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Iraq bought T90 MS tanks from Russia

I don't see Iraq needing more tanks urgently, why not waiting, and order more Abrams for now?
doritos said:
We will also buy T99 insallah
But waiting 6 years is too long without adding more tanks

K2 is too expensive
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The only country that shown interest in the K2 was Peruvian Army, I don't know what does that have to do with the topic.
 
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Yzd Khalifa said:
I don't see Iraq needing more tanks urgently, why not waiting, and order more Abrams for now?


The only country that shown interest in the K2 was Peruvian Army, I don't know what does that have to do with the topic.
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They're not needed for conventional war which won't happen anytime soon.
But T90MS with Arena and SHTORA can be good against ISIS. Iraq's Abrams lacks reactive armor and it can't deal with RPG hits. Though the US reserve Abrams are only half the price of the T90MS.

Abrams have a good name, but that due to them fighting T52/62's, better a full equipped T90 over a monkey model Abrams.
 
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Well, Iraq can modify its Abrams once more to avoid introducing a new platform such as the T-90.

If not, then fine, Iraq can go with the T-90 as long as it services its purpose fighting local militants.
doritos said:
They're not needed for conventional war which won't happen anytime soon.
But T90MS with Arena and SHTORA can be good against ISIS. Iraq's Abrams lacks reactive armor and it can't deal with RPG hits. Though the US reserve Abrams are only half the price of the T90MS.

Abrams have a good name, but that due to them fighting T52/62's, better a full equipped T90 over a monkey model Abrams.
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American Tanks outclassed their Russian counterpart by every single category.
 
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Yzd Khalifa said:
American Tanks outclassed their Russian counterpart by every single category.
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Russian tanks are made for Russia's needs, America for their needs.

It's wrong to say that American tanks outclass Russian tanks on every category, even a simple list of comparing the T90 vs the M1A2 would prove that wrong.
T90 range and endurance on it's fuel is longer, 125mm gun is superior, smaller target thus harder to hit.

ask @vostok @Arzamas 16 they know more about it anyway
we already operate T72, this won't be very much a new platform
 
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BMP 3 are also in the deal.

So far confirmed in the 1st arms deal :

Pantsir S1
MI 28 Ne
MI 35M
T90
16.000 T5000 ORSIS sniper rifles
KORNET E
IGLA
BMP3

Possible:
S300/400 ( indicated by MoD $200 mil AD equipment either in 1st or coming 2nd deal ).
 
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Penguin said:
What if I'm an agnostic? In that case, it would be hypocritical to use ALLAH because to an agnostic the truth values of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, as well as other religious and metaphysical claims — are unknown or unknowable.

:drag:

Agnosticism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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He said that, because she said Jesus, are you still agnostic.

Yzd Khalifa said:
Well, Iraq can modify its Abrams once more to avoid introducing a new platform such as the T-90.

If not, then fine, Iraq can go with the T-90 as long as it services its purpose fighting local militants.


American Tanks outclassed their Russian counterpart by every single category.
Click to expand...
Those were at best T-72s, now they are talking about T-90s.
 
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Yzd Khalifa said:
American Tanks outclassed their Russian counterpart by every single category.
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That really hasn't been historically true. Simply because American tanks always faced last generation Russian equipment. With many American tank being built to counter the threat of a new Russian tank.

The T-54/55 outclassed anything before it when it was produced, spurring the development of the M60 Patton.
The T-64, T-80 and T-72 outclassed anything the Americans had till the Abrams came along.
 
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burning_phoneix said:
That really hasn't been historically true. Simply because American tanks always faced last generation Russian equipment. With many American tank being built to counter the threat of a new Russian tank.

The T-54/55 outclassed anything before it when it was produced, spurring the development of the M60 Patton.
The T-64, T-80 and T-72 outclassed anything the Americans had till the Abrams came along.
Click to expand...

Great. So we both agree that the US managed to outclass, counter Russia by every single nook and cranny, right?
 
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burning_phoneix said:
That really hasn't been historically true. Simply because American tanks always faced last generation Russian equipment. With many American tank being built to counter the threat of a new Russian tank.

The T-54/55 outclassed anything before it when it was produced, spurring the development of the M60 Patton.
The T-64, T-80 and T-72 outclassed anything the Americans had till the Abrams came along.
Click to expand...
Yzd Khalifa said:
Great. So we both agree that the US managed to outclass, counter Russia by every single nook and cranny, right?
Click to expand...


American tanks have not faced the last generation of Russian equipment. The US military ( strongest in the world ) faced monkey model tanks led by a crew with less training time and poor commanders planning, they also lacked air force coverage due to NATO air superiority. Most of the tanks they faced were also T62's not T72's, the same reason why Mirages performed different depending on who's hand they were in ( Israelis - Arabs ) knowing some spend a lot of time on training and the other doesn't.

Your right usually Russia comes with it first like the BMP1 then the US comes with the M2 Bradley, still the US has not built something as capable as the BMP 3.

