What's new

JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 6]

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sir its a Fighter jet not MAULA JUT


Oh really so F-16 having 9 hardpoints and and other European fighter having 13 hardpoints.. you call them Maula jutt.?

If we use more powerful Engine which could be RD-93 MA and by using light carbonfiber composite material we can decrease the weight and get more payload means extra hardpoints.. So it will be maula jutt...
 
.
It was just a joke, Sir believe me blk 2 will be having such figures in its wings, as dual racks are being integrated for all possible weapons. The weapon chart is not a fake chart. Thunder will carry 8 free fall 500Lb bombs or 4 LGB's. or 4 Jdams 2 x 500kg and 2 x 250 kg at a time like F-16.or 4 SD-10 and 2 PL-5E2 or could also carry 8 durandal bombs with 2 Air to Air missiles. There are many more combinations with multiple launch racks being designed and installed.The 4 durandals or Hafr being shown are on inner pylon and the othe pic shows them in outer pylon. It means it can carry on both pylons that makes 4 on each wing. jf-17_thunder_hafr_runway_bomb_load.jpgjf-17_thunder_hafr_runway_bomb_load.jpgMirage multi  racks.jpgjf-17_thunder_mission_load.jpg

Same as our Mirages can still carry 8 x 500LB bombs. Its just our Air Force Media doesn't want to show off for its weapon load. Beilieve me had a picture of Pak Mirage carrying 12 durandal bombs. Will try to search out for it again.
 
.
Thats an early news and I believe this is quiet a possible scenario but it will increase the price and performance as well because EJ-200 in comparison to RD-93 is much better in TWR and other performance. Indeed it is going to increase JFT capability multifold and I think if RSAF goes for a bigger quantity of JFT like 150 or more then they can ask for a assembling or partial transfer of technology for the engine because both Typhoon and JFT uses these engines and it will be a sizeable quantity like around 500 engines. 120 EFT is equal to 240 engines and spare engines may be around 40 to 60 and JFT if in quantity like 150 then including spare engines the quantity will be around 180 to 200 :D Thinking LOUD :D.

Price increase is no problem for RSAF they currently are flying all multi engined and expensive aircraft. They have 26 EFT and 72 more ordered with an additional 72 option. Hence the possibility of having more or less 300 EJ-200 just for these EFT.

If 100 - 150 Single engined aircraft ie JF-17 with EJ-200 then your minimum threshold 450-500 engines is easily attainable.

So far what is public through JF-17 videos and PAF documentaries is that the aircraft is designed to accommodate western and eastern engines. Have they been able to test it with western engines is still unknown.
 
Last edited:
.
Price increase is no problem for RSAF they currently are flying all multi engined and expensive aircraft. They have 26 EFT and 72 more ordered with an additional 72 option. Hence the possibility of having more or less 300 EJ-200 just for these EFT.

If 100 - 150 Single engined aircraft ie JF-17 with EJ-200 then your minimum threshold 450-500 engines is easily attainable.

So far what is public through JF-17 videos and PAF documentaries is that the aircraft is designed to accommodate western and eastern engines. Have they been able to test it with western engines is still unknown.

Absolutely right as this machine has a modular design to accommodate any engine of similar class whether long, short, fat or thin but all is needed is to integrate and test with new engine as every engine has different type of fittings and to check how it behaves with different power plant.
EJ-200 has FADEC better spool time which means better acceleration and carefree handling. it's baseline engine for trench 1 is 90 Kn approx and it has minimum 60Kn of dry thrust which will be increased up-to 72Kn in Stage 1 improvement and can be extended to 78Kn in Stage 2 I believe it may also increase the range as it is more fuel efficient and as if Stage 2 engines introduced to JFT then their is a possibility that it can attain super cruise speed but the question is the airframe is worthy to handle that burden or not.
 
