Islam is abused in Bollywood

[ashfaque]

i guess you had also attributed someone else's post to me.

i did not object to use of Allah in Indian songs.

I am very very sorry.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

ashfaque, are you muslim? if so, how do the majority of muslims in india feel about this?

 

[mujahideen]

ashfaque, are you muslim? if so, how do the majority of muslims in india feel about this?

Does it really matter how they feel, its not like they will be heard. And even some of the influential Muslims in India have betrayed their religion. I mean they are marrying Hindus, they are following Hindu superstitions and all other un-Islamic ways of life. This is exactly what Sir Syed, Allama Iqbal and Quaid-I-Azam were scared of. They knew if the two commuties lived together Muslims would loose their true identity because the majority will have their way and will want us to adopt their ways. A good example is the Indian national anthem and the government of India trying to force all its citizens to sing it. The Indian national anthem is clearly a Hindu songs and refers to Hindu gods. This is India's secularism.

 

[Energon]

Does it really matter how they feel, its not like they will be heard. And even some of the influential Muslims in India have betrayed their religion. I mean they are marrying Hindus, they are following Hindu superstitions and all other un-Islamic ways of life. This is exactly what Sir Syed, Allama Iqbal and Quaid-I-Azam were scared of. They knew if the two commuties lived together Muslims would loose their true identity because the majority will have their way and will want us to adopt their ways. A good example is the Indian national anthem and the government of India trying to force all its citizens to sing it. The Indian national anthem is clearly a Hindu songs and refers to Hindu gods. This is India's secularism.

India is overwhelmingly a Hindu nation, and as such many of the social and cultural influences are Hindu in nature. Even if states are secular and avoid religious involvement in matters of state, the influence of the most populous group can never be completely purged if the nation is democratic. This is clearly evident in most secular democracies around the world. Just because there is a heavy Christian (protestant) presence in the US, or an Islamic presence in Turkey, doesn't automatically mean that these states are not secular.

India is comparatively a new state where there is a long standing history of violence between rabidly religious groups who have been involved in invasions, massacres, occupations, conversions, wars, proxy wars, separatist movements, communal violence etc etc. Despite all of this one billion people of varying religions all live together for the most part harmoniously. You may not think much of this, but in all honesty the equation I've listed above coupled with rampant poverty, religiosity and illiteracy is actually perfectly suitable for a situation that is akin to what you see in Africa, the Balkans or Afghanistan and western Pakistan. Yet, this hasn't happened. Despite all the baggage the 1 billion people with their innumerable religious, cultural, linguistic, socioeconomic and all the differences under the sun still chug on in hopes of a better future for the children with an improving economy.

Most of all, for some reason or the other, all of them are crazily in love with bollywood. In fact, Bollywood is probably the epitome when it comes to a forum that brings all Indians together. This industry has a very good representation in all its aspects and the movies themselves are carefully crafted in order to be acceptable to as many viewers as possible.

I suggest for the people interested in the theo-cultural impact of bollywood to read Anupama Chopra's "King of Bollywood- Shah Rukh Khan and the Seductive World of Indian Cinema". This book does a brilliant job of showing exactly how this industry developed into a bonding tool for otherwise fractional Indians who come from different backgrounds and reside all over the world.

 

[Flintlock]

Does it really matter how they feel, its not like they will be heard. And even some of the influential Muslims in India have betrayed their religion. I mean they are marrying Hindus, they are following Hindu superstitions and all other un-Islamic ways of life. This is exactly what Sir Syed, Allama Iqbal and Quaid-I-Azam were scared of. They knew if the two commuties lived together Muslims would loose their true identity because the majority will have their way and will want us to adopt their ways. A good example is the Indian national anthem and the government of India trying to force all its citizens to sing it. The Indian national anthem is clearly a Hindu songs and refers to Hindu gods. This is India's secularism.

Do you know the first thing about the history of Indian muslims?

Take the Mughals for example. They would put today's "decadent bollywood muslims" to shame with their gluttony, indulgence, and sexual escapades.

Take the case of Kerala's muslims. These people had been converted by arab traders, and they used to wear Saris till recently the Saudis told them that they are not being good muslims by doing so.

Most Indian muslims were highly assimilated. The ones in Rajasthan used to wear the traditional dresses till the early 90s, when the local mullahs told them to wear salwar-kameez to protect their modesty.

This whole "muslim culture" theory is bunk. It never existed till the Saudis made it up. The Persians had their own culture, the Turks had theirs, the Mughals had theirs. Sure, there were similarities, but never to the extent that you are suggesting.

Yeah, about the National Anthem. Can you please tell me the first line of India's national anthem?

I don't know what Qaid-e-Azam had in mind, but imo that the only culture that was under threat was the urdu speaking Nawabi culture of the tiny minority of upper class muslims. Try visiting the palaces of these supposedly true muslims in India. It will open your eyes.

 

[Flintlock]

Well i did little research and turned out that i was right, the song is writen by Gulzar who is sikh and composed by Rehman.

