It’s time to learn from past mistakes

[Solomon2]

​

It’s time to learn from past mistakes

ABDULATEEF AL-MULHIM
Published — Thursday 22 October 2015

The Arab world is currently going through difficult times. Truth be told, this region has seldom experienced times of lasting stability. Who is to be blamed for this state of affair? Should we pass the buck to foreign powers trying to manipulate the region so as to gain from the disorder in the Arab world or are these self-inflicted wounds that continue to fester?

The majority of the inhabitants of this region believe in conspiracy theories articulated by western powers regarding divisions among the Arabs.

We also cannot deny the fact that it is the Arabs who seek help from western powers to resolve their internal or regional conflicts. Arabs generally refer to the Sykes-Picot Agreement as the source of evil in the Arab world.

We should not forget that the treaty in question is over a century old. Since then many things have happened in the world. Many people in the Arab world say that the treaty led to the divisions among Arabs especially the areas covering Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Palestine. While making such claims we tend to forget that these areas are susceptible to more divisions than what the Sykes-Picot Agreement had initially suggested. This is seen very clearly in many Arab countries.

Each of these countries have been divided in such a way that the influence of the central governments is confined to particular areas and territories outside the influence of the state are generally ignored by the central authorities.

This was not just noticed during the Arab Spring but it was the reason behind the prolonged Lebanese civil war. Lebanon spent lion share of its national budget in Beirut while the rest of the country was ignored. In Egypt, Sinai Peninsula was only remembered when the Israelis occupied it in 1967. Central governments in the Arab world only built and took care of the major cities or cities that were full of people loyal to the central government like what we see in Yemen, Libya or Syria. And when we have revolts, it is always the western powers or the Sykes-Picot Agreement to be blamed. Ironically, at the end of the day, we call western capitals to take care of our self-inflicted wounds.

As for the current chaos in the Arab world, it is only the Arabs who can fix it. Western powers with their war machines or politicians will only prolong the turmoil. It is important for the Arab world to just forget something called the Sykes-Picot Agreement. No matter who planned it and no matter what was the intention of the treaty, it is a century-old treaty. During the last 100 years, the world saw two great wars that caused tens of millions of casualties, complete destruction of countries and use of atom bombs against two cities.

But the conflicting parties of those wars resolved to forget the past and moved on for a better future. It would be pertinent to mention here that the Arab world almost remained unaffected from all the destruction during those wars.

Countries in the Arab world have been blessed with fertile lands, hardworking manpower, raw materials and the most important commodity the world has ever known — the black gold (oil).

The Arab world had the chance to reach to the top of the world in science and technology. Instead of utilizing the wealth for better education, health care services, better infrastructure and better standard of living, it was simply wasted on unnecessary conflicts among each other and against their neighbors. Iraq alone wasted hundreds of billions of dollars generated by oil production on an eight-year war with Iran and the invasion of Kuwait. These hundreds of billions could have made Iraq one of the most advanced countries in the world and could have made the Iraqi people the highest paid in the world.

The Arabs must detach themselves from the past. The past should only be remembered so that we can take lessons from it. The Arab world should think about the future and about the welfare of its future generations. Now, we are seeing millions of displaced Syrians, Iraqis, Libyans and Yemenis who have fled their respective countries and will most likely never return. Many of them are educated and this will cause a very severe brain drain in the Arab world. Ironically, many of them are heading to the western countries that we hold responsible for our collective plight. In the Arab world, there is enough wealth for everyone. But, we lack fair distribution of these riches.

The Arab world these days has become the theater of mini world war. The irony is that all the victims are from the Arab world. It is sad to see the Arab world and its people sharing many common things such as language, culture and religion but we have never seen real unity among its people. We still blame others for our problems. These divisions are caused because of the continued mistrust among the Arabs and not by a century-old treaty.

 

[Schutz]

Couldnt have said it better, world wars ravaged Europe and some countries were literally just rubble yet now they are amongst the best places to live in the world despite having little in the way of resources or industry. The muslim world on the other hand has huge potential yet cant even unite over trivial matters, unity.

Whats happening in the middle east is trivial compared to what happened to most of Europe little over half a century ago but from the UK all the way to Russia you could barely tell there had been mass death just a few years after it happened.

 

[Solomon2]

I despise Jew-subservient slave sheeple bastards. I will shed their blood with my blessed hands. God damn them and their supporters, the world will become Paradise without them.

