What's new

Iranian warship points weapon at U.S. helicopter, US official says

wow , you actually think you stand a chance against a US destroyer let a lone the entire fleet

just wow

not to mention GCC countries with the massive combined Air Force they have built up with the support of US
will put your dreams of magically "destroying" them to rest.


You're clueless about what you're talking about. You should stick to the turkish section.

A single US destroyer would get sliced in half by 1 Iranian anti ship ballistic missile like Persian gulf missile or the Hormoz series.

They have little to no defence against such quasi ballistic missiles which have evasive manoeuvring during the terminal phase. Add this to the relative close proximity of their fifth fleet to Iranian missile launched. They have very little time to react to these mach 4-5 missiles. And I am talking about just one systems here i.e the ballistic missiles. Never-mind the other system like sea skimming cruise missiles, sunburn missile, underwater launched missiles we saw recently, thousands of mines.

No one is saying Iranian navy is as powerful as the US navy because that would be a conventional military comparison, but to claim Iran could not stand a chance against 1 US destroyer shows you're clueless in this topic.
 
. .
You're clueless about what you're talking about. You should stick to the turkish section.

A single US destroyer would get sliced in half by 1 Iranian anti ship ballistic missile like Persian gulf missile or the Hormoz series.

They have little to no defence against such quasi ballistic missiles which have evasive manoeuvring during the terminal phase. Add this to the relative close proximity of their fifth fleet to Iranian missile launched. They have very little time to react to these mach 4-5 missiles. And I am talking about just one systems here i.e the ballistic missiles. Never-mind the other system like sea skimming cruise missiles, sunburn missile, underwater launched missiles we saw recently, thousands of mines.

No one is saying Iranian navy is as powerful as the US navy because that would be a conventional military comparison, but to claim Iran could not stand a chance against 1 US destroyer shows you're clueless in this topic.


who said US has to put its destroyers in a range of Iranian anti-ship missiles ?

a single US destroyer can easily take out Iranian navy staying well out of the range of Iranian anti-ship missiles

Yeah it's been almost three and half months that their coalition have started a civil war against Yemeni people (the civilian death toll in the Yemen conflict has reached at least 1,693 with another 3,829 injured,) to defeat Houthis .... despite 24/7 bombing with the support of the US the massive combined air force has failed to retake Yemen.
No one in Iran dreams to destroy any Arab countries , who said so ?... @Serpentine meant in case of any war we have absolute right to defend ourselves and anyone who involved would be punished ....that's an universal right ... I mean self-defence ....

At first it was said Arabs would never enter Yemen in the first place and if they did it would turn into a bloodbath for them
but now they have and results are pretty clear.

Don't want to get into this pointless debate of what if. But the only comprehensive simulation ever done that is the closest we have to the real thing says otherwise and thanks god, Iran had nothing to do with the simulation otherwise it would be called propaganda.

So in absence of a real war (which despite GCC countries and Israel attempts, doesn't seem to be happening) these results are the only referable facts that exist:

Millennium Challenge 2002 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anything else is just stipulations. So spare your comments for yourself as in that simulation not only one destroyer but 16 capital ships were destroyed in a day.

GCC countries are all too vulnerable to Iranian missiles to risk starting a war or letting any other countries to use their air space to attack Iran. Israel was not able to convince SA to let it use its air space even with all the bad blood between them and Iranians.


here is why Millennium Challenge 2002 wasn't a good simulation in the first place

Recommended reading: an autopsy of the 2002 Millennium Challenge war games | Fabius Maximus website

indeed GCC countries are vulnerable to BM of Iran but Iran is also vulnerable to the massive air force they have built up
 
.
who said US has to put its destroyers in a range of Iranian anti-ship missiles ?

a single US destroyer can easily take out Iranian navy staying well out of the range of Iranian anti-ship missiles



At first it was said Arabs would never enter Yemen in the first place and if they did it would turn into a bloodbath for them
but now they have and results are pretty clear.




here is why Millennium Challenge 2002 wasn't a good simulation in the first place

Recommended reading: an autopsy of the 2002 Millennium Challenge war games | Fabius Maximus website

indeed GCC countries are vulnerable to BM of Iran but Iran is also vulnerable to the massive air force they have built up

I expected more from you. I guess you didn't read the link that I gave you and again didn't read what you posted yourself.

