Is ISIS A Blessing In Disguise For Pakistan

[Nilesh Singh]

Sir,

Before 9 / 11---we both did it---. 9 / 11 changed everything for us---but you did not stop---. It is going to come back---the ball is going to bounce back.

Daniel Pearl was a rogue journalist on search of glory on his own---he was warned not to pursue illegal access---sometimes you are the bat and some times you are the ball---.

Sometimes you win---like the british journalist---he interviewed Osama one time 15 years ago and still is milking the media circuit for that interview---Pearl lost---he paid with his life---it is boom or bust---.

Ajmal Kssab was a nobody---the man who got hung and whose interrogation was on you tube were two different people---. Ajmal kassab came from a family of jangli Punjabis----he could never in his lifetime change his accent to that of the man being interrogated in the hospital---if you don't know what jangli Punjabi accent is---you may not have any clue to what I am talking about.

Pakistan had nothing to gain from either the 26/11 or the issues in 2002 on parliament---WHO BENEFITS---it is india who benefitted---it is you who staged it---.

Sir, what total crap you are saying..............can you show any proof for what you said other than Pakistani sources. Total BS post. You are such a senior PDF member and you talk like a spoke person of some terrorist/ISI organization. I think you need to come out of the rut that whole world is trying to conspire against you. your sympathy towards jihadist has already taken 50,000 innocent lives in Pakistan, how many more need to die before you come to sense.If Pakistan is given on plate to India it will reject it. Who want such a radicalized and fanatic country, taking Pakistan, its seems like cutting your leg with your own axe.

 

[OrionHunter]

Now the next stage of conflict---india is going to pay a heavy price-the terrorists it supported in Pakistan are going to be neutralized---because they won't find any place to hide in Afghanistan. The freedom fighters will turn their attention back to india---with a few suicide bombings in south india and the foreigners will be packing their bags and running out by the flight loads.

Supporting and planning terrorist activities against Pakistan was a bad bad mistake by india----a complete failure of understanding the long term repurcussions.

Such epic nonsense! Man, some guys have really lost it! I mean it's time we get into some serious discussions on PDF. Enough of this crappy tomfoolery. This is getting beyond silly. Jeeeez!

 

[RabzonKhan]

but fact remains that the OBL courier we suspected and shared him as a peculiar person to CIA was someone the American already tracking outside Pakistan and they built up the picture from that point forward deciding not to share the information any further. Americans later on decided not to mention any contribution from Pakistani side on the intelligence part that led to the eventual capture of OBL because that wasn't deemed necessary and it was time to dump Pakistan.

Irfan Baloch, is this just a suni sunai baat or do you have a source to back up your statement?

Americans later on decided not to mention any contribution from Pakistani side on the intelligence part that led to the eventual capture of OBL because that wasn't deemed necessary and it was time to dump Pakistan.

Here is part of Obama’s speech made right after Osama bin Laden was killed.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-dead

Over the years, I’ve repeatedly made clear that we would take action within Pakistan if we knew where bin Laden was. That is what we’ve done. But it’s important to note that our counterterrorism cooperation with Pakistan helped lead us to bin Laden and the compound where he was hiding. Indeed, bin Laden had declared war against Pakistan as well, and ordered attacks against the Pakistani people.

1. the phone number was given to USA so that NSA can perform analysis on its billion dollar system that checks the record for years across the globe. the courier was operating both inside and out of Pakistan. it was not about listening to a phone. its not as simple and easy as a bollywood plot.

Do you have any proof of that since Mustan Khan was unable to backup his claim with any source?

 

[Irfan Baloch]

yo

Irfan Baloch, is this just a suni sunai baat or do you have a source to back up your statement?


Here is part of Obama’s speech made right after Osama bin Laden was killed.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-dead

Over the years, I’ve repeatedly made clear that we would take action within Pakistan if we knew where bin Laden was. That is what we’ve done. But it’s important to note that our counterterrorism cooperation with Pakistan helped lead us to bin Laden and the compound where he was hiding. Indeed, bin Laden had declared war against Pakistan as well, and ordered attacks against the Pakistani people.


