飞机在国际军贸市场的搏击中已占有席位。刘宇指出，“枭龙”战机通过多次参加珠海、巴黎、迪拜等国际航展的静态展示和飞行表演，表现出其在空空作战及空地作战方面的较高效能和超高的性价比，引起了世界航空领域的广泛关注。随着中巴联合研制“枭龙”战机能力和水平的提高，“枭龙”正成为各国空军装备序列中二代战机的理想替换选择，成长为具有广阔市场前景的“蓝海产品”。
　　目前，“枭龙”战机已批量交付巴基斯坦空军并形成战斗力。据阿沙德·马利克少将透露，巴空军目前已装备60架“枭龙”战机，未来还将陆续有40 架装备部队。“枭龙”战机出色的性能和作战能力已多次在巴基斯坦国内和国际性的军事演习中得到验证，马利克少将表示“枭龙”将很快会投入实战。
　　阿沙德·马利克少将还表示，自“枭龙”战机装备巴基斯坦空军以来，其改进和升级工作一直都未停止。后续生产的“枭龙”战机将具备空中加油能力，未来还将增加先进数据链以及电子战能力，挂载新型制导武器。在提到“枭龙”双座战斗教练机的研制进度时，阿沙德·马利克少将透露，“枭龙”双座战斗教练机的设计初衷，不仅可满足飞行员培训等任务，同时兼有与单座型机同样的作战能力，该型机将于明年实现首飞，巴基斯坦空军计划装备双座型“枭龙”。
　　中巴双方坦言，随着“枭龙”战机在迪拜航展上进一步的市场推广，中巴双方联合销售团队也将更深入的共同开拓国际市场，他们预计未来的市场空间将不低于300架。

PAF has changed their mind will be equipped with JF-17B
60 has entered service into PAF
Soon will be used in real combat

 

[araz]

中巴已与第三方签订购枭龙合同 双座型明年首飞 |枭龙|中国|空军_新浪军事


PAF has changed their mind will be equipped with JF-17B
60 has entered service into PAF
Soon will be used in real combat

I think you are confusing them with Block 2. Total of 60 planes have been built so far and they have already been used in the ongoing anti terror operation. As to JFT B. it is being built and we will see it flying in 2016. As to PAF buying it so far we have no intimation from PAF about its role. A fighter trainer is the presumed role so far.
A

 

[monitor]

China, Pakistan to jointly export upgraded JF-17 jet fighter

By PTI | 9 Nov, 2015, 10.28PM IST




BEIJING: China and Pakistan will jointly export an upgraded version of the JF-17 multi-role fighter jet co-produced by the two countries since 1998.

Officials from Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC) and the Pakistani Air Force (PAF) command said today at the ongoing Dubai Airshow that an upgraded version of the jointly developed JF-17 fighter jet is expected to be exported to more customers.

Briefing reporters at Al Maktoum International Airport in Dubai, Liu Yu, Vice President of China National Aero-Technology Import & Export Corporation, said the next generation of the JF-17 Thunder fighter aircraft will satisfy the growing market demand from third parties "as the future JF-17 aircraft is a comprehensive elevation of the aircraft."

The future JF-17 will have more advanced capabilities, such as air-to-air refuelling, data link and electronic warfare, and will be integrated with more new guided weapons, state-run Xinhua quoted Liu as sayingin Dubai.
A dual-seated version of the JF-17 fighter/trainer is also under development, added Liu.

China, which maintained close strategic relations with Pakistan military for long has recently reached USD five billion deal to provide eight submarines to its all-weather ally.

PAF Vice Marshal Arshad Malik said the Pakistani army expects the new version JF-17 jet to get into service by the end of 2016.

The JF-17 fighter is co-produced by AVIC and PAF since 1998 based on the principle of "joint investment, joint development, and sharing risks and returns."

At present, JF-17 fighter is already procured by a third party customer, and several potential customers are conducting or plan to conduct the evaluation of the JF-17 fighter, Xinhua report said without giving details.


The 14th Dubai International Airshow officially kicked off in Dubai yesterday and will run through Thursday.

 

[LonE_WolF]

I think you are confusing them with Block 2. Total of 60 planes have been built so far and they have already been used in the ongoing anti terror operation. As to JFT B. it is being built and we will see it flying in 2016. As to PAF buying it so far we have no intimation from PAF about its role. A fighter trainer is the presumed role so far.
A

the recent interview of JF-17 marketing director indicated that Paf will go for twin seat version and this will be adjusted in the current order of 50 blk 2's.

