Its confirmed now - Boeing has won the contract

[Abingdonboy]

Any explanation as to why the US gear is cheaper then the Russians? Sounds almost impossible.

Life-cycle costs. While the Russian equipment may have lower acquisition costs over the life-span of the equipment the US products are significantly cheaper with maintenance having to be done less often and spares being more readily available. Nowadays the Indian MoD factor in life-cycle costs whereas before they only looked at the intial acquition costs which meant the Indian forces got screwed over the course of the products' life. It is a much more senisble way of going about purchasing and is ensuring India is getting some of the best equipment around.

 

[Abingdonboy]

But only when there is no alternative is available, or when there is an additional operational need for it. We need more MPAs, that's why additional P8s were logical, IAF wanted to raise a 2nd squad of C130J, to cover the east, down to the A&N Islands.
The combat helicopter deal on the other side, is just a replacement of 2 x squads of Mi 35s, while the forces are adding Rudhra and LCH helicopters soon as well, which leaves no need for high numbers of additional Apaches. Similarly, the heavy lift competition is just replacing a low number of heavy lift helicopters, that will be used very rarely and in very limited roles only. Our tactical helicopter and workhorse of the forces is the Mi 17, again very low chances for more of them.



That's what I questions at the currently available reports as well, although the Chinook should be cheaper during the life cycle, the unit cost normally should be higher, but the reports are hinting something else. Lets wait and see for a real offical announcement.

15 Chinooks and 22 Apaches is a signifcant force but I suspect the IA/IAF has its eyes on more for sure. With the ever growing threat from on the East these birds are going to play an ever greater part. Addtionally the Chinooks have a greater usabilty beyond just heavy-lift on the borders- it can be used for troop insertion and particuarly SOF support. We can only wait and see I suppose.

+wrt the P-8Is- did the Indian Ocean or Indian coastline increase in size in the time the first 8 were ordered and then the second batch of 4 proposed? And now there is talk of getting upto 25-30.The IN has not revised their requirements intermittently but have taken a pragmatic approach to new purchases. It is an issue of funds and long-term planning. If they had asked for 25-30 P-8s/LR-MPAs back in 2008 what do you think the reaction from the MoD/Finace minestery would have been??!!

 

[Abingdonboy]

 

[jha]

15 seems to be a good number for heavy lifters considering the huge no. of Mil-17s coming in...

 

[sancho]

+wrt the P-8Is- did the Indian Ocean or Indian coastline increase in size in the time the first 8 were ordered and then the second batch of 4 proposed? And now there is talk of getting upto 25-30.The IN has not revised their requirements intermittently but have taken a pragmatic approach to new purchases. It is an issue of funds and long-term planning. If they had asked for 25-30 P-8s/LR-MPAs back in 2008 what do you think the reaction from the MoD/Finace minestery would have been??!!

The first was just a normal replacement order, of similar number as the Bears, but later it seems the ASW capability was meant to get credibly increased. However, the 25 to 30 P8Is is just a media claim and far away from beeing realistic, they might mean the full MPA fleet including the MRMRs.
It's not only that the P8I is very expensive, but with such high numbers, IN would also have to raise new air bases to house and operate them.

 

[BronzePlaque]

SO when will be the first delivery?

The contract between SSM(Turkey) and Boeing was signed on 2011 for Chinooks..Vice President of Boeing Turkey, Greg Pepin said "The first delivery will be after 36 months." So probably India will receive these birds more or less after 36 months after signing the contract i guess

 

[tvsram1992]

Good to see that we are getting quality military equipment .

 

[Gessler]

We could use them to airlift LW-155 howitzers at Chinese border and other high-altitude
areas...I love Chinook.

 

[illusion8]

The contract between SSM(Turkey) and Boeing was signed on 2011 for Chinooks..Vice President of Boeing Turkey, Greg Pepin said "The first delivery will be after 36 months." So probably India will receive these birds more or less after 36 months after signing the contract i guess

That's good info - so we can expect Chinooks after 3 years - provided we sign the contract soon.

 

[trident2010]

Its good we are getting Apache and Chinook. India will learn a lot from these top-notch war birds.

 

[Abingdonboy]

The contract between SSM(Turkey) and Boeing was signed on 2011 for Chinooks..Vice President of Boeing Turkey, Greg Pepin said "The first delivery will be after 36 months." So probably India will receive these birds more or less after 36 months after signing the contract i guess

The RFP the IAF sent out stipulated deliveries within 36 months but that doesn't mean they won't deliver early- LM made a lot of noise when they delivered within 24 months (with the Super Hercs) and Boeing could look to do the same-it was a good PR stunt because many Indian officals and military were very impressed especially because they had been dealing with Russia in the past.

