Iran Sanctions: Why Pakistan Won't Help

[Abu Zolfiqar]

This thread will answer many questions:
http://www.defence.pk/forums/strate...31802-pakistan-iran-turkey-confederation.html

Briefly, Pakistan and Iran have been very close historically. The relationship only died after Zia (Sunni) and Ayatollahs (Shia) came into power. The only reason Iran got close to India is because they think we are a Saudi pawn. And we are. All this Wahabi extremism in Pakistan and Afghanistan is funded by the Arabs. I have nothing agains the Arabs. In fact we should develop maximum friendship both with Arabs and Iran and, as Omar1984 says, maybe even help build bridges between them.

We should make it clear that we are neither pro-Sunni nor pro-Shia. A strong friendship with Iran will automatically kick out India of Afghanistan and bring Afghanistan on our side.

i agree with what you said....and within both Pakistan and Iran (and even Saudia) many new generation are fed up of these motherf*cking Mullahs who are trying to give their versions of religion.


i dont think Pakistan is in position to help create bridge between Tehran and Riyadh. Too many diverging geo-strategic interests. As long as religious zealots have power in both countries ---it will never happen because of the sectarian issue (which they politicize)

endless reasons....


just wait till the gas (black gold) runs out and they are forced to cooperate out of necessity. I wish the goddam oil would run out sooner

 

[graphican]

We need to remove Wahabi influence from the Taliban anyway, for our own good. We don't want Wahabi extremism in Pakistan or anywhere near us. Once the Taliban renounce Wahabism, Iran will have no reason to oppose them, and the Iran/India alliance there will fall apart.

May be you re indicating what would be the best for Pakistan but I dont see a reason how this influence would be reduced, let alone removed. In my opinion, the max we can do is to bring Taliban in confidence and bring them on table with Iran. Pakistan is also in position to bring Saudia Arabia and Iran on the table and help them reduce their differences.

 

[r3alist]

I think Sir Abdul Qadeer has put some light on the favors Pakistan has offered

yes, but was abdul qadeer acting on behalf of abdul qadeer or pakistani national interests?

whose to say that iran are so grateful to pak?

did they hesitate in naming and shaming aq khan as their pakistani source thus putting us under immense international pressure - no they did not.

had we felt Iran even the slightest threat, we wouldn't have cooperated to the level and specially for something that could be detrimental for Pakistan. So may be in our personal opinions, we disagree on Iran being a friend or not a friend but strategically Pakistan's actions have shown we are not in danger from them.

yes true, however i am not saying iran will be our enemy, we have much in common to be enemies, just that we must be cautious in our approach to them and not be so blindly brotherly when they do not feel the same way, they have hurt pakistan before.

yes Afghanistan is one contentious issue but I think Pakistan is acting or at least trying to act Neutral at the moment. We have recently signed few agreements with Iran which were not possible if the two sides had some different polarity.

i hope so, iran could cause a real headache for us in that region and baluch, if they wanted to.

We have a history of contention with Israel and so does Iran.

lets not go overboard here, our level of conflict with israel is not the same as irans, in fact i would prefer it if pakistan did not get too involved with israel but the reality is they are very close with india so its a problem for us.

but ask yourself do iran have a problem with india/israeli connection like we do?

If you name 3 enemies of Iran, you will find it shares two countries from our list.

but this one enemy that we differ upon is a major major issues, moreso because its on our doorstep, so if we cannot agree on regional issues how can we have a wider strategic aim.





essentially my message is to view the iranians with caution but aim to have solid relations based on tangible things like trade and joint ventures (in any form), lets not rely on the whole muslim brother angle, they do not think the same do they?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

iran cant cause headache for us in Baluchistan because they themselves are facing problem with some Baluch nationalists....and in Iran, their problem is compounded because of the sectarian element as well (most ethnic Baluch are Sunnis)


few people know about this. But Iran is building a separation wall between Iran and Pakistan on the Baluch border; because Jundollah (Iranian organization) sometimes comes in Quetta and hides there. So they feel that Pakistani Baluchistan is used sometimes as a base for attacks.

It's sad. But it also happens to be a popular drug smuggling route, and human-trafficking route (Kabul, Quetta, Masshad, Istanbul, Europe).....

BLAs Jundollahs PKKS ---- all foreign funded and drug-funded terrorist militias.

