Is the Pakistan army martial?

[jatt+gutts]

then he is lieing he aint jutt.. jutts are always sikhs. hindus and pakistani are jats.

 

[Armstrong]

This chamar with no gutts saying that Punjab in Pakistan is fake.

Lagda eday baran baj gay.

Baraan da teh pataa nahin par aii veh keh aisss dei khooopri vich aii baaat nahin diiistii that Pakistanis are 'multi-lingual' ! Do, tinnn boliyaaan teh saraiiaan nu aandiaan ne !

 

[Bhairava]

You were very martial when you were getting your ***** were being spanked by in the Hindus at the Golden Temple.

And you were getting kicked by the Afghans. The Afghans thence upon met their match only in the Sikhs who took the fight to them and not in the Punjabi mussalmans. Thats history. As regards Golden Temple the operation was led by a Sikh himself and not a Hindu.

 

[jatt+gutts]

HERE IS AN EXCERPT FROM A BOOK BY A PAKISTANI GENERAL...

even pakistanis generals wrote books about our bravery.


Subject: Portrait of Bravery

Maj. General M. Khan of Pakistan wrote in his book
'Crisis of Leadership' about the bravery of the Sikh
soldiers during the Indo-Pak war. Here are some
excerpts:

"....the main reason of our defeat was Sikhs fighting
facing us. We were helpless to do anything in front of
them. Sikhs are very brave and they have a great
craving for martyrdom. They fight so fiercely that
they are capable of defeating an army many times
bigger than theirs."

"....On 3rd December 1971, we fiercely and vigorously
attacked the Indian army with our infantry brigade
near Hussainiwala border.. This brigade included
Pakistan army's fighter Punjabi regiment together with
the Baloch regiment. Within minutes we pushed the
Indian army quite far back. Their defence posts fell
under our control. The Indian army was retreating back
very fast and the Pakistani army was going forward
with a great speed. Our army reached near the
Kausre-Hind post. There was a small segment of the
Indian army appointed to defend that post and their
soldiers belonged to the Sikh Regiment. A few number
of the Sikh Regiment stopped our way forward like an
iron wall. They loudly greeted us with the ovation of
'Bole-so-Nihal' and attacked us like blood thirsty
hungry lions and hawks. All these soldiers were Sikhs.
There was even a dreadful hand-to-hand battle. The sky
filled with roars of 'Yaa Ali' and 'Sat-Siri-Akal'.
Even in this hand-to-hand fighting the Sikhs fought so
bravely that all our desires, aspirations and dreams
were shattered."

".....In this war Lt. Col Gulab Hussain of Baloch
Regiment got killed. With him Major Mohammed Zaeef and
Captain Arif Alim also died. It was difficult to count
the number of soldiers who got killed. We were
astonished to see the courage of those handful of Sikh
soldiers. When we seized the possession of the
three-storey defence post of concrete, the Sikh
soldiers went onto the roof and kept on persistently
opposing us. The whole night they kept on showering
fires on us and continued shouting the loud ovation of
'Sat-Siri-Akal'. These Sikh soldiers kept on the
encounter till the next day.

Next day the Pakistani tanks surrounded this post and
bombed it with guns. Those handful of Sikhs got
martyred in this encounter while resisting us, but
other Sikh soldiers then destroyed our tanks with the
help of their artillery. Fighting with great bravery
they kept on marching forward and thus our army lost
its foothold."

"....Alas, a handful of Sikhs converted our great
victory into a big defeat and shattered our confidence
and courage. ."

"....The same thing happened with us in
Dhaka(Bangladesh). In the battle of Jaissur, the
Singhs opposed the Pakistani army so fiercely that our
backbone and our foothold was lost. This became the
main and important reason of our defeat and the Sikhs'
fancy for martyrdom and mockery with death for the
sake of safety and honour of the country, became the
sole cause of their victory."