The reading you posted above says the simulation was not good because:

“Not so,” Van Riper told Army Times. “Instead of a free-play, two-sided game as the Joint Forces commander advertised it was going to be, it simply became a scripted exercise. They had a predetermined end, and they scripted the exercise to that end.” … Exercise officials denied him the opportunity to use his own tactics and ideas against Blue, and on several occasions directed the Opposing Force not to use certain weapons systems against Blue. It even ordered him to reveal the location of Red units, he said

Just so you know, Van Riper is the Marine General who controlled red army (that of Iran). In the first simulation run he wiped out Blue navy. Then : (this is from Wikipedia)

At this point, the exercise was suspended, Blue's ships were "re-floated", and the rules of engagement were changed; this was later justified by General Peter Pace as follows: "You kill me in the first day and I sit there for the next 13 days doing nothing, or you put me back to life and you get 13 more days' worth of experiment out of me. Which is a better way to do it?"[2] After the reset, both sides were ordered to follow predetermined plans of action.

Van Riper resigned in objection to this predetermined script. So what your article is referring to is the second run. The first run (in which blue navy was wiped out) was as realistic as it could be with the leaders of two sides able to do what is necessary to win the war. So I repeat again, the result that has been mentioned in Wikipedia is the only referable fact for such a hypothetical engagement and is as close to reality as you can get without actually fighting a war.

Now if you still like to think that a single destroyer can take on Iran alone, then fine.
 
.
I expected more from you. I guess you didn't read the link that I gave you and again didn't read what you posted yourself.

The reading you posted above says the simulation was not good because:

“Not so,” Van Riper told Army Times. “Instead of a free-play, two-sided game as the Joint Forces commander advertised it was going to be, it simply became a scripted exercise. They had a predetermined end, and they scripted the exercise to that end.” … Exercise officials denied him the opportunity to use his own tactics and ideas against Blue, and on several occasions directed the Opposing Force not to use certain weapons systems against Blue. It even ordered him to reveal the location of Red units, he said

Just so you know, Van Riper is the Marine General who controlled red army (that of Iran). In the first simulation run he wiped out Blue navy. Then : (this is from Wikipedia)

At this point, the exercise was suspended, Blue's ships were "re-floated", and the rules of engagement were changed; this was later justified by General Peter Pace as follows: "You kill me in the first day and I sit there for the next 13 days doing nothing, or you put me back to life and you get 13 more days' worth of experiment out of me. Which is a better way to do it?"[2] After the reset, both sides were ordered to follow predetermined plans of action.

Van Riper resigned in objection to this predetermined script. So what your article is referring to is the second run. The first run (in which blue navy was wiped out) was as realistic as it could be with the leaders of two sides able to do what is necessary to win the war. So I repeat again, the result that has been mentioned in Wikipedia is the only referable fact for such a hypothetical engagement and is as close to reality as you can get without actually fighting a war.

Now if you still like to think that a single destroyer can take on Iran alone, then fine.

I have read what I posted and have read what you posted , and simply quoted what was I referring too
they used unrealistic strategies and created an unrealistic scenario , thus why I am suggesting the Millennium Challenge
is not a proper "source" to refer to Iranian and US capabilities


when I say 1 US destroyer is enough , I am implying US can just stay out of the range of anti-ship missiles
and still be able to strike Iranian targets

I don't know why Iranians here assume US naval fleet has to enter Persian Gulf , which indeed can create a dangerous situation for them while they can easily operate outside of it

Do you think US navy will enter the tiny Persian Gulf , when Iranian navy and naval defenses are still intact?

Its even more ridiculous to suggest Iran can destroy the whole fleet and even conduct strikes on host countries
 
.
Taliban is working in pakistan and afghanistan at full force . they are actually in POWER in some provinces and gov't forces shit their pants when they enter those parts of their own country .

Iraq asks help from Iran , not the US . collaboration with US is merely a "Keep your enemy closer" kinda tactic . you have almost zero influence in Iraq .

its Iran who is fighting ISIS BTW . you're an ally of ISIS in syria and elsewhere . just as always , ISIS is only bad in Iraq . when it comes to syria , they're freedom fighters .