 

[Bratva]

Pakistan to boost JF-17 production by 25% in '16

Muzaffar Rizvi

Filed on November 10, 2015 | Last updated on November 10, 2015 at 08.35 am

Pakistan plans to boost production of JF-17 Thunder to meet its requirements as well as cater to export orders in future, according to a top official.

Air Marshal Javaid Ahmed, chairman of Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, said the production capacity of Joint Fighter-17 combat aircraft, popularly known as JF-17 Thunder, will be increased by 25 per cent from next year in the wake of growing buying interest shown by developing nations.

"We are in active negotiations with serious buyers from Asia, Africa and the Middle East for JF-17 Thunder and Super Mushshak and are quite optimistic of signing agreements soon," Air Marshal Ahmed told Khaleej Times at the Dubai Airshow.

Pakistan secured the first order from an unknown Asian buyer for its JF-17 Thunder jet fighters at Paris Air Show in June. It is hoping that the updated lightweight, single-engine and multi-role combat aircraft, along with 'Made in Pakistan' tanks and surveillance drones, will help increase military exports in coming years.

"We are looking for orders of about 250 aircraft in addition to international sales in the next few years. I'm very hopeful that we would be able to sign another customer for JF-17 Thunder very soon," Air Marshal Ahmed said.

Analysts said JF-17 Thunder has generated interest among its potential customers in developing nations and now it is time to convert this interest into mature orders. They believe the major selling point of the JF-17 is its cost, which is likely to be substantially less than the $16-$18 million price of a US-made F-16 Falcon aircraft.

Saj Ahmad, chief analyst at London-based StrategicAero Research, said the JF-17 Thunder sales prospects in the GCC states look very robust given the ongoing security concerns in the region. However, pricing remains an issue to give the jet a chance to effectively compete against other single-seat fighters.

"Given the strong relationship Pakistan enjoys with the likes of Qatar and Saudi Arabia, it's possible export orders would come from these nations first," Ahmad told Khaleej Times.

JF-17 Thunder, which was first inducted in 2010, is co-developed by the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex and the Chengdu Aircraft Corporation of China. It is deployed for aerial reconnaissance, ground attack and aircraft interception with an operational ceiling of 55,000 feet. "Pakistan Aeronautical Complex has the capacity to enhance JF-17 Thunder production rates. We initially started at a slow phase and are manufacturing 16 aircraft this year," the chairman said, adding that 12 aircraft have already been produced in 2015 so far and four more will be ready by year-end.

"Hopefully, we will be producing 20 aircraft at the aeronautical complex," he added.

To a question, he said the aeronautical complex will continue to maneuver the production rate to accommodate JF-17 Thunder customers.

"It takes 10-12 months to garner all resources for production and that is enough time to meet the export commitment. We have been working very closely with our Chinese partners to further increase the production capacity," he said.

To a question about Super Mushshak, he said Pakistan has already signed a contract for trainer aircraft with Iraq and two more deals are likely to mature in coming months.

"We are actively in negotiations with two other countries in the GCC and Mena region. Some African countries are also keen to buy Super Mushshak, which is a very good military trainer aircraft," he said.

Pakistan signed two deals with Iraq in May 2014 to supply 20 Super Mushshak MFI-17 aircraft and give training to Iraqi Air Force. Denmark, Norway, Iran, Oman, Syria and Saudi Arabia are among other customer of Super Mushshak, which is on static and aerial display at the Dubai Airshow.

Air Marshal Javaid Ahmed said the participation of Pakistan Air Force in this air show is a matter of great pride for the country.

"We have very good relations with the UAE, Saudi Arabia and other GCC countries. We always feel proud to see the progress and development in the UAE," he said.

 

[Tempest II]

Dubai 2015. I would have wanted to think the "111" is a hint to block III but there is nothing visible on the model to support that.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

Pakistan plans to boost production of JF-17 Thunder to meet its requirements as well as cater to export orders in future, according to a top official. Air Marshal Javaid Ahmed, chairman of Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, said the .............."We are looking for orders of about 250 aircraft in addition to international sales in the next few years. "

Thats good that we are boosting production but let the JF-17 Block III be the last block and have 150 total JF-17. Then we should license manufacture JF-31 for our future needs.