Similar type of comments were made by Pakistani army
in East Pakistan under the leadership of General Niazi
while surrendering their weapons to General Jagjit
Singh Arora. The bravery and spirit of sacrifice of
Sikhs were respected and honoured by one and all. May
God rest the souls of all the fallen soldiers (Sikhs
and Pakistanis), in peace. Thought: "Sawa Lakh se ek
laraun, chirian to(n) main baaj taranun, tabhe Gobind
Singh naam kahaun" (Unless I raise one to stand
against many, cause sparrow spurn hawk, I shall not
deserve to be called Gobind Singh.) Regards Sodhi
Singh

 

[RazPaK]

And you were getting kicked by the Afghans. The Afghans thence upon met their match only in the Sikhs who took the fight to them and not in the Punjabi mussalmans. Thats history. As regards Golden Temple the operation was led by a Sikh himself and not a Hindu.

What history is this?

You smoking something?

 

[Bhairava]

then he is lieing he aint jutt.. jutts are always sikhs. hindus and pakistani are jats.

Hindu Jats or Jatts dont consider the Pakistani Jats as Jats. Same goes for the Indian Rajputs. They dont consider those in Pakistan as Rajputs.

What history is this?

You smoking something?

What history ? True history.

 

[RazPaK]

HERE IS AN EXCERPT FROM A BOOK BY A PAKISTANI GENERAL...

even pakistanis generals wrote books about our bravery.


Subject: Portrait of Bravery

Maj. General M. Khan of Pakistan wrote in his book
'Crisis of Leadership' about the bravery of the Sikh
soldiers during the Indo-Pak war. Here are some
excerpts:

"....the main reason of our defeat was Sikhs fighting
facing us. We were helpless to do anything in front of
them. Sikhs are very brave and they have a great
craving for martyrdom. They fight so fiercely that
they are capable of defeating an army many times
bigger than theirs."

"....On 3rd December 1971, we fiercely and vigorously
attacked the Indian army with our infantry brigade
near Hussainiwala border.. This brigade included
Pakistan army's fighter Punjabi regiment together with
the Baloch regiment. Within minutes we pushed the
Indian army quite far back. Their defence posts fell
under our control. The Indian army was retreating back
very fast and the Pakistani army was going forward
with a great speed. Our army reached near the
Kausre-Hind post. There was a small segment of the
Indian army appointed to defend that post and their
soldiers belonged to the Sikh Regiment. A few number
of the Sikh Regiment stopped our way forward like an
iron wall. They loudly greeted us with the ovation of
'Bole-so-Nihal' and attacked us like blood thirsty
hungry lions and hawks. All these soldiers were Sikhs.
There was even a dreadful hand-to-hand battle. The sky
filled with roars of 'Yaa Ali' and 'Sat-Siri-Akal'.
Even in this hand-to-hand fighting the Sikhs fought so
bravely that all our desires, aspirations and dreams
were shattered."

".....In this war Lt. Col Gulab Hussain of Baloch
Regiment got killed. With him Major Mohammed Zaeef and
Captain Arif Alim also died. It was difficult to count
the number of soldiers who got killed. We were
astonished to see the courage of those handful of Sikh
soldiers. When we seized the possession of the
three-storey defence post of concrete, the Sikh
soldiers went onto the roof and kept on persistently
opposing us. The whole night they kept on showering
fires on us and continued shouting the loud ovation of
'Sat-Siri-Akal'. These Sikh soldiers kept on the
encounter till the next day.

Next day the Pakistani tanks surrounded this post and
bombed it with guns. Those handful of Sikhs got
martyred in this encounter while resisting us, but
other Sikh soldiers then destroyed our tanks with the
help of their artillery. Fighting with great bravery
they kept on marching forward and thus our army lost
its foothold."

"....Alas, a handful of Sikhs converted our great
victory into a big defeat and shattered our confidence
and courage. ."

"....The same thing happened with us in
Dhaka(Bangladesh). In the battle of Jaissur, the
Singhs opposed the Pakistani army so fiercely that our
backbone and our foothold was lost. This became the
main and important reason of our defeat and the Sikhs'
fancy for martyrdom and mockery with death for the
sake of safety and honour of the country, became the
sole cause of their victory."