"...Arab or Palestinian nationals who are living in a cosy atmosphere in London or Dubai have no right to be cheer leaders for violence that they call uprising or Intifada while the other parts of the world call it a televised child and women abuse."

 

[Viper0011.]

"...Arab or Palestinian nationals who are living in a cosy atmosphere in London or Dubai have no right to be cheer leaders for violence that they call uprising or Intifada while the other parts of the world call it a televised child and women abuse."

I agree, cheer leading from multi-million dollar mansions, and getting innocents killed is insane. Both, majority of Palestinians and Israeli's want a peaceful environment. The time has come to reject the violence and work towards lasting peace. This crazy violence hasn't produced anything better for humans, ever!

Time to recognize Israel as a stakeholder, and negotiate a lasting peace deal, with both Israel and Palestinian states in mind. Someone closing their eyes after looking at the Israeli flag, doesn't make the country disappear. So 7 decades long denial has to go away, reality has to synch in, and peace has to be given a real serious chance.

For Pakistanis on this forum, I personally know many Pakistani who got free help from the Jewish community post 911, in all kinds of matters. I also know many Pakistani doctors who used to get hired by top Jewish hospitals on a priority basis. Just a couple of examples to show that the Jewish community doesn't have a "problem" with Muslims. Recognize Israel please and establish mutual trade and business relations. Both countries can be beneficial to each other in many walks of life !

 

[Solomon2]

Every country and peoples in the world recognize this Jesus killing, Prophet killing, God hating, bastard...damned Jew...damned Jewish creed...Jew ways.

A century of Palestinian hatred of Jews
Repudiating the first mufti’s hostility to decency is the only way forward

By Daniel Pipes - - Monday, October 26, 2015
Palestinians are on the wrong track and will not get off it until the outside world demands better of them.

News comes every year or two of a campaign of violence spurred by Palestinian political and religious leaders spreading wild-eyed conspiracy theories (the favorite: al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem is under threat). A spasm of unprovoked violence against Israelis then follows: rocket attacks from Gaza, car-rammings in Israel proper, stone-throwing in the West Bank, street stabbings in Jerusalem. Eventually, the paroxysm peters out, only to start up again not too much later.

True, these bouts of violence bring some gains to the Palestinians; in the United Nations, in faculty lounges, and on the streets of Western cities they win support against Israel. Each round ends, however, with the Palestinians in a worse place in terms of dead and wounded, buildings destroyed and an economy in tatters.

Further, their immoral and barbaric actions harden Israeli opinion, making the prospect of concessions and compromise that much less likely. The cheery Israeli hopes of two decades ago for a “partner for peace” and a “New Middle East” long ago gave way to a despair of finding acceptance. As a result, security fences are going up all over, even in Jerusalem, to protect Israelis who increasingly believe that separation, not cooperation, is the way forward.

It may be exhilarating for Palestinians to watch UNESCO condemn Israelfor this and that, as it just did, but its actions serve more as theater than as practical steps toward conflict resolution.

Whence comes this insistence on self-defeating tactics?

It dates back nearly a century, to the seminal years 1920-21. In April 1920, as a gesture to the Zionists, the British government created a region called “Palestine” designed to be the eventual “national home for the Jewish people.” Then in May 1921, it appointed Amin al-Husseini (1895-1974) as mufti of Jerusalem, a dreadful decision whose repercussions still reverberate today.

Amin al-Husseini remained at the heights of power for decades. He represented "Palestine" at the Bandung Conference in April 1955 (bottom), praying along with King Faysal of Saudi Arabia (top, in head covering), Gamal Abdul Nasser of Egypt (middle, facing camera), and Imam Ahmad of Yemen (right, facing camera).​

Husseini harbored a monstrous hostility toward Jews; as Klaus Gensicke puts it in his important 2007 study, “The Mufti of Jerusalem and the Nazis,” Husseini’s “hatred of Jews knew no mercy, and he always intervened with particular zeal whenever he feared that some of the Jews could escape annihilation.” Toward this end, he initiated an uncompromising campaign of rejectionism — the intent to eliminate every vestige of Jewish presence in Palestine — and used any and all tactics toward this foul end.

The Dome of the Rock pre-mufti, about 1875. Note the general abandonment and disrepair.​

For example, he can be largely held responsibility for the Middle East’s endemic anti-Semitism, having spread the anti-Semitic forgery “Protocols of the Elders of Zion,” the blood libel and Holocaust denial throughout the region. His other legacies include making Jerusalem into the flash point it remains today, spreading many of the anti-Zionist conspiracy theories that afflict the Middle East, and being one of the first Islamists to call for jihad.