Actually have some power? They keep talking about spring offensive by launching attacks from Pakistan not from within its own country, but you already pointed out working in Pakistan in full force which means they still have to hide there. Seems to me the Taliban controls Pakistan instead as attacks in Pakistan shows.

Iraq did ask for American help. You think American advisers and planes dropping bombs didn't mean anything? You talk bullshit.

Maliki asks for US help as ISIS expands in Iraq - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

Maliki asks for US help as ISIS expands in Iraq
The Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (ISIS) has seized control of major Iraqi cities that were believed to be protected, and started threatening the federal government in Baghdad and putting the unity of the country at risk, especially after the failure of political leaders to reach a unified vision toward confronting ISIS. The latter took over military bases in Mosul and Tikrit, using the military's weapons and equipment.

Following the military breakdowns, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki had to ask for the help of the United States, which in turn mobilized its allies. President Barack Obama said his government is looking at “all options,” excluding ground troops. French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius called on “the international community to take swift action,” while the Foreign and Commonwealth Office confirmed its readiness to provide “any kind of support in order to restore security in Iraq.” The Russian delegate at the United Nations declared that immediate action ought to be taken to deal with the situation.

The Security Council held an emergency session and ruefully denounced the recent attacks in Mosul, and the ISIS attacks on civilians and military members.


Read more: Maliki asks for US help as ISIS expands in Iraq - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East


Read more: Maliki asks for US help as ISIS expands in Iraq - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

Yeah thats right . these 120 countries all suport US in case of a war with Iran :(

Non-Aligned Movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


don't get me started on a probable war ;)

No ones on your side except some PGCC countries and of course , Israel . trust me , even EU will F you over


Ex. US forces is a better word to address them in case of a war .

we'll make sure there is no remains for their parents to bury . vaporizing is truly an easy way to go . no pain whatsoever

Indeed, there be no remains for Iran to bury their own sons and daughters in war. Wouldn't want Iran to see that again.

Yeah it's been almost three and half months that their coalition have started a civil war against Yemeni people (the civilian death toll in the Yemen conflict has reached at least 1,693 with another 3,829 injured,) to defeat Houthis .... despite 24/7 bombing with the support of the US the massive combined air force has failed to retake Yemen.
No one in Iran dreams to destroy any Arab countries , who said so ?... @Serpentine meant in case of any war we have absolute right to defend ourselves and anyone who involved would be punished ....that's an universal right ... I mean self-defence ....

The Arabs intervene to defend themselves from Iranian influence and Iran has yet to succeed in Yemen.
 
.
I have read what I posted and have read what you posted , and simply quoted what was I referring too
they used unrealistic strategies and created an unrealistic scenario , thus why I am suggesting the Millennium Challenge
is not a proper "source" to refer to Iranian and US capabilities


when I say 1 US destroyer is enough , I am implying US can just stay out of the range of anti-ship missiles
and still be able to strike Iranian targets

I don't know why Iranians here assume US naval fleet has to enter Persian Gulf , which indeed can create a dangerous situation for them while they can easily operate outside of it

Do you think US navy will enter the tiny Persian Gulf , when Iranian navy and naval defenses are still intact?

Its even more ridiculous to suggest Iran can destroy the whole fleet and even conduct strikes on host countries
Correction: They used unrealistic strategies on the 2nd run not first run. But never formally published the results of the first run. You need to be really thinking outside the box to accept a test result that is significantly different from what you thought it would be. It seems like it was only Van Riper who was open minded enough to see the reality.

Why do we think US navy will enter Persian Gulf?