Similar type of comments were made by Pakistani army
in East Pakistan under the leadership of General Niazi
while surrendering their weapons to General Jagjit
Singh Arora. The bravery and spirit of sacrifice of
Sikhs were respected and honoured by one and all. May
God rest the souls of all the fallen soldiers (Sikhs
and Pakistanis), in peace. Thought: "Sawa Lakh se ek
laraun, chirian to(n) main baaj taranun, tabhe Gobind
Singh naam kahaun" (Unless I raise one to stand
against many, cause sparrow spurn hawk, I shall not
deserve to be called Gobind Singh.) Regards Sodhi
Singh

Lmao, You Sikhs are morons. That's why the Hindus send you to die. Isn't it obvious?

 

[DRaisinHerald]

Jats Awan Arain Gujjar all martial.

Present day Pakistan was not too long ago a feudal society. All people of Pakistan are martial as that was the way of life.

Since when were Arains martial?

My tribe was not classed as martial because we rebelled against the britsh. Ironic isn't it?

Ah, I see..

 

[Bhairava]

Lmao, You Sikhs are morons. That's why the Hindus send you to die. Isn't it obvious?

No idiot. Sikhs fight for their country. Saying they are being sent by Hindus to die is as retarded as saying Punjabis are sending the Baloch or Pathan to die.

 

[RazPaK]

Since when were Arains martial?



Ah, I see..

We fought against the British, while the Sikhs fought for them.

Difference.

 

[RazPaK]

Punjab's reputation as a loyalist province, which provided the British Indian Army with soldiers and a solid socio-political support base in the form of a dependent landed class, has eclipsed its rather variegated history, which includes heroic tales of resistance to occupation and foreign rule throughout the ages. Thus, for example, Raja Porus, who ruled a principality in northern Punjab in the ancient period, gave stiff resistance to the invading armies of Alexander the Great, but was defeated by the Greeks near Jhelum in 326 BC. The Khatris of Punjab claim him among their ancestors.

According to Kalpana Sahni -- daughter of the famous Rawalpindi-born, Government-College-Lahore-educated Bollywood actor, the late Balraj Sahni, the Khatris of Behra to which their family belongs -- trace their ancestry to Porus. She has narrated this story on the authority of another famous Punjabi Khatri family with a connection to Government College, Lahore, and to Bollywood: Chetan Anand, the noted late Indian filmmaker and elder brother of evergreen, matinee hero Dev Anand.

Then, there is the story of Dulla Bhatti, a Muslim Rajput who led a rebellion against the Mughals during the reign of Akbar. His story has been rendered in both poetry and prose. Rai Ahmed Khan Kharal, claimed both by Muslim Rajputs and Jatts, who took up arms against the British from western Punjab during 1857, is another hero in that tradition.

Closer to our own times, the legend of Bhagat Singh, a Sikh Jatt, has only grown bigger with time, and several Bollywood pictures have been made on that theme. The Kambohs take pride in Udham Singh from their caste who shot dead Sir Michael O'Dwyer, the Punjab governor who originally gave orders for harsh action at Jallianwala, on April 13, 1919. The actual carnage had been ordered on the spot by General Dyer.

However, one great freedom fighter from Punjab whose heroic struggle has not been given proper recognition is Shah Abdul Qadir Ludhianvi. His direct descendant, Maulana Habibur Rahman Sani, who is currently the chief imam of the main Friday Mosque in Ludhiana, in east Punjab, provided me detailed information on him in an interview recorded on Jan 4, 2005, in the courtyard of the mosque.

Maulana Sani's grandfather, Maulana Habibur Rahman, was one of the founders of the Majlis-e-Ahrar, a movement of anti-imperialist nationalist Muslims, who returned to India after spending one day in Lahore in August 1947, arguing that thousands of Muslims remained in east Punjab and they should not be abandoned. That is how that family remained in Ludhiana.

My attention to Maulana Sani was drawn by Baldev Raj Verma, owner of Naseem Hosiery in Ludhiana, whose father, Hansraj, was on the famous Japanese ship, Komagata Maru, in 1914 chartered by Punjabis, mainly Sikhs, to get to Canada. They were refused entry. It resulted in the emergence of the Ghadar Party and the first anti-colonial struggle in early 20th century in Punjab.

Mr Verma informed me that a famous Muslim family of freedom fighters from Ludhiana still lived in the town centre and were in charge of the main mosque, where thousands of Muslims congregated every Friday to pray. Ludhiana is the major industrial city of east Punjab. Indeed workers from all over India come and work there, among them a very large numbers of Muslims from UP and Bihar.