Also the US doesn't have a newer tank then the Russians at the moment, Russia is also making the T99. Currently the lowest T90S is better then most Abrams the ME states have. How it stands against American Abrams is irrelevant for me, more factors play a role in that comparison.

Compare the T90S and the M1A1

M1A1 (left)---T-90(right)

Mobility
Top Speed: 42mph --- 40mph
Combat Weight: 72 tons --- 49.6 tons
Range: 298 miles --- 340~400 miles
Power/weight: 21.4hp/ton --- 22hp/ton
Min. Turn Radius: Pivot --- Pivot
Suspension: Torsion Bars --- Torsion Bars
Ground Pressure: 14.4psi --- 12.9psi
Clearance: 19in --- 19.37in
Gradient: 60% --- 60%
Side Slope: 40% --- 40%
Vertical Obstacle: 48.96in --- 33.46in
Trench: 9ft --- 9.18ft
Fording: 4ft --- 3.39ft (16.4ft w/ snorkel)
Transmission: Automatic, 4 forward, 2 reverse --- Automatic, 7 forward, 1 reverse
Engine: 1500hp Gas Turbine --- 1000hp Diesel V12
External Fuel: No --- Yes
T-90 Advan. 9
M1A1 Advan. 3
Winner T-90

FirepowerMain Gun: Smoothbore 120mm/44, 12rpm --- Smoothbore 125mm/48, 10rpm
Main Gun Ammo: 40 --- 43
Main Gun Rounds: APFSFS, HEAT, MP-AT, HE-OR, Canister --- APFSDS, HEAT, HE-FRAG
Indirect Fire Ability: No --- No
Coaxial Gun: 7.62mm, 700rpm --- 7.62mm, 600rpm
Secondary Gun Ammo: 10000rds, loaded --- 2000rds, loaded
Roof Gun: 12.7mm, 500rpm --- 12.7mm, 500rpm
Roof Gun Ammo: 200rds, loaded --- 150rds, loaded
Missile(s): None --- AT-11 Sniper
Missile Capacity: N/A --- (Substitute for main gun rounds)
Gun Elevation: +20 --- +14
Gun Depression: -10 --- -6
T-90 Advan. 5
M1A1 Advan. 5
Winner: Draw

Protection
Armor Type: Laminated RHA Steel + DU --- Laminated RHA Steel + Quartz Gravel + Applique ( No DU for export ).
Spall Liners: Yes --- Yes
Flammable Fuel: Yes --- No
Fire Extinguisher: Halon --- Carbon Dioxide
Blow-off Panels: Yes --- Yes
Ammo Compartment: Yes --- Yes
V-Hull: No --- No
APS: No* --- Yes
ERA: No --- Yes
Escape Hatch: No --- Yes
T-90 Advan.6
M1A1 Advan. 0
Winner T-90
(*Note the M1A1 was at one time fitted with an MCD that was supposed to serve as an active protection system. However, crew testimonials coupled to the fact that the TUSK kit and M1A2 don't mount MCDs leaves the MCD as a red herring)

Crew FeaturesCrew Capacity: 4 --- 3
Passenger Capacity: None --- None
Air Conditioning: No --- No
NBC System: Overpressure --- Overpressure
T-90 Advan. 0
M1A1 Advan. 1
Winner M1A1

Surprise
Length: 32.25ft --- 31.26ft
Height: 9.47ft --- 7.3ft
Width: 12ft --- 12.4ft
Driver Optics: Night Vision --- Night Vision
TC Optics: N/A --- TIS
Gunner Optics: TIS --- TIS
Landline Cable Jack: No --- Yes
Tank-Infanry Telephone: No --- Yes
APU: Yes --- Yes
Top Speed: 42mph --- 40mph
Combat Weight: 72 tons --- 49.6 tons
Range: 298 miles --- 340~400 miles
T-90 Advan. 7
M1A1 Advan. 2
Winner T-90

EnduranceFuel consumption: 8gpm --- .93gpm
Track Endurance: 1800 miles --- 1500 miles?
Average Main Tube Life: 400rds --- 1200rds
Battle Main Tube Life: 50rds --- 600rds
Multi-Fuel: Yes --- Yes
Fuel endurance while idling: 8 hours --- 63 hours
T-90 Advan. 4
M1A1 Advan. 1
Winner T-90

Engineering
Mine Plow: Compatible --- Compatible
Mine Roller: Compatible --- Compatible
Dozer Blade: Not compatible --- Built-in
T-90 Advan. 1
M1A1 Advan None
Winner T-90

Other Important FactorsUnit Cost: $5 Million --- $4 Million
Development Span: 10 years --- 8 years
Number Built: +9000 --- +1700
Number of users: 3 --- 4
T-90 Advan. 3
M1A1 Advan. 2
Winner T-90
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It is good for Iraq to fight against exported terrorists.
Good job.
 
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