1- Maybe because they are already there? The fifth fleet base in Bahrain. And F-22 Raptor base in Emirate. Bases in Kuwait, Afghanistan,.....All within Iran's ballistic missile range. What are they going to do? Abandon those bases until they can bomb Iran into stone age? How are they going to send supplies to those forces? Currently they are all supplied through sea freight.
2- Maybe because all those decorated generals like Van Riper thought an engagement with Iran's navy is likely enough scenario to throw $250 million at a simulation to see what actually will happen? Maybe you should tell them what idiots they are by underestimating their own capabilities.
3- Maybe because it is impossible to locate, let alone hit every single tiny missile boat and midget submarine that Iran possesses? Unless as per the script of the 2nd run of the simulation, Iran let US know where they are.
4- Maybe because it is impossible to hit those tiny missile boats within the high commercial traffic of Persian Gulf? Shutting down the freight traffic in that body of water is not an option. The first countries that will starve to death are US Arab allies. And then US also needs to deal with angry China, India, South Korea and Japan and of course, Europe. Any slow down in the economies of those countries will eventually hit US.
5- Maybe because it is not possible to locate and destroy Iran antiship missiles on back of trucks until they actually shoot? Which then means there was something in the range of their missiles a.k.a US naval units?
6- Maybe because according to US Marine Corps manual and the rest of military text books you can never control an area until you set boots on the ground and Persian Gulf is one of 10 critical locations that US needs to maintain control according to its national security policy?

There are so many other reasons. This article actually does a good job in explaining why US can't limit the war with Iran the way it did with Iraq or Iran back in 80s, provided you really read it. I have attached the paragraph that is related to this subject and this is according to Seymour Hersh, an accredit political journalist:

What is it About Iran that Scares the US?: On Tehran’s Military Capabilities

Finally, the conditions of the confrontation prevent the US from planning a limited or containment strike that would disable Iran from retaliating. As Seymour Hersh wrote in a report about this issue years ago, US military officials discovered that limiting the war against Iran, the way it happened in Iraq in 1991, is impossible. It is not possible to hit Iranian nuclear sites without securing US air bases in the region. This requires hitting Iranian missile platforms but this could not be done while the Gulf is teeming with anti-ship missiles. Hence, little by little, the targets of the US campaign began to expand to include invading the Iranian coast and destroying a large number of military facilities in the country. The quick air campaign turned into a comprehensive war plan with hundreds and thousands of targets. US generals went as far as seriously contemplating using tactical nuclear bombs to quell Iranian defenses according to Hersh's sources.

Above was for the case of trying to destroy Iran's nuclear plants. In the case of a full fledged war, it will be even worst.

However, all this conversation started when someone brought up the shooting down of Iran airliner by a US destroyer. That destroyer was in Persian Gulf but back then Iran didn't possess any anti naval missiles capable of hitting the destroyer. The argument is that if such atrocity happen again at present, that destroyer will be cut in half, something well within Iran's declared abilities.
 
.
who said US has to put its destroyers in a range of Iranian anti-ship missiles ?

a single US destroyer can easily take out Iranian navy staying well out of the range of Iranian anti-ship missiles



At first it was said Arabs would never enter Yemen in the first place and if they did it would turn into a bloodbath for them
but now they have and results are pretty clear.




here is why Millennium Challenge 2002 wasn't a good simulation in the first place

Recommended reading: an autopsy of the 2002 Millennium Challenge war games | Fabius Maximus website

indeed GCC countries are vulnerable to BM of Iran but Iran is also vulnerable to the massive air force they have built up

Several Arab countries as a coalition are in one side and on the other side we have Houthis ... they have resisted against them for almost three and half months .... I take it as humillation for a country like Saudi Arabia and it's huge military budget ....


The Arabs intervene to defend themselves from Iranian influence and Iran has yet to succeed in Yemen.


Iranian influence? you gotta be kidding me .... Iran has been here for thousands of years and it's natural to have influence in the ME due to its cultural and historical backgrounds whilst many of these tiny Arab countries have been formed at most half a century ago ..... in fact the U.S occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan back in 2000/2003 with more than 130k American troops couldn't achieve such a goal ... And you know Arabs have invaded Iran two times while Iran has never .... actually Iran has not attacked any country for last two centuries .... go and read your vice president "Joe Biden" words over main problem in the region , he is clear on this issue and your allies ...
The point is when on Earth we could get rid of American intervene in the middle east? Iran influence in its own region is bad but Americans' is good?
On Yemen, Arabs are killing Arabs ...
 
.
The Arabs intervene to defend themselves from Iranian influence and Iran has yet to succeed in Yemen.