Maulana Habibur Rahman Sani informed me that his family belonged to the Arain biradari (patrilineage). His great, great grandfather, Shah Abdul Qadir Ludhianvi, was the first in Punjab to take up arms against the English East India Company in 1857. He collected a large fighting force, which included Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs, that drove the English out of not only Ludhiana but also Panipat. He then headed to Delhi with his men to support Bahadur Shah Zafar. He fell fighting along with thousands of others at Chandni Chowk in 1857.

In British records Ludhianvi is described as a fiery speaker who exercised considerable influence on the people in that region. Some reports incorrectly describe him as a Gujjar. In any event, the British deprived his family of their property and subjected them to other forms of persecution. The Arains in general were branded as a dangerous group, their lands were confiscated and they were excluded from recruitment in the army; hence their classification as a non-martial group.

However, his descendants continued to support revolutionary struggles and both the Ghadar Party and later Bhagat Singh's associates were aided by them. They also helped Subhash Chandra Bose cross Punjab safely into the North-West Frontier Province. The Tribune, Chandigarh, of Jan 7, 2001, carried a story on the anti-imperialist services of that family.

It is worth remembering that the British adopted similar harsh measures against the Bengalis and Biharis, and some tribes and castes from UP that took part in the Uprising of 1857. They were also declared unfit for military service. Therefore, excluding Arains from the army was consistent with British policy on rebellious tribes and castes.

However, in the ancient, Mughal and Sikh periods, Arains had held prominent positions, such as governors and army generals. Many gotras, or sub-clans, of the Arains bear names that indicate soldiering as an occupation. For example: Ghalar, Gahgeer and Goheer (ferocious horse of armoured corps), Gatku (fencer), Kavali (soldier patrolling while others rest), Basroo (observation post), Bahman (brave, uncontrollable or insurmountable), Bhaila (alms-keeper who walks with the commander when he is giving away alms after a victory), Daulay (those who got land in return for military services), Khatora (spy), Ramay (archers), Rattay (bloody, red, ferocious fighters), Ramday (red -eyed soldiers), Labanay (an army column equipped with batons), Jatalay (victors), Qutub Shahi: (soldiers or their offspring who accompanied Qutubuddin Aibak), Sappal (marksmen), Bahalwan (driver of a chariot), Mudh (logisticians supplying logistics and reinforcement to the army), Teerandaz (archers), Katarband (users of katar, a weapon used by ancient armies) and Bhutto (dwellers of high places).

It would be interesting if some filmmaker in Pakistan could depict the saga of Shah Abdul Qadir Ludhianvi on the silver screen. It would be important to contact his family in Ludhiana for more details, but more importantly the script should remain faithful to the true legacy of that great man. He was by no means a religious fanatic, although he described his struggle against the British as jihad. He was a patriot who joined hands with all communities in the first major struggle against the colonial takeover of the subcontinent.

Our people always been martial. Look how many sub clans we got.

An Arain freedom fighter

 

[jatt+gutts]

defeated ashamed looking non martial paksitani general walking behind martial sikh indian general

non martial pakistani general signing instrument of surrender....PICTURES SPEAK 1000 WORDS. I REST MY CASE

 

[jatt+gutts]

We fought against the British, while the Sikhs fought for them.

Difference.

can you tell me names of some of your freedom fighters.. while you were polishing shoes and giving tea to british it was sikhs like BHAGAT SINGH , UDHAM SINGH AND KARTAR SINGH SARABHA WHO FOUGHT WITH BRITISH

pakistani punjabi ist good sounding and it does not have its own script. alif bay tay is not good for writing punjabi. so instead of learning punjabi pakistani punjabi end up learning urdu. neither does pakistani punjabis have any great heros to feel prous about

 

[RazPaK]

can you tell me names of some of your freedom fighters.. while you were polishing shoes and giving tea to british it was sikhs like BHAGAT SINGH , UDHAM SINGH AND KARTAR SINGH SARABHA WHO FOUGHT WITH BRITISH

You Sikhs were the ones polishing shoes. Look at the article I posted.

 

[jatt+gutts]

that aint sikh.. thats pathan. look at the turban style