Indonesia Leaders : We Stand With The People of Palestine

[Respect4Respect01]

I have shown you UN reports and Amnesty International reports regarding Hamas war crimes, if you are still denial, then you are person in denial.

And you mix things, just like Hamas like to throw mixed things to disinforms. You dragged Canadian statement related to the UN Resolution 73 98, then now jump into Al Aqsa attack case, which is 2 different stories. What is the reason Israel attack Al Aqsa? if not because of Hamas provocation?

When did you show me a UN or Amnesty international reports? All you did was a show me a screenshot of a statement from UN that condemned violence and declared Israelis as occupiers, killers and terrorists.

No, its you who doesn't want to read the facts, you can't just start the story from the middle, and the beginning show us that Israelis attacked worshippers in Al Aqsa mosque and started forceful evictions in Sheik Al Jarrah and that is when Hamas came in to defend their people. You are trying to be "neutral" here so don't twist the facts.

You can't blame Israel ARMY attack Palestine/Hamas, if Palestine/Hamas attack them first, Israel also have right to defense themself. If you attack US then US will attack you back, if you attack Russia then Russia will attack you back, if you attack China, china will attack you back, how come you expect Israel sit idle when Palestine/Hamas attack them?

Massacre is another lie from Hamas that consume you. Just show me evidence if you can.

Why can't you blame them if they attacked Palestine? how did 250 people die including 64 children if they weren't attacked? what kind of logic is that?
See you always start from the middle because you have no counter argument for what these Zionists did