Do you have any proof of that since Mustan Khan was unable to backup his claim with any source?

u provided the proof ans answer to your question already where Obama acknowledge our cooperation. he was not talking about building metro bus or new Shopping Mall.

as far as anything else is concerned, please don't expect me to bring you some exclusive information. my knowledge is based on both web and TV channels from different sources. CIA didn't just pick out the place and the courier all on its own.. the leads came from us just like so many other places and people. we had raided his other likely place as well including this place as well before when it was found empty on every occasion. when OBL was allowed to escape Tora Bora then he was virtually untraceable when he joined tens of thousands of Afghans fleeing the conflict and went to other parts of Afghanistan and came into Pakistan and in the same time the displacement of about a million people due to Sawat and South Waziristan operation simply helped him to move even deeper inside Pakistan.

lets face it, we ourselves failed to detect him and Americans got him in the end whatever we did in order to reach to the Abbotabad conclusion would seem insignificant and we will have to live with it until someone in the CIA blows the whistle and gives an alternate version to the official American narrative to the story.

 

[Reem]

@MastanKhan

Hi,

Thank you for sharing your analysis and some interesting thoughts, please see my take on the argument you brought up:
The dramatic rise of ISIS and onslaught this summer is a matter of concern and certainly plays a part in refactoring America’s end game in Afghanistan a bit, but calling out that it has been the ultimate game changer is probably giving it too much credit, I instead digress to relatively give more weightage to new regime in Pak Army and the contributions made and successes achieved by them this year, this is because even with ISIS rise, if Pakistan had a COAS like Gen Kiyani in office, who has not been able to manage US-Pak relation, and no ground offensive against militants being carried out and disruption of militant safe heavens on the table to negotiate, we wouldn’t have seen this shift in US approach towards Pakistan. Also not only that US saw its long standing demand of operation against militants being carried out, and a strong commitment to continue that operation till it lasts , but US has also witnessed Pakistan wasting no time in reaching out to new Govt in Afghanistan and working to amend ties. IMHO all of the points I mentioned above contribute to the positive vibes we lately see between US and Pak.
Following links help to support my version of the argument:

1. Certainly year 2014 has wrapped up with America updating end game in Afghanistan and with a considerable tone change towards Pakistan. ISIS onslaught has played some role in back drop, given the fact ISIS has nefarious plans of extending its state with their map of world, claiming Khurasan (Pak, Afghan and Iran..), and the fact that there is concern of them making inroads into Afghanistan, leaving Afghanistan such as creating a void for Islamists and Taliban to revert their achievements is something least desirable.
Obama Extends War in Afghanistan | The Progressive
http://www.progressive.org/news/2014/11/187919/obama-extends-war-Afghanistan

The World According to ISIS: The Terrorist Army’s Dreams for Islamic Caliphate Revealed in One Map

ISIS Making Deadly Inroads in Libya, Pakistan and Afghanistan - US News
Grisly execution videos, new foreign headquarters serve as only the beginning for the true dangers that will soon unfold.
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2014/11/20/isis-making-deadly-inroads-in-libya-pakistan-and-Afghanistan

2. But I think in the back drop of it, it is the hard work of Gen Raheel Sharif and his visit to US to show case that work, that has ultimately restored the trust in US – Pak militaries, Kerry and US senate profoundly acknowledged Pakistani Army’s contributions towards curbing terrorism, also terming Gen Sharif “an honest and straight forward person”, and Pak Army “a binding force”.
http://www.rferl.org/content/kerry-pakistan-military-sharif/26719068.html
US and Pakistan: Will the relationship endure?