So whats your point? Urdu sounds better? Sure, people love that language. Its poetic, it sounds very sophisticated.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Does it really matter how they feel, its not like they will be heard. And even some of the influential Muslims in India have betrayed their religion. I mean they are marrying Hindus, they are following Hindu superstitions and all other un-Islamic ways of life. This is exactly what Sir Syed, Allama Iqbal and Quaid-I-Azam were scared of. They knew if the two commuties lived together Muslims would loose their true identity because the majority will have their way and will want us to adopt their ways. A good example is the Indian national anthem and the government of India trying to force all its citizens to sing it. The Indian national anthem is clearly a Hindu songs and refers to Hindu gods. This is India's secularism.

i understand, i know there are some muslims who i am ashamed to call muslim. whether they are indian or whatever, i don't mind, but the things they do to show it. i don't even need to mention bollywood actors! some muslims may struggle to blend in with hindus and adopt their lifestyles. however, all this patriotism, acting, songs, for india they display, is proof enough that they have problems in india. everyone knows muslims have to do "extra" to prove their patriotism and allegiance. still, a lot of muslims in india are very "sympathetic" with pakistanis, just letting you know what i've heard from quite a bit of people and they support pakistan, very much. by the way, a lot of pakistani flags have been hoisted in india, especially in madrassa's

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Take the Mughals for example. They would put today's "decadent bollywood muslims" to shame with their gluttony, indulgence, and sexual escapades.
Take the case of Kerala's muslims. These people had been converted by arab traders, and they used to wear Saris till recently the Saudis told them that they are not being good muslims by doing so.
It never existed till the Saudis made it up. The Persians had their own culture, the Turks had theirs, the Mughals had theirs.

i agree with you on some points, but muslims in india do "kind of" have their own culture regardless of saudi interference. when you talk of saudi interference, you mean wahabi influence. however, i don't think wahabi influence has touch muslims in india, maybe indians living in saudi? however, if you are right in what you are saying, then in one way you have answered some questions i wanted to ask indian muslims, thanks.

 

[Flintlock]

i understand, i know there are some muslims who i am ashamed to call muslim. whether they are indian or whatever, i don't mind, but the things they do to show it. i don't even need to mention bollywood actors! some muslims may struggle to blend in with hindus and adopt their lifestyles. however, all this patriotism, acting, songs, for india they display, is proof enough that they have problems in india. everyone knows muslims have to do "extra" to prove their patriotism and allegiance. still, a lot of muslims in india are very "sympathetic" with pakistanis, just letting you know what i've heard from quite a bit of people and they support pakistan, very much. by the way, a lot of pakistani flags have been hoisted in india, especially in madrassa's

...and on the other hand you have millions of Pakistanis falling over themselves to watch Hindi movies, thus proving that this is pointless.

 

[Flintlock]

i agree with you on some points, but muslims in india do "kind of" have their own culture regardless of saudi interference. when you talk of saudi interference, you mean wahabi influence. however, i don't think wahabi influence has touch muslims in india, maybe indians living in saudi? however, if you are right in what you are saying, then in one way you have answered some questions i wanted to ask indian muslims, thanks.

Wahabbism is making its way around the world faster than you think.

Saudi-funded mosques and madarassas are opening up all over India, and the government refuses to do anything for fear of offending the muslims.

Even Musharraf himself had banned Saud-funded schools. I wonder when these guys will wake up.

 

[Flintlock]

i agree with you on some points, but muslims in india do "kind of" have their own culture regardless of saudi interference. when you talk of saudi interference, you mean wahabi influence. however, i don't think wahabi influence has touch muslims in india, maybe indians living in saudi? however, if you are right in what you are saying, then in one way you have answered some questions i wanted to ask indian muslims, thanks.

Obviously, being muslim they have certain similarities. However, its hardly the monolithic culture that Mujahideen is portraying it as.

 

[su-47]

pakistanis adamantly believe that Indian muslims are by and large prejudiced against, and refuse to change that mindset. if any Indian muslim acts patriotc, he's either brainwashed or coerced into doing so.

if u live in india, you will understand that there is hardly any prejudice going on. if there is any prejudice, it is by fanatics like shiv sena who are very much a minority. by and large hindus have accepted muslims and dont persecute them in any way. there are hindu and muslim fanatic groups who try to stir up trouble, but at the end of the day, they fail to influence the majority of hindus or muslims. now if you are going to quote some incidence of hindus massacring muslims, it should be understood that this was done by a small group, not by the whole damn hindu community. face the facts, by and large the muslims in india are treated fairly.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Wahabbism is making its way around the world faster than you think.
Saudi-funded mosques and madarassas are opening up all over India, and the government refuses to do anything for fear of offending the muslims.
Even Musharraf himself had banned Saud-funded schools. I wonder when these guys will wake up.

india is in no position of banning them. it supposed to be a secular country where they not only can't enforce religion, but also they can't interfere with the religions either. you'll find, what you consider to be a lot more dangerous, in US or UK.
besides that, do these madrassas have anything to do with the original muslims of india? from what you're telling me, it looks as if saudis are trying to convert hindus, mainly from rural villages, to islam just like what christians are so keen on doing. it this true? if so do you have any articles that go deep into this matter?