Succeed in what exactly? I know there were some allegations that Houties were within Iran's sphere of influence but it is a wrong perception. There was a very good chance that they would eventually become an ally of Iran because there are only so many different sides that you can choose from. In that area you are either in the GCC (and US) camp, or you are independent or you are in Iran's camp. They had already denounced being part of GCC camp. It is not easy for such a small country to be independent especially with SA threatening its existence, so there was a good chance that they would join Iran camp. It was a natural move not something that Iran had to invest on to happen.

The fact is that now SA is engaged in a war of attrition that god knows when will end. Meaning it has less resources and time to assign to helping the terrorists in Syria and Iraq which is only a good thing for Iran without needing to spend any resources. So in that sense, Iran is actually succeeding. Any other shows like Iran's navy presence in Gulf of Aden is to keep SA attention to Yemen reminding her that as soon as she turn her head, Iran will take its place in Yemen.
 
Last edited:
.
who said US has to put its destroyers in a range of Iranian anti-ship missiles ?

a single US destroyer can easily take out Iranian navy staying well out of the range of Iranian anti-ship missiles


Iran has anti ships ballistic missiles with with ranges 2500-3000 Km which were first declared few years ago. We have yet to see them but they are most definitely already operation because they were in testing process few years ago. Thus your comment of US being able to knock out Iranian navy out of range of Iranian missiles is moot. Reality is, you don't know jack about Iranian anti ship capability and are talking about things beyond your capacity.
 
.
Iran has anti ships ballistic missiles with with ranges 2500-3000 Km which were first declared few years ago. We have yet to see them but they are most definitely already operation because they were in testing process few years ago. Thus your comment of US being able to knock out Iranian navy out of range of Iranian missiles is moot. Reality is, you don't jack about Iranian anti ship capability and are talking about things beyond your capacity.

Lol , I know all well about those supposed anti-ship BMs , which apparently Iran doesn't even have the proper satellites for the proper guidance against a moving target

2nd , BMs are no problem for the battle group , with 1 destroyer dedicating around 20 cells during peace time for SM-2 or SM-3 , with around 4 destroyers and a single cruiser , 100+ cells dedicated against BMs for a single battle group
 
.
Lol , I know all well about those supposed anti-ship BMs , which apparently Iran doesn't even have the proper satellites for the proper guidance against a moving target

2nd , BMs are no problem for the battle group , with 1 destroyer dedicating around 20 cells during peace time for SM-2 or SM-3 , with around 4 destroyers and a single cruiser , 100+ cells dedicated against BMs for a single battle group

As I said, you don't know jack about what you're mumbling on about. You're talking as if ships move at supersonic speeds, They move very slowly and by the the time the missile reaches the terminal phase, it uses its on-board seekers to adjust its path to hit them. Anti ballistic missiles are not that useful against manoeuvring warheads that have evasive manoeuvring techniques and lets not forget other things such as decoys etc etc. There are also cluster warheads and MIRV's which Iran has possessed the technology for a while now. Seriously kid, you should stop wasting thread space with your gibberish.
 
. .
As I said, you don't know jack about what you're mumbling on about. You're talking as if ships move at supersonic speeds, They move very slowly and by the the time the missile reaches the terminal phase, it uses its on-board seekers to adjust its path to hit them. Anti ballistic missiles are not that useful against manoeuvring warheads that have evasive manoeuvring techniques and lets not forget other things such as decoys etc etc. There are also cluster warheads and MIRV's which Iran has possessed the technology for a while now. Seriously kid, you should stop wasting thread space with your gibberish.

Lol , a BM isn't just launched in the air and hoping it would hit something , you need some proper intelligence which requires satellites or UAVs , considering your UAVs won't last long against a Carrier Battle Group ( Proper Long Range UAV) , your only hope is satellite , which again you don't have

USN battle group would have 2 AWACS in the air providing constant updates during war time.

maneuvering warhead isn't a new technology and has been around for awhile , with dedicating 2 SM-2/3s per target it removes the room for error.
 
.
@Azeri440
You're really dumb. Few Iranian missiles can send all of American warships to bed of waters. They have 0 chance against Iranian missiles Mr. dumb.
 
Last edited:
.
Back
Top Bottom