He encouraged and organized unprovoked violence against the British and the Jews, including a three-year long intifada in 1936-39. Then he worked with the Nazis, living in Germany during the war years, 1941-45, proving so useful that he earned an audience with Hitler. Nor was this a courtesy visit; as Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu correctly pointed out on Oct. 20, Husseini had a central role in formulating the Final Solution that led eventually to the murder of 6 million Jews.

Hajj Amin al-Husseini inspecting Nazi troops.​

Husseini tutored his young relative, the future Yasser Arafat, and Arafat faithfully carried out the mufti’s program for 35 years, after which his apparatchik Mahmoud Abbas keeps the legacy alive. In other words, Husseini’s rejectionism still dominates the Palestinian Authority. In addition, he spent the postwar years in Egypt, where he influenced the Muslim Brotherhood, whose Hamas spin-off also bears his hallmark rejectionism. Thus do both principal Palestinian movements pursue his murderous and self-defeating methods.

Only when the Palestinians emerge from the cloud of Husseini’s dark legacy can they begin to work with Israel rather than fight it; build their own polity, society, economy and culture rather than try to destroyIsrael‘s; and become a positive influence rather than the nihilistic force of today.

And how will that happen? If the outside world, as symbolized by UNESCO, stops encouraging the Palestinians’ execrable behavior and impeding Israeli defenses against it. Only when Palestinians realize they will not be rewarded for homicidal conduct will they stop their campaign of violence and start to come to terms with the Jewish state.

• Daniel Pipes (DanielPipes.org) is president of the Middle East Forum.

 

[Dubious]

A century of Palestinian hatred of Jews
Repudiating the first mufti’s hostility to decency is the only way forward

By Daniel Pipes - - Monday, October 26, 2015
Palestinians are on the wrong track and will not get off it until the outside world demands better of them.

News comes every year or two of a campaign of violence spurred by Palestinian political and religious leaders spreading wild-eyed conspiracy theories (the favorite: al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem is under threat). A spasm of unprovoked violence against Israelis then follows: rocket attacks from Gaza, car-rammings in Israel proper, stone-throwing in the West Bank, street stabbings in Jerusalem. Eventually, the paroxysm peters out, only to start up again not too much later.

True, these bouts of violence bring some gains to the Palestinians; in the United Nations, in faculty lounges, and on the streets of Western cities they win support against Israel. Each round ends, however, with the Palestinians in a worse place in terms of dead and wounded, buildings destroyed and an economy in tatters.

Further, their immoral and barbaric actions harden Israeli opinion, making the prospect of concessions and compromise that much less likely. The cheery Israeli hopes of two decades ago for a “partner for peace” and a “New Middle East” long ago gave way to a despair of finding acceptance. As a result, security fences are going up all over, even in Jerusalem, to protect Israelis who increasingly believe that separation, not cooperation, is the way forward.

It may be exhilarating for Palestinians to watch UNESCO condemn Israelfor this and that, as it just did, but its actions serve more as theater than as practical steps toward conflict resolution.

Whence comes this insistence on self-defeating tactics?

It dates back nearly a century, to the seminal years 1920-21. In April 1920, as a gesture to the Zionists, the British government created a region called “Palestine” designed to be the eventual “national home for the Jewish people.” Then in May 1921, it appointed Amin al-Husseini (1895-1974) as mufti of Jerusalem, a dreadful decision whose repercussions still reverberate today.

Amin al-Husseini remained at the heights of power for decades. He represented "Palestine" at the Bandung Conference in April 1955 (bottom), praying along with King Faysal of Saudi Arabia (top, in head covering), Gamal Abdul Nasser of Egypt (middle, facing camera), and Imam Ahmad of Yemen (right, facing camera).​

Husseini harbored a monstrous hostility toward Jews; as Klaus Gensicke puts it in his important 2007 study, “The Mufti of Jerusalem and the Nazis,” Husseini’s “hatred of Jews knew no mercy, and he always intervened with particular zeal whenever he feared that some of the Jews could escape annihilation.” Toward this end, he initiated an uncompromising campaign of rejectionism — the intent to eliminate every vestige of Jewish presence in Palestine — and used any and all tactics toward this foul end.

The Dome of the Rock pre-mufti, about 1875. Note the general abandonment and disrepair.​

For example, he can be largely held responsibility for the Middle East’s endemic anti-Semitism, having spread the anti-Semitic forgery “Protocols of the Elders of Zion,” the blood libel and Holocaust denial throughout the region. His other legacies include making Jerusalem into the flash point it remains today, spreading many of the anti-Zionist conspiracy theories that afflict the Middle East, and being one of the first Islamists to call for jihad.

He encouraged and organized unprovoked violence against the British and the Jews, including a three-year long intifada in 1936-39. Then he worked with the Nazis, living in Germany during the war years, 1941-45, proving so useful that he earned an audience with Hitler. Nor was this a courtesy visit; as Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu correctly pointed out on Oct. 20, Husseini had a central role in formulating the Final Solution that led eventually to the murder of 6 million Jews.

Hajj Amin al-Husseini inspecting Nazi troops.​

Husseini tutored his young relative, the future Yasser Arafat, and Arafat faithfully carried out the mufti’s program for 35 years, after which his apparatchik Mahmoud Abbas keeps the legacy alive. In other words, Husseini’s rejectionism still dominates the Palestinian Authority. In addition, he spent the postwar years in Egypt, where he influenced the Muslim Brotherhood, whose Hamas spin-off also bears his hallmark rejectionism. Thus do both principal Palestinian movements pursue his murderous and self-defeating methods.

Only when the Palestinians emerge from the cloud of Husseini’s dark legacy can they begin to work with Israel rather than fight it; build their own polity, society, economy and culture rather than try to destroyIsrael‘s; and become a positive influence rather than the nihilistic force of today.

And how will that happen? If the outside world, as symbolized by UNESCO, stops encouraging the Palestinians’ execrable behavior and impeding Israeli defenses against it. Only when Palestinians realize they will not be rewarded for homicidal conduct will they stop their campaign of violence and start to come to terms with the Jewish state.

• Daniel Pipes (DanielPipes.org) is president of the Middle East Forum.

Oh did you forget to write WHY there is hatred? I dont see any reason to love someone who kills your people, discriminates your people, breaks your home and many other such reasons!

 

[Solomon2]

Oh did you forget to write WHY there is hatred? I dont see any reason to love someone who kills your people -

You might want to demonstrate to people an ability to read and respond as well as an ability to type.

 

[Dubious]

You might want to demonstrate to people an ability to read and respond as well as an ability to type.

You need to learn to read OTHER sources apart from your own propaganda!

In April 1920, as a gesture to the Zionists, the British government created a region called “Palestine” designed to be the eventual “national home for the Jewish people.”

Palestine existed long before that!

Further, their immoral and barbaric actions harden Israeli opinion,

I wonder what victim complex mixed with discrimination results as...
I mean wasnt your leader just recently supporting Hitler? If Mr. Daniel is looking for such morals and cultured actions....then yes Palestinians havent fall that far!

Surprisingly ONLY zionists believe in this shit- No one else!

Holocaust survivors and their descendants accuse Israel of ‘genocide
UK Jewish MP Gerald Kaufman - Israel acting like Nazis in Gaza
Israel bans Norwegian doctor from Gaza for life | Page 4
Chile summons its ambassador from Israel
Bolivia declares Israel a terrorist state, 42 years of visa free travel called off | Page 3

I mean moral values portrayed here are disgusting least to say: Israelis gathering to enjoy nighttime attacks on Gaza | Page 4

Talk about spreading hate: Israeli justice minister considers all Palestinians ‘the enemy’ | Page 2

Lets not forget to let the stats talk:

More Palestinian children killed in 3 weeks than Israeli soldiers in 8 years | Page 4

Shall we recollect your cultured and moral lectures through time:

1. "There is a huge gap between us (Jews) and our enemies, not just in ability but in morality, culture, sanctity of life, and conscience. They are our neighbors here, but it seems as if at a distance of a few hundred meters away, there are people who do not belong to our continent, to our world, but actually belong to a different galaxy." Israeli president Moshe Katsav. The Jerusalem Post, May 10, 2001

2. "The Palestinians are like crocodiles, the more you give them meat, they want more".... Ehud Barak, Prime Minister of Israel at the time - August 28, 2000. Reported in the Jerusalem Post August 30, 2000

3. " [The Palestinians are] beasts walking on two legs." Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts". New Statesman, 25 June 1982.

4. "The Palestinians" would be crushed like grasshoppers ... heads smashed against the boulders and walls." " Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988

5. "When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle." Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.

6. "How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to." Golda Maier, March 8, 1969.

7. "There was no such thing as Palestinians, they never existed." Golda Maier Israeli Prime Minister June 15, 1969

8. "The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war." Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha'aretz, 19 March 1972.

9. David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister): "If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti - Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?" Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paraddoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121.

10. Ben Gurion also warned in 1948 : "We must do everything to insure they ( the Palestinians) never do return." Assuring his fellow Zionists that Palestinians will never come back to their homes. "The old will die and the young will forget."

11. "We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves." Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.

12. "Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001, to Shimon Peres, as reported on Kol Yisrael radio. (Certainly the FBI's cover-up of the Israeli spy ring/phone tap scandal suggests that Mr. Sharon may not have been joking.)

13. "We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel... Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours." Rafael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces - Gad Becker, Yediot Ahronot 13 April 1983, New York Times 14 April 1983.

14. "We must do everything to ensure they [the Palestinian refugees] never do return" David Ben-Gurion, in his diary, 18 July 1948, quoted in Michael Bar Zohar's Ben-Gurion: the Armed Prophet, Prentice-Hall, 1967, p. 157.

15. " ... we should prepare to go over to the offensive with the aim of smashing Lebanon, Trans-jordan and Syria... The weak point in the Arab coalition is Lebanon [for] the Moslem regime is artificial and easy to undermine. A Christian state should be established... When we smash the [Arab] Legions strength and bomb Amman, we will eliminate Transjordan, too, and then Syria will fall.If Egypt still dares to fight on, we shall bomb Port Said, Alexandria, and Cairo." " David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff. From Ben-Gurion, A Biography, by Michael Ben-Zohar, Delacorte, New York 1978.

Source: History Matters: 5 Myths About Israel | Page 4

16. "We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population." Israel Koenig, "The Koenig Memorandum"

17. "Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either.Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population." Moshe Dayan, address to the Technion, Haifa, reported in Haaretz, April 4, 1969.

18. "We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?' Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said 'Drive them out!'" Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.

19. Rabin's description of the conquest of Lydda, after the completion of Plan Dalet. "We shall reduce the Arab population to a community of woodcutters and waiters" Uri Lubrani, PM Ben-Gurion's special adviser on Arab Affairs, 1960. From "The Arabs in Israel" by Sabri Jiryas.

20. "There are some who believe that the non-Jewish population, even in a high percentage, within our borders will be more effectively under our surveillance; and there are some who believe the contrary, i.e., that it is easier to carry out surveillance over the activities of a neighbor than over those of a tenant. tend to support the latter view and have an additional argument:...the need to sustain the character of the state which will henceforth be Jewish...with a non-Jewish minority limited to 15 percent. I had already reached this fundamental position as early as 1940 [and] it is entered in my diary." Joseph Weitz, head of the Jewish Agency's Colonization Department. From Israel: an Apartheid State by Uri Davis, p.5.

21. "Everybody has to move, run and grab as many hilltops as they can to enlarge the settlements because everything we take now will stay ours... Everything we don't grab will go to them." Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.

22. "It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism,colonialization or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands." Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972.

23. "Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment... Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly." Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization, speaking of the Arabs of Palestine,Complete Diaries, June 12, 1895 entry.

24. "One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail." -- Rabbi Yaacov Perrin, Feb. 27, 1994 [Source: N.Y. Times, Feb. 28, 1994, p. 1]

25. "We Jews, we are the destroyers and will remain the destroyers. Nothing you can do will meet our demands and needs. We will forever destroy because we want a world of our own." (You Gentiles, by Jewish Author Maurice Samuels, p. 155).

26. "We will have a world government whether you like it or not. The only question is whether that government will be achieved by conquest or consent." (Jewish Banker Paul Warburg, February 17, 1950, as he testified before the U.S. Senate).

27. "We will establish ourselves in Palestine whether you like it or not...You can hasten our arrival or you can equally retard it. It is however better for you to help us so as to avoid our constructive powers being turned into a destructive power which will overthrow the world." (Chaim Weizmann, Published in "Judische Rundschau," No. 4, 1920)

28. "Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

29. "Tell me, do the evil men of this world have a bad time? They hunt and catch whatever they feel like eating. They don't suffer from indigestion and are not punished by Heaven. I want Israel to join that club. Maybe the world will then at last begin to fear us instead of feeling sorry. Maybe they will start to tremble, to fear our madness instead of admiring our nobility. Let them tremble; let them call us a mad state. Let them understand that we are a savage country, dangerous to our surroundings, not normal, that we might go wild, that we might start World War Three just like that, or that we might one day go crazy and burn all the oil fields in the Middle East. Even if you'll prove to me that the present war is a dirty immoral war, I don't care. We shall start another war, kill and destroy more and more. And do you know why it is all worth it? Because it seems that this war has made us more unpopular among the civilized world.We'll hear no more of that nonsense about the unique Jewish morality. No more talk about a unique people being a light upon the nations. No more uniqueness and no more sweetness and light. Good riddance." --Former Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon

30. "The Modern Age is the Jewish Age, and the twentieth century, in particular, is the Jewish Century." -Yuri Slezkine, Professor of History at University of California, Berkeley, "The Jewish Century"; Princeton University Press

Source: History Matters: 5 Myths About Israel | Page 4

31. "What shocks and worries me is the narrow-mindedness and the shortsightedness of our military leaders. They seem to presume that the State of Israel may or even must-behave in the realm of international relations according to the laws of the jungle- -the long chain of false incidents and hostilities we have invented, and so many clashes we have provoked;" - From Diary of Moshe Sharett, former Primer Minister of Israel in Livia Rokach, Israel's Sacred Terrorism published 980

32. Hebrew essayist Achad Ha-Am, after paying a visit to Palestine in 1891: "Abroad we are accustomed to believe that Israel is almost empty; nothing is grown here and that whoever wishes to buy land could come here and buy what his heart desires. In reality, the situation is not like this. Throughout the country it is difficult to find cultivable land which is not already cultivated."

33. The Balfour Declaration to Baron Rothchild, on the 2nd of November, 1917: "His Majesty's Government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavors to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

34. Lord Sydenham, Hansard, House of Lords, 21 June 1922: "If we are going to admit claims on conquest thousands of years ago, the whole world will have to be turned upside down."

35. Vladimir Jabotinsky, The Iron Wall, 1923: "Zionist colonization must either be terminated or carried out against the wishes of the native population. This colonization can, therefore, be continued and make progress only under the protection of a power independent of the native population - an iron wall, which will be in a position to resist the pressure to the native population. This is our policy towards the Arabs..."

36. Vladimir Jabotinsky, founder of Revisionist Zionism (precursor of Likud), The Iron Wall, 1923: "A voluntary reconciliation with the Arabs is out of the question either now or in the future. If you wish to colonize a land in which people are already living, you must provide a garrison for the land, or find some rich man or benefactor who will provide a garrison on your behalf. Or else-or else, give up your colonization, for without an armed force which will render physically impossible any attempt to destroy or prevent this colonization, colonization is impossible, not difficult, not dangerous, but IMPOSSIBLE!... Zionism is a colonization adventure and therefore it stands or falls by the question of armed force. It is important... to speak Hebrew, but, unfortunately, it is even more important to be able to shoot - or else I am through with playing at colonizing."

37. David Ben Gurion, future Prime Minister of Israel, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985: "We must expel Arabs and take their places."

38. Joseph Weitz, head of the Jewish Agency's Colonization Department in 1940. From "A Solution to the Refugee Problem": "Between ourselves it must be clear that there is no room for both peoples together in this country. We shall not achieve our goal if the Arabs are in this small country. There is no other way than to transfer the Arabs from here to neighboring countries - all of them. Not one village, not one tribe should be left."

39. Israeli official Arthur Lourie in a letter to Walter Eytan, director general of the Israeli Foreign Ministry (ISA FM 2564/22). From Benny Morris, "The Birth of the Palestinian Refugee Problem 1947-49", p. 297: "...if people become accustomed to the large figure and we are actually obliged to accept the return of the refugees, we may find it difficult, when faced with hordes of claimants, to convince the world that not all of these formerly lived in Israeli territory. It would, in any event, seem desirable to minimize the numbers...than otherwise."

Source: History Matters: 5 Myths About Israel | Page 4

 

[Solomon2]

You need to learn to read OTHER sources...ONLY zionists believe -

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."
- Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan

If you believe objective facts exist then the fact that one million people believe in a lie does not make the lie any more true. (And yes, when you claim a majority believes in something, you are asserting that you believe in objective facts!

Palestine existed long before that!

Can you point to its own previous head of state or government?

1...2...3...

All out-of-context stuff that you need to invoke to justify keeping your current opinion rather than changing your mind.

 

[Dubious]

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."
- Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan

what fact? That you are an apartheid state? Its not rocket science and is an open secret!

All out-of-context stuff that you need to invoke to justify keeping your current opinion rather than changing your mind.

I dont need to justify anything it is you and your kind who does that despite knowing all the hate speach going on!

As for out of context...in what context actually can your justice minister call Palestinians what she spewed? Just give me the context....
Can you tell me what was the context for this?

. "The Palestinians" would be crushed like grasshoppers ... heads smashed against the boulders and walls." " Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988

Or this:

"One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail." -- Rabbi Yaacov Perrin, Feb. 27, 1994 [Source: N.Y. Times, Feb. 28, 1994, p. 1]

Or this:

David Ben Gurion, future Prime Minister of Israel, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985: "We must expel Arabs and take their places."

Or this:

18. "We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?' Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said 'Drive them out!'" Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.

Or ANY of those FEW BS words from the mouths and pens OF YOUR MEN!

 

[Solomon2]

what fact? That you are -

You don't have anything to deny the facts presented and stand upon made-up ones and name-calling.

I dont need to justify anything it is you and your kind who does that -

Yeah, you do. You need to justify why you cling to hate and why you don't acknowledge relevant facts and context because Pakistan's peoples have suffered greatly as a result so why should they continue to do so?

You don't get a "pass" on any quote until you've demonstrated you've researched the context thoroughly, that's where its meaning and impact lies.

 

[Dubious]

You don't have anything to deny the facts presented and stand upon made-up ones and name-calling.

1) no facts? Those I presented are from speeches made by your politicians! On the record!
2) They were aware of what had to be done to keep Zionism alive and superiority complex shinning!
3) Name calling? Prove me otherwise...coz you cant hence it is not name calling but FACTS!

why you cling to hate

I cant possibly like a person full of himself...LET ALONE A NATION being preached to do that

There is no better tem than brainwashing!

Can you tell me why your PM said Hitler was innocent? when historical books tell us otherwise! Is that not hatred spewing? Can you tell me why your justice minister spat venom on tv? About Palestinian mothers?

You don't get a "pass" on any quote until you've demonstrated you've researched the context thoroughly, that's where its meaning and impact lies.

Prove me wrong! If you cant then stop pretending it is wrong when you know there is no context on the planet that can even reduce the impact of the words spoken!

because Pakistan's peoples have suffered greatly as a result so why should they continue to do so?

derailing wont save you @Slav Defence I think this guy deserves more negative ratings to let him know what derailing means! He doesnt understand the meaning of derailing and its not the 1st time!

 

[Solomon2]

1) no facts? Those I presented are from speeches made by your politicians! On the record!

Context, mister.

I suspect some of the reason you're upset is that you've been taught that out-of-context quotes and information are, in and of themselves, acceptable proofs. They are NOT! This is part of the mind-twisting Pakistanis have suffered from for decades, mind twisting necessitated because Zionism-hatred could be sustained in no other way!

I cant possibly like a person full of himself...LET ALONE A NATION being preached to do that

You don't like preachers? That's great - when a person can demonstrate sound moral judgment of his own. Pakistanis, denied pro-Israel arguments and demonstrations as a matter of state policy, are very ill-equipped to do that. You can improve the situation and gain moral credibility by fighting for greater freedom of pro-Israel expression in Pakistan.

Can you tell me why your PM said Hitler was innocent?

Now you're just putting words in people's mouths, reducing your credibility even further.

Prove me wrong! If you cant then -

No. You are NOT entitled to your own facts until someone proves you wrong. That's not argument, that's what I call pollution - a variant of the ad hominem fallacy, demanding that your assertion be taken as "truth" simply because it's coming from you, not because the facts and context support it.

derailing wont save you -

When your arguments stand upon errors in logic and context then they are fair game for discussion and not any form of derailment.

 

[Dubious]

Context

You are the one who is after the context...My QUESTION is what CONTEXT ON EARTH allows such hate speech?
Give me a scenario where such shit is tolerated!

I suspect some of the reason you're upset is that you've been taught that out-of-context quotes and information are, in and of themselves, acceptable proofs.

I am asking you for the context (since the last 2 posts)

You seem satisfied by repeating the samething without any regards or understanding of what is asked of you!

They are NOT! This is part of the mind-twisting Pakistanis have suffered from for decades, mind twisting necessitated because Zionism-hatred could be sustained in no other way!

Derailing habits? Carry on your rant but dont quote me to give you the stage!

You don't like preachers? That's great - when a person can demonstrate sound moral judgment of his own. Pakistanis, denied pro-Israel arguments and demonstrations as a matter of state policy, are very ill-equipped to do that. You can improve the situation and gain moral credibility by fighting for greater freedom of pro-Israel expression in Pakistan.

And here we see you failed the context and derailed like you always do @Slav Defence

Gentleman with full command of English is preaching to me regarding context and in his very next para he quotes me out of context! Talk about hypocrisy or lack of understanding of what he is doing - some form of superiority complex where he feels he can do something he is warning the other of?

Now you're just putting words in people's mouths, reducing your credibility even further.

Words in whose mouth? He said Hitler didnt want to kill Jews (completely out of historical context) and that Palestinians put it in Hitler's head

Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu criticized for saying Holocaust was mufti's idea, not Hitler's

(CNN)There's no question Adolf Hitler led Nazi Germany when it implemented the "final solution" in an effort to kill all Jews.
But, in a speech this week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu suggested it wasn't Hitler's idea.
Rather, he pointed to Jerusalem's then-grand mufti, Haj Amin al-Husseini, who met with the Nazi leader in Germany in the early 1940s.
"Hitler didn't want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews," Netanyahu said Tuesday at the 37th Zionist Congress, according to a transcript on his website. "And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, 'If you expel them, they'll all come here.'

"'So what should I do with them?' (Hitler) asked. (Husseini) said, 'Burn them.'"

There's no video or audio, not even a transcript, that can definitively prove Netanyahu's account of the conversation between Hitler and Husseini, who as grand mufti oversaw Muslim sites in Jerusalem.

Netanyahu criticized for Hitler, mufti Holocaust remarks - CNN.com

Do you know why holocaust is so shocking to the world? It is because of the death wish Hitler had on the jews which your PM just tried to overturn ......had anyone else denied it Jews around the world would have cried for another centuries...but its their PM so its fine and lets overlook it and still claim it is right despite being historically wrong...Lovely!

No. You are NOT entitled to your own facts until someone proves you wrong. That's not argument, that's what I call pollution - a variant of the ad hominem fallacy, demanding that your assertion be taken as "truth" simply because it's coming from you, not because the facts and context support it.

I am not demanding anything but I can throw your argument at you coz you are a perfect example of psychological projection!

You are NOT entitled to your own facts until someone proves you wrong.

When your arguments stand upon errors in logic and context then they are fair game for discussion and not any form of derailment.

Yet after 3 posts you cant point a single "context" where such words can be justified! However, you try to justify them?....interesting! Now back to square one....Tell me which context those words were spoken and how it be justified to call whole nations something that bad?

 

[Solomon2]

You are the one who is after the context...My QUESTION is what CONTEXT ON EARTH allows such hate speech?

You're denying yourself context to stand upon your prejudice.

I am asking you for the context (since the last 2 posts)

You haven't yet demonstrated that you accept that context is important at all when it denies you victory.

Words in whose mouth? He said Hitler didnt want to kill Jews (completely out of historical context) and that Palestinians put it in Hitler's head...the death wish Hitler had on the jews which your PM just tried to overturn

Sure, Netanyahu made a gaffe. Zionists called him out on it, too, pointing out that his statements were not 100% correct. But that's in his words and not the meanings that many people have added. Husseini's close cooperation with the Nazis in destroying Jews is not unclear (link) yet many people are leaping down Netanyahu's throat rather than evaluating his point, that the Nazi's dream of exterminating the Jews is the same and connected to that of Arab anti-Zionists. (I find it amusing that ET employed a fantasy writer to comment and expand upon the gaffe - that's just the sort of thing that's needed, because facts in context aren't enough to demonize Netanyahu.)

I am not demanding anything but I can throw your argument at you coz you are a perfect example of psychological projection!

I do not demand anyone take my facts and context at face value. I link to source material that can then be checked and isn't murky.

Yet after 3 posts you cant point a single "context" where such words can be justified! ....Tell me which context those words were spoken and how it be justified to call whole nations something that bad?

When you accept that context matters you will research the context yourself and report back, yes? Until then, what will you do when I provide context? Probably what you've done already today: start yet another thread to blare out and cover up the truth and keep men and women blind.