Pakistan's army chief Raheel Sharif visits the US to discuss future of the US and Pakistan's fragile military bond.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-30105416

3. Moreover the change of government in Afghanistan and signs of thawing relations between Afghanistan and Pakistan have also helped create some positive vibes in the US towards Pakistan and served as another reason to not suspect Pakistan’s demeanor towards Afghanistan and in-fact feel reassured that Pakistan is an ally to continue depend on for security in the region.
Pakistan PM Sharif, Afghan Prez Ghani meet to repair ties - NY Daily News
Pakistan PM Sharif, Afghan Prez Ghani meet to repair ties - NY Daily News

COAS Sharif meets Afghan President Ghani | PAKISTAN - geo.tv-

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/15/w...an-ashraf-ghani-nawaz-sharif.html?nytmobile=0

4. And all of the efforts above have resulted into another hope for Afghanistan-Pakistan-US for establishing peace, this new point of convergence has been carved out, I don’t think this is mere luck and a coincidence of ISIS dilemma, I think Pakistan is doing right things and what we see are the fruits of right actions.
U.S., Pakistan increase cooperation in faint hope of Afghan peace

ISLAMABAD (Reuters) - Recent battlefield successes point to renewed willingness by the United States to work with Pakistan on curbing Islamist militancy, but a promise Islamabad made in return – to bring
U.S., Pakistan increase cooperation in faint hope of Afghan peace| Reuters

 

[MilSpec]

Now the next stage of conflict---india is going to pay a heavy price-the terrorists it supported in Pakistan are going to be neutralized---because they won't find any place to hide in Afghanistan. The freedom fighters will turn their attention back to india---with a few suicide bombings in south india and the foreigners will be packing their bags and running out by the flight loads.

Supporting and planning terrorist activities against Pakistan was a bad bad mistake by india----a complete failure of understanding the long term repurcussions.

And the traditional case of Indian Boogeyman syndrome, What's new?

again it really angers me to see how American general public has been made to forget the blunder and the scandal of the Tora Bora operation when not just the Al Qaeda but the Afghan Taliban top command was allowed to escape through a route that was not "checked" by the NATO and the Northern Alliance forces.
.

Ahem, Airlift of Konduz? Shouldn't that enrage the american people even more, as it was straight deceit by it's most trusted ally...

 

[MastanKhan]

@MastanKhan

Hi,

Thank you for sharing your analysis and some interesting thoughts, please see my take on the argument you brought up:

Hi,

Thank you very much for your post---. Welcome to the board.

In any kind of relation---your efforts are only counted when they are appreciated---but regardless of what you are doing---and the other party does not have any appreciation---the effort means not much tp them.

So---even though we had started the Zarb a Azb awhile ago---the Americas did not care less about it---because they had already packed their bags and made up their minds to leave us in the sh-it can one more time.

Now---when the things start going bad---criminals come into power---your generals incompetent---people pick and chose those who are not worthy of the job and reject those who are----.

So---when Libya got wasted---then Syria got wasted and then isis came into power and Iraq got wasted and the great Nato ally 'Turkey' told the U S to take a hike---America was in a quandary like never before---never could it have imagined its strategy backfiring so badly---and to top that off---iran says that it can help ---.

Instability instability instability----and then there was afghanistan---it had no resources ---no source of income---can't pay its military or its govt officials because---what a terrible legacy to leave behind---another notch of catastrophic failure on its endeavours---lucky for them---Pakistan---their old nemesis---is there to save their face.

It is not enough for Kerry and the U S senate to acknowledge that---that message needs to be conveyed by the U S gvt to the public thru the media----. The U S---if it does not convey this message to the America public---is again being deceitful and deceptive in its relationship with Pakistan----. The same venom that the Obama admin spewed against Pakistan regarding Osama----the same apology needs to be offered to Pakistan and on the U S public forum---.

Pakistan needs to find a way to confront te issue on the media----.

 

[sathya]

Now the next stage of conflict---india is going to pay a heavy price-the terrorists it supported in Pakistan are going to be neutralized---because they won't find any place to hide in Afghanistan. The freedom fighters will turn their attention back to india---with a few suicide bombings in south india and the foreigners will be packing their bags and running out by the flight loads.

Supporting and planning terrorist activities against Pakistan was a bad bad mistake by india----a complete failure of understanding the long term repurcussions.