We could use them to airlift LW-155 howitzers at Chinese border and other high-altitude
areas...I love Chinook.

Yep:

Man-within the space of a few years the Indian military is completly transforming itself!

 

[Capt.Popeye]

The first was just a normal replacement order, of similar number as the Bears, but later it seems the ASW capability was meant to get credibly increased. However, the 25 to 30 P8Is is just a media claim and far away from beeing realistic, they might mean the full MPA fleet including the MRMRs.
It's not only that the P8I is very expensive, but with such high numbers, IN would also have to raise new air bases to house and operate them.

It is not exacly like that. The 8 aircraft is just the first tranche. That is connected to IN's budgetary provisions. More will come later. Whether there will 25 P-8is evntually is yet speculative, though IN has projected a requirement of about 20 MR aircraft, which may well even be a LRMR/MRMR mix. MoD has not yet announced a final call on that. Mainly for budgetary reasons. But the spade-work has been done.

About the Tu-142s; the P-8i is not a replacement for them (even the numbers do not match up); the Bears are unmatched for range though the Poseidons have much better ASW capabilities. The Bears with the ELTA radar/sensor fit will remain in a largely MR role with very secondary ASW abilities. If anything, the Il-38s and Poseidons have broadly similar configurations; and the Ilyushins with the SD upgrade will remain operational for some more time. Actually they will overlap the Poseidons for quite some more time.

About the IN's requirements for more airfields for Poseidon operation; that process has been initiated before the completion of even the first Poseidon airframe. First of all INS Baaz has been commissioned in Campbell Bay. The runway is being lengthened for Poseidon operations. IN operates another airfield at Port Blair which can already operate Poseidons. Apart from that IN has another airfield in N.Andamans which can operate Dorniers presently, but can be upgraded.
On the Mainland: INS Hansa, INS Dega and INS Rajali can already operate Poseidons. Just as INS Garuda can, though Poseidons are not likely to operate there. Additionally, IN has taken over Porbandar and the runway can operate Poseidons already. Apart from that IN is looking to commission new airfields at Ratnagiri as well as Karwar. So that gives a very well spread out number of options so far as airfields for the IN to operate, most of them are up and running. So even in the near future operating 20 Poseidons is a distinct possibility for the IN.

 

[Major Shaheb]

Boeing wins IAF heavy-lift chopper deal

American defence major Boeing has won the deal to supply 15 heavy-lift helicopters to the Indian Air Force defeating its rival Russian Mi-26 in the tender expected to be worth around $1 billion.

The Chinook CH47D has emerged as the lowest bidder in the tender and would be offered the deal to supply 15 of these helicopters to the IAF, Defence Ministry officials said here.

The ministry will now hold commercial negotiations with the United States firm to determine the price and finalise the procurement.

According to Indian defence procurement procedures, the firm emerging as the lowest bidder in the contract and fulfilling all the requirements of the tender is awarded the contract.

The IAF will use these helicopters to supply heavy-duty equipment in the higher reaches in the northern and northeastern states and will replace the existing fleet of Mi-26 choppers acquired by it in the Soviet era.

In this contract, the IAF determined the lowest bidder by taking into account the cost of operating the chopper through out its life span of 30 years and not merely the per unit cost of the participating machines, they said.

In the last four weeks, this is the second major helicopter deal awarded by the IAF to Boeing which has bagged most of the defence deals awarded by India [ Images ] to the American defence firms.

It has so far bagged the deals to supply 10 C-17 heavy-lift aircraft worth $4.1 billion, 12 P-8I maritime surveillance aircraft for USD 3.1 billion, 22 Apache attack helicopters for $1.4 billion along with successful sales of Harpoon and other missiles to the Navy and the IAF.

Source > Boeing wins IAF heavy-lift chopper deal - Rediff.com India News

CH-47D over Mi-26!! it is like comparing a Bell-212 with Mi-171...

 

[Abingdonboy]

CH-47D over Mi-26!! it is like comparing a Bell-212 with Mi-171...

CH-47F actually!

+anyway they are the two heaviest lifters on the market right now.

 

[Gessler]

CH-47D over Mi-26!! it is like comparing a Bell-212 with Mi-171...

If you're so impressed with Mi-26, go buy one yourself