 

[r3alist]

iran cant cause headache for us in Baluchistan because they themselves are facing problem with some Baluch nationalists.

its not that simple, they can provide a haven for indian operatives to cause trouble in the region or some other colloboration, i would not put it past them.

 

[Developereo]

i agree with what you said....and within both Pakistan and Iran (and even Saudia) many new generation are fed up of these motherf*cking Mullahs who are trying to give their versions of religion.

I hope you are right. The one good thing we can hope from this GWOT is that it makes Muslims wake up and realize that, as long as we stay divided, our enemies will take advantage and the world will leave us behind.

May be you re indicating what would be the best for Pakistan but I dont see a reason how this influence would be reduced, let alone removed. In my opinion, the max we can do is to bring Taliban in confidence and bring them on table with Iran. Pakistan is also in position to bring Saudia Arabia and Iran on the table and help them reduce their differences.

We have to get rid of Wahabism in the Taliban. Otherwise we will never be able to clean Pakistan; it will filter over the border from Afghanistan continually.

essentially my message is to view the iranians with caution but aim to have solid relations based on tangible things like trade and joint ventures (in any form), lets not rely on the whole muslim brother angle, they do not think the same do they?

I agree with you and do not trust the ayatollahs either. Our joint interests with Iran have to go beyond Muslim brotherhood. A common enemy in Israel, and a trade corridor to China are two starting points.

The bigger problem will be how to make sure the Saudis don't get upset.

 

[Developereo]

Can you guys imagine? If we have good relations with Iran and Afghanistan, we don't have to worry about separatist crap from India/Israel on that side. The benefits to Pakistan's stability are so fantastic, we cannot afford to ignore these relations any longer.

But I agree the ayatollahs could be a problem.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

its not that simple, they can provide a haven for indian operatives to cause trouble in the region or some other colloboration, i would not put it past them.

indian operatives are working with disaffected Baluch who join BLA. Check the net. They privately admit to pumping money into Baluchistan.

It isnt Iran where they are getting haven. It is Afghanistan. And india is probably using Afghan Baluch to stir up trouble in Pakistani Baluchistan.

That is why I keep shouting, ranting and raving to people on this forum and people in real life. Solve the [mod edit] issues of the province so that these indians [mod edit]will stop exploiting the situation.

All we need to do is give them more share on the gas, and give them controls and jobs at Gwadar. Maybe that is one good thing PPP can accomplish (as Zardari himself is ethnic Baluch)



Iran does support Northern Alliance which is anti-Pakistani. But they DARE not allow indians to use their territory for anti-Pakistan activities. They DARE not.

We should increase economic/energy related cooperation with Iran. They are good people.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Can you guys imagine? If we have good relations with Iran and Afghanistan, we don't have to worry about separatist crap from India/Israel on that side. The benefits to Pakistan's stability are so fantastic, we cannot afford to ignore these relations any longer.

But I agree the ayatollahs could be a problem.

Ayatollahs and Mullas are the problem. We should throw them all in a deep well. Let them sort out eachother's problems. And keep them in there.



good relations with Afghanistan will take time. I used to be a proponent for Afghan Pakhtun areas to join Pakistan. That would solve issue of Durand line.

the real problem is the tajiki/uzbeki element in Afghanistan. They are the ones you need to keep your eyes out for. They are dangerous.

 

[ARSENAL6]

Ayatollahs and Mullas are the problem. We should throw them all in a deep well. Let them sort out eachother's problems. And keep them in there.



good relations with Afghanistan will take time. I used to be a proponent for Afghan Pakhtun areas to join Pakistan. That would solve issue of Durand line.

the real problem is the tajiki/uzbeki element in Afghanistan. They are the ones you need to keep your eyes out for. They are dangerous.

I can see this happening Pak and AFgan joining but only if the entire region supports this.
WIth all the RAW agents around i think it is gong to be a hard task.

 

[naved_kam]

good relations with Afghanistan will take time. I used to be a proponent for Afghan Pakhtun areas to join Pakistan. That would solve issue of Durand line.

the real problem is the tajiki/uzbeki element in Afghanistan. They are the ones you need to keep your eyes out for. They are dangerous.

As long as you look for making qualified/selective friends in Afganistan, you are getting nowhere. You have tried that in the past and you fell on your ummmm....... face.

To make friends with Afganistan you have to accept them as the diverse country that they are, which would include the Ujbeks, the Tajiks, the Hazaras along with the Pakhtuns.

And what gave you the idea that the Afgan Pakhtun would like to join Pakistan??