Are the freedom fighters fighting TTP at present?
are they involved in any kind of mission?

why would you not condemn Pakistan for supporting & staging terrorist activity in india? wont they backfire Pakistan..?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I too have a conspiracy theory about ISIS,

How to get rid of radicalized Muslims around the world ?
ANSWER = ISIS

 

[MastanKhan]

Are the freedom fighters fighting TTP at present?
are they involved in any kind of mission?

why would you not condemn Pakistan for supporting & staging terrorist activity in india? wont they backfire Pakistan..?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I too have a conspiracy theory about ISIS,

How to get rid of radicalized Muslims around the world ?
ANSWER = ISIS

Are you condemning india's sponsoring of terrorist activities against Pakistan now----.

 

[sathya]

Are you condemning india's sponsoring of terrorist activities against Pakistan now----.

i would recommend fighting face to face by ARMY , not by terrorist and not against civilians

we do not support terrorism .

there is no proof or at least reasonable doubt that India is using terrorism as a policy, in that case i would definitely condemn it..

No need have any doubts on that..

 

[Hindustani78]

Mehdi’s 60 per cent followers non-Muslims, most Muslims from UK: Govt

New Delhi: More than 60 per cent followers of Mehdi Masroor Biswas, the Bengaluru-based executive, who was running a pro-ISIS twitter account, were non-Muslims and a majority of his Muslim followers were from western countries, particularly the UK, Home Minister Rajnath Singh said on Monday.

Making a suo motu statement in Lok Sabha, he said 24-year-old Mehdi was arrested on December 13 and during interrogation, he indicated that his activities were limited to posting and reposting of pro-ISIS material on his twitter account and social media sites and he has denied having recruited any person for ISIS.


GoI is aware of the whole story behind ISIS in EU.

 

[RabzonKhan]

I’m sorry for the late response. Due to Peshawar school terrorist attack did not feel like writing.

yo

u provided the proof ans answer to your question already where Obama acknowledge our cooperation. he was not talking about building metro bus or new Shopping Mall.

How funny. That is not an answer to my question, my question still stands.

It was in reply to you and Mustan Khan’s allegations that America does not acknowledge Pakistan's contribution and help in locating Osama bin Laden.

I think you have some confusion regarding my views , so let me clarify my position, I do not dispute the fact that Pakistan has played a very crucial role in the war on terror and has helped United States eradicate many top Al Qaeda terrorists and without Pakistan's help those scumbags would still be alive.

My problem is that when I see fellow Pakistanis and Americans make unsubstantiated allegations against each other without providing any source or proof.

as far as anything else is concerned, please don't expect me to bring you some exclusive information. my knowledge is based on both web and TV channels from different sources. CIA didn't just pick out the place and the courier all on its own.. the leads came from us just like so many other places and people.

I'm not asking for any exclusive information, simply asking you guys to backup your claims with some source or proof. When debating an issue, the burden of proof is on the person asserting a claim.

we had raided his other likely place as well including this place as well before when it was found empty on every occasion.

Again, any source?

when OBL was allowed to escape Tora Bora then he was virtually untraceable when he joined tens of thousands of Afghans fleeing the conflict and went to other parts of Afghanistan and came into Pakistan and in the same time the displacement of about a million people due to Sawat and South Waziristan operation simply helped him to move even deeper inside Pakistan.

lets face it, we ourselves failed to detect him and Americans got him in the end whatever we did in order to reach to the Abbotabad conclusion would seem insignificant and we will have to live with it until someone in the CIA blows the whistle and gives an alternate version to the official American narrative to the story

Here's some interesting information. According to Khaled Shaikh Mohamed, Osama had been helped to move out of Tora Bora to Waziristan by Jalal ul Din Haqqani. (Source: In the line of fire, by Pervez Musharraf. Page number 220). Of course yes, Jalal ul Din Haqqani was the head of Haqqani network.

Now imagine with this information how easy it would be for an American to come up with a conspiracy theory.

Being a dual citizen of Pakistan and US I will keep on supporting good relations between these two great countries. Strong economic and military ties between them are in the best interest of both countries and regional stability.