.
Absolutely right as this machine has a modular design to accommodate any engine of similar class whether long, short, fat or thin but all is needed is to integrate and test with new engine as every engine has different type of fittings and to check how it behaves with different power plant.
EJ-200 has FADEC better spool time which means better acceleration and carefree handling. it's baseline engine for trench 1 is 90 Kn approx and it has minimum 60Kn of dry thrust which will be increased up-to 72Kn in Stage 1 improvement and can be extended to 78Kn in Stage 2 I believe it may also increase the range as it is more fuel efficient and as if Stage 2 engines introduced to JFT then their is a possibility that it can attain super cruise speed but the question is the airframe is worthy to handle that burden or not.[/QUOTE]

This engine is EJ-210 the one offered to Turkish Fighter X program which is being closely looked at by the RSAF and PAF as this might be replacing the F-15 and F-16. There are also reports that RSAF was interested in F-35 but that was refused after the Israel Air Force (IAF) signed an agreement for a few.

There are rummer that Pakistan has asked for a Stealth variant JF-17 perhaps that might be able to super cruise, how ever it is not clear if that will be know as Block 3.

So far PAF has shown mature heads and kept the targets for this project as realistic as possible hence it might be possible that only a few changes are made to the actual design but CFT is a must. Some other systems mostly Russian can also be incorporated so that the Central Asian States and Mig -29's market can be exploited. This is because the MIG-35 has not secured any orders and the company is unable to sustain.

In case a better engine is offered by Russia or Western country then a carrier based aircraft might also be looked at.
A single engined aircraft based on aircraft carrier is a market that is open. Mostly all the aircraft that are being used at the moment are twin engined. The last single engined were Sea Harrier and Super Étendard. F-35 would be the future single engined aircraft but that might no be available to many countries.
 
.
This engine is EJ-210 the one offered to Turkish Fighter X program which is being closely looked at by the RSAF and PAF as this might be replacing the F-15 and F-16. There are also reports that RSAF was interested in F-35 but that was refused after the Israel Air Force (IAF) signed an agreement for a few.

There are rummer that Pakistan has asked for a Stealth variant JF-17 perhaps that might be able to super cruise, how ever it is not clear if that will be know as Block 3.

So far PAF has shown mature heads and kept the targets for this project as realistic as possible hence it might be possible that only a few changes are made to the actual design but CFT is a must. Some other systems mostly Russian can also be incorporated so that the Central Asian States and Mig -29's market can be exploited. This is because the MIG-35 has not secured any orders and the company is unable to sustain.

In case a better engine is offered by Russia or Western country then a carrier based aircraft might also be looked at.
A single engined aircraft based on aircraft carrier is a market that is open. Mostly all the aircraft that are being used at the moment are twin engined. The last single engined were Sea Harrier and Super Étendard. F-35 would be the future single engined aircraft but that might no be available to many countries.


Any country with an aircraft carrier has much better options than a carrier variant of JF17... if that ever even reaches the drawing board;; so I dont know which countries you are talking about.

Saudis have better options than the JF17. It does not give them anything new.
 
.
This engine is EJ-210 the one offered to Turkish Fighter X program which is being closely looked at by the RSAF and PAF as this might be replacing the F-15 and F-16. There are also reports that RSAF was interested in F-35 but that was refused after the Israel Air Force (IAF) signed an agreement for a few.

There are rummer that Pakistan has asked for a Stealth variant JF-17 perhaps that might be able to super cruise, how ever it is not clear if that will be know as Block 3.

So far PAF has shown mature heads and kept the targets for this project as realistic as possible hence it might be possible that only a few changes are made to the actual design but CFT is a must. Some other systems mostly Russian can also be incorporated so that the Central Asian States and Mig -29's market can be exploited. This is because the MIG-35 has not secured any orders and the company is unable to sustain.

In case a better engine is offered by Russia or Western country then a carrier based aircraft might also be looked at.
A single engined aircraft based on aircraft carrier is a market that is open. Mostly all the aircraft that are being used at the moment are twin engined. The last single engined were Sea Harrier and Super Étendard. F-35 would be the future single engined aircraft but that might no be available to many countries.

Sir,

If you are an educated person---then you need to read up on it---the design is either stealth or it is not---same with super cruise. Rumors in Pakistan mean nothing----. Pakistanis on the average do not have enough brains to talk about technical issues or understand them.

Carrier based aircraft needs to carry heavy loads---JF 17 is not designed for a carrier based aircraft now or in the future---.

Instead of a more powerful engine---JF 17 needs an AESA radar----. Engine will not do much---but Aesa is a force multiplier---and make the aircraft do wonders.
 
