Iran is world’s 15th leading scientific nation: Scopus ranking

[Doritos11]

Just curious, where is the center of the very early Mesopotamia civilization? I thought it is Baghdad.

southern iraq, Ubaid & Uruk, Sumer.

 

[iranigirl2]

Baghdad did not exist before the Islamic era, it was established during Abbasid rule.

Baghdad was set up as a major urban city by the Abbasid rule after the invasion of Arabs into the Persian Empire, they moved their capital from Damascus into the new city of Baghdad.




Ctesiphon was looted and completely destroyed by the Umayyad and Baghdad became the city of hope and god's gift.



Baghdad just absorbed all the pre-Islamic elements of Persian empire including the inhabitants.


The demographics , culture and language of this region did not change after the Arab invasion, sure they were forced into accepting Islam, but they didn't instantly become Arabized Muslims.

 

[iranigirl2]

Ctesiphon the capital of Persia was not one city; it was a conglomeration of several cities. Indeed the Arabs called Ctesiphon Al-Madain, meaning the cities. The main city lay on the eastern bank of the Tigris. The part of the city on the western bank of the Tigris was known as Bahrseer.

The Muslim advance to Ctesiphon was delayed by the detachments placed on the route to Ctesiphon. That gave enough time to the Sassanids to arrange for the defense of the city, as Yazdgerd III planned. The Muslims were expected to follow the traditional route to Ctesiphon and expected to appear before Bahrseer; for this purpose, Bahrseer had been well prepared for defense, and a deep ditch had been dug round the perimeter of the suburb. As the Muslim advance guard approached Bahrseer, the Persian garrison within the fortified city hurled stones at the Muslims through ballistas and catapults. The Muslims pulled back beyond the range of the projectiles and laid siege to the city.



Siege of Ctesiphon (637) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[iranigirl2]

After occupying the city, Saad announced amnesty to all Persians who were in the city. A delegation of the representatives of the people waited on Saad. They sought terms, and the usual terms of jaziya were imposed. A regular peace pact was drawn up, and the citizens were called upon to follow their normal avocations. Sa'ad moved into the White Palace and established his headquarters there. The great courtyard of the palace was converted into a mosque. Emperor Yazdgerd had retreated to Hulwan. While withdrawing the Persian emperor carried away as much of the imperial treasure and other valuable possessions as he could carry. Saad next sent out columns in several directions to deal with the Persian stragglers. A massive booty fell into the Muslim hands. Muslim forces conquered the Persian provinces as far as Khuzistan. The conquest however was slowed by a severe drought in Arabia in 638 and the plague in southern Iraq and Syria in 639. After this Caliph Umar wanted a break to manage the conquered territories and for then he decided to suspend the offensive. Umar is reported to have said:

“ "I wish there were a mountain of fire between us and the Persians, so that neither could they get to us, nor we to them."



Siege of Ctesiphon (637) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Umar was hated by the Persians even back then!

 

[iranigirl2]

Also the Arabic name for Baghdad is Dar Essalam.


and it was called Dar Essalam by the Arabs for centuries, never Baghdad.


Baghdad was the name given to this city by the Persians inhabitants.

 

[Shapur Zol Aktaf]

Persia is in a mountanious region, the golden age of Islam took place during the Abbasid caliphate which its capitals were Kufa and Baghdad, not Persia, though Iraq was part of Persian dynasties before the whole Arab invasion, and it was mentioned as Iranian heartland, it still is not Persia. Most inventions took place in Baghdad though people from all over the caliphate came there to study.

I agree with parts of what you said. Indeed Parts of todays Iraq became part of different Iranian empires and dystasty for almost 1000 years before Islam arrived. So there was already an Iranian population and influence there. Read the following texts (also about Kufa and baghdad that you mentioned).

We can see that in some city names or history of their establishment and Iranian cities that existed in the past in todays Iraq.

Baghdad was build by Iranian barmakids (the most acceptable theory is that Baghdad means god-given in persian). The caliph Al-Mansur commissioned the construction of the city and it was built under the supervision of the Barmakids.

Also the Sassanid place named Suristan became Kufah.

Anbar (from persian word of warehouse).
Muqdadiyah: The original name of the town is Shareban (kurdish: Şareban or شاره*با&#1606, mentioned as such in the works of the classical writers such as Ptolemy and Strabo. Sharaban stands for a satrap.
And not to forget parthian-sassanid places such as Ctesiphon, Veh-Ardashir, Rumagan (al-Rumiya), Asbanbar, Budh-Ardashīr, Vologesocerta and others (I had not time to find them all).

Other Interesting material:

While defeating the forces of the Sassanid Empire there, the Muslim commander Utbah ibn Ghazwan erected his camp on the site of an old Persian settlement called Vaheštābād Ardašīr, which was destroyed by the Arabs. The name Al-Basrah, which in Arabic means "the over watching" or "the seeing everything", was given to it because of its role as a military base against the Sassanid Empire. However, other sources claim the name originates from the Persian word Bas-rāh or Bassorāh meaning "where many ways come together

The region of Fallujah was a part of the Sassanid Persian province of Anbar. The word anbar is Persian and means "warehouse". Known as Firuz Shapur or Perisapora during the Sassanian Era, it was one the main commercial center of the Lakhmid Kingdom.

The Nahrawan Canal (Arabic: قناة النهروان&#8206 was a major irrigation system of the Sassanid and early Islamic periods in central Iraq, along the eastern shore of the Tigris and the lower course of the Diyala River. Created in the 6th century, it reached its peak under the Abbasid Caliphate, when it served the main water supply for the Abbasid capital of Baghdad, while the regions irrigated by it served as the city's main breadbasket.
The first irrigation works along the Diyala River were undertaken in Parthian times. Indeed, it may be that the lower part of the Nahrawan Canal was originally the lower course of the Diyala.[1] The large-scale canal system of early medieval times however was created in the reign of the Sassanid ruler Khosrau I (531–579), who also established it as a separate administrative district (Bazidjan Khusraw). A treasury and mint were possibly established there.

Historically, and for most of Iran's history, Iraq was a core part of Iran (the capital province in many periods). It is where the Achaemenid capital Babylon, and the Parthian and Sassanian capital Ctesiphon were located. Even though Iraqis spoke Semitic rather than Iranic language, Iraq was always regarded as Irān (Iran proper); never as Anīrān (non-Iran).
Persian settlement in Iraq goes back to the 6th century BC when the Achaemenid Persians annexed Iraq (Babylonia) and its empire, and made Babylon their winter capital. Persians henceforth became a ruling minority in Iraq, and would rule Persia from Iraq for most of antiquity.
“ According to Sassanian documents, Persians distinguished two kinds of land within their empire: "Īrān" (Iran proper), and "Anīrān" (non-Iran). Iraq was considered to be part of Īrān.
As Wilhelm Eilers observes: "For the Sassanians, too [as it was for the Parthians], the lowlands of Iraq constituted the heart of their dominions". This shows that Iraq was not simply part of the Persian Empire—it was the heart of Persia.
”
During the Sassanid Empire, from the 3rd century to the 7th century, the major part of Iraq was called in Persian Del-e Īrānshahr (lit. "The Heart of Iran"), and its metropolis Ctesiphon (not far from present-day Baghdad) functioned for more than 800 years as the capital city of Iran.
The Babylonian aristocracy became increasingly Persianized and commonly intermarried with Persian families, who likewise became increasingly Aramaicized. Culturally, there was very little to distinguish Aramaean notables from their Persian counterparts in the Sassanid era.
Persian settlement in Iraq continued throughout the Islamic Golden Age. Many Persians settled in Iraq during the Abbasid era and many important figures from this period are Iraqi Persians.

 

[Developereo]

Once again, the thread has descended into what happened 1000 years ago.

There is a reason America leads the world: they look at the next 1000 years, not the last.

 

[iranigirl2]

Once again, the thread has descended into what happened 1000 years ago.

There is a reason America leads the world: they look at the next 1000 years, not the last.

There is nothing wrong with discussions about ancient history. As long as people are respectful to each other. Some members on this fourm are incapable of respecting different views but not everyone is like this.


Plus in terms of geostrategic point of view for over 2500 Iran has faced the same conflicts and enemies.

Wars with Rome which today can be described as Iran conflict with America in regards to the Nuclear program.

Wars with Arab invaders, and we all know Iran and Saudi Arabia don't like each other.


History shows that if Rome and Persia become friends it will be beneficial to both.


The only reason why Arabs were able to expand so quickly and conquer so much land was because Persian Empire and Byzantine Empire had so many wars that they had exhausted each other, this gave the Arabs the big opportunity to conquer both empires.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Once again, the thread has descended into what happened 1000 years ago.

There is a reason America leads the world: they look at the next 1000 years, not the last.

Because America does not HAVE a "last 1000 years".

 

[iranigirl2]

The Islamic cause was also aided by political upheavals occurring outside
of Arabia. The Muslim triumphs in the Near East can be partly accounted for by
the long series of wars between the Byzantine and Persian empires. Earlier
Byzantine victories had left both sides exhausted and open to conquest.
Moreover, the inhabitants of Syria and Egypt, alienated by religious dissent
and resenting the attempts of the Byzantine Empire to impose Christianity on
the population, were eager to be free of Byzantine rule. In 636, Arab armies
conquered Syria. The Muslims then won Iraq from the Persians and, within ten
years after Muhammad's death, subdued Persia itself. The greater part of Egypt
fell with little resistance in 640 and the rest shortly afterward. By the end
of the reigns of the first four caliphs, Islam had vastly increased its
territory in the Near East and Africa.


Islam, The Spread Of Islam

 

[Developereo]

There is nothing wrong with discussions about ancient history.

Of course, but the rest of your post proves that most of these discussions here are about bashing others.

Because America does not HAVE a "last 1000 years".

Lucky them!

It reflects in the American culture of judging a man, not by where he came from, but where he is going.

 

[iranigirl2]

Of course, but the rest of your post proves that most of these discussions here are about bashing others.

in none of my comments do I bash any race, religion, sect within islam, etc...


I stress that for Iran it's important to look at our ancient history, take everything that has happened in the last 2500 years into account. But don't get too stuck in the past. Learn from all the mistakes. Living in the past does not help anyone. I used the example of Byzantine and Persian empire conflicts and how Arabs were able to take advantage of both because we were involved in never ending wars that weakened both empires.

This is strictly from geostrategic point of view, not based on religious or racial hatred.

 

[Developereo]

in None of my comment do I bash any race, religion, sect within islam, etc...

A discussion about Iran's future in science has now turned into a discussion about the spread of Islam.

I am not blaming any one person, but this is what I meant by threads going off the rails.

 

[iranigirl2]

A discussion about Iran's future in science has now turned into a discussion about the spread of Islam.

I am not blaming any one person, but this is what I meant by threads going off the rails.

I agree . This whole page of discussion is off topics.

 

[Shapur Zol Aktaf]

Ok lets stay on: Scientific progress of Iran.