.
Sir,

If you are an educated person---then you need to read up on it---the design is either stealth or it is not---same with super cruise. Rumors in Pakistan mean nothing----. Pakistanis on the average do not have enough brains to talk about technical issues or understand them.

Carrier based aircraft needs to carry heavy loads---JF 17 is not designed for a carrier based aircraft now or in the future---.

Instead of a more powerful engine---JF 17 needs an AESA radar----. Engine will not do much---but Aesa is a force multiplier---and make the aircraft do wonders.

Mastan bhai that was just a hot-talk with Ace Of Air contains a mix of Loud thinking and a few options which does not look feasible yet nothing much.

You are right that it contains pretty much technical mumbo jumbo deals which has not been discussed like super cruise but again I mention that was just a loud thinking.
 
.
Sir,

If you are an educated person---then you need to read up on it---the design is either stealth or it is not---same with super cruise. Rumors in Pakistan mean nothing----. Pakistanis on the average do not have enough brains to talk about technical issues or understand them.

Carrier based aircraft needs to carry heavy loads---JF 17 is not designed for a carrier based aircraft now or in the future---.

Instead of a more powerful engine---JF 17 needs an AESA radar----. Engine will not do much---but Aesa is a force multiplier---and make the aircraft do wonders.

Sir I do have a lot of respect for you but your Quote "If you are an educated person ---then you need to read up on it" is out of proportion. In my earlier post # 1655 that you have referred to states "Stealth variant JF-17 perhaps that might be able to super cruise.".

It does not specify any design parameters that would categorically be able to say this aircraft is a new design or the same with some sort of lower RCS configuration. With my limited ability to understand what stealth means in todays terms is an aircraft that is invisible to electronic early warning i.e radars but it can be visible by other means i.e human eye. I even know that there are many other ways in which it is possible to detect stealth.

As far as the technical aspect an aircraft can be stealth and also be able to super cruise or it is not stealth but has the ability to super cruise.

If we do try to look into what exactly is transonic and supersonic then we can come to a very simple conclusion that during transonic flight some parts of the aircraft may be supersonic but in supersonic flight the entire aircraft would be supersonic. Supersonic flight has a major weakness it can not be done for a long period, where as transonic flight can be done for a longer duration. In super cruise the supersonic flight is able to overcome the limitation of short distance i.e. in super cruise an aircraft can fly for a longer period of time in supersonic flight.

For attaining any kind of flight one requires a power plant i.e Engine. The most important aspect of super cruise is that the engine is more efficient i.e consumes less fuel.

At the end Sir your quote "Pakistanis on the average do not have enough brains to talk about technical issues or understand them."
IS RACIST, AND DEROGATORY.

I understand that you live in USA and have come across many Pakistani persons who are not that well educated because they have been trying to full fill their needs of hunger and poverty, for which they have worked their life or have gone for easy money by cheating the system. One must also look from an other point of view these people who have cheated the system and survived are rather more intelligent than the people who are making or running the system. It cannot be a crime till it is not defined to be a crime, hence crime leads and law follows.

As far as the AESA radar for JF-17 is concerned I fully agree. How ever I did read in some earlier post there were some issues regarding the limited power available form the current JF-17 engines that forces PAF in not to proceed with AESA radar due to the power is not enough to run the cooling system required for an AESA system.

I am unaware if this is still the case.


Any country with an aircraft carrier has much better options than a carrier variant of JF17... if that ever even reaches the drawing board;; so I dont know which countries you are talking about.

Saudis have better options than the JF17. It does not give them anything new.
Sir,
You are correct that there are many better options available. As per my post # 1655 "A single engined aircraft based on aircraft carrier is a market that is open. Mostly all the aircraft that are being used at the moment are twin engined. The last single engined were Sea Harrier and Super Étendard. F-35 would be the future"

Multi engined aircraft are expensive to maintain hence F-35 with VTOL is the American answer. How many countries would F-35 be sold is a question because it is a stealth. France, China and Russia manufacture carrier based aircraft but they are multi engined, so far they are not interested in producing single engined one to counter the F-35. LCA (Tejas) is being tested by the the Indian Navy which could possibly be aimed at the low end market.

So it was loud thinking that Pakistan might want to spoil the Indian dream of a low cost naval aircraft / carrier based aircraft.
 
Last edited:
.
Sir I do have a lot of respect for you but your Quote "If you are an educated person ---then you need to read up on it" is out of proportion. In my earlier post # 1655 that you have referred to states "Stealth variant JF-17 perhaps that might be able to super cruise.".

It does not specify any design parameters that would categorically be able to say this aircraft is a new design or the same with some sort of lower RCS configuration. With my limited ability to understand what stealth means in todays terms is an aircraft that is invisible to electronic early warning i.e radars but it can be visible by other means i.e human eye. I even know that there are many other ways in which it is possible to detect stealth.

As far as the technical aspect an aircraft can be stealth and also be able to super cruise or it is not stealth but has the ability to super cruise.

If we do try to look into what exactly is transonic and supersonic then we can come to a very simple conclusion that during transonic flight some parts of the aircraft may be supersonic but in supersonic flight the entire aircraft would be supersonic. Supersonic flight has a major weakness it can not be done for a long period, where as transonic flight can be done for a longer duration. In super cruise the supersonic flight is able to overcome the limitation of short distance i.e. in super cruise an aircraft can fly for a longer period of time in supersonic flight.

For attaining any kind of flight one requires a power plant i.e Engine. The most important aspect of super cruise is that the engine is more efficient i.e consumes less fuel.

At the end Sir your quote "Pakistanis on the average do not have enough brains to talk about technical issues or understand them."
IS RACIST, AND DEROGATORY.

I understand that you live in USA and have come across many Pakistani persons who are not that well educated because they have been trying to full fill their needs of hunger and poverty, for which they have worked their life or have gone for easy money by cheating the system. One must also look from an other point of view these people who have cheated the system and survived are rather more intelligent than the people who are making or running the system. It cannot be a crime till it is not defined to be a crime, hence crime leads and law follows.

As far as the AESA radar for JF-17 is concerned I fully agree. How ever I did read in some earlier post there were some issues regarding the limited power available form the current JF-17 engines that forces PAF in not to proceed with AESA radar due to the power is not enough to run the cooling system required for an AESA system.

I am unaware if this is still the case.

.

Hi,

JF 17 cannot be converted into super cruise aircraft. It does not have the structural integrity and nor the design for that. Any aircraft used for that purpose has to be built anew from scratch. And then it won't be JF 17 but something else----.

JF 17 cannot be converted into a stealth aircraft either----same parameters need to be met---new air frame and a new design---.

And as you already know the answers to these issues----then act as such.

JF 17 is not a mythical dragon that can change shape and form with the whims and desires of every Pakistani poster.

As for your comments about my living in the U S---please speak in English---I did not understand what you wanted to say---please be clear abut it.
 
. .

First of all Grifo-7 radar does not offer any advantage over KLJ-7 (particularly over V2) so JF-17 is out of question, secondly Pakistan is building Grifo-7 radars under licence in Avionics Factory Kamra; so in short why would Pakistan place order for just 2 Grifo Radars to Selex ??

I think this particular order has nothing to do with Pakistan ....
 
.
Hi,

JF 17 cannot be converted into super cruise aircraft. It does not have the structural integrity and nor the design for that. Any aircraft used for that purpose has to be built anew from scratch. And then it won't be JF 17 but something else----.

JF 17 cannot be converted into a stealth aircraft either----same parameters need to be met---new air frame and a new design---.

And as you already know the answers to these issues----then act as such.

JF 17 is not a mythical dragon that can change shape and form with the whims and desires of every Pakistani poster.

As for your comments about my living in the U S---please speak in English---I did not understand what you wanted to say---please be clear abut it.

Sir,
F-16XL started out as the F-16 SCAMP (Supersonic Cruise and Maneuver Prototype)

If this kind of JF-17 is one day part of the drawing board then what are your thoughts?
 
.
Sir,
F-16XL started out as the F-16 SCAMP (Supersonic Cruise and Maneuver Prototype)

If this kind of JF-17 is one day part of the drawing board then what are your thoughts?

Was F-16 started as Lightweight, cost effective Jet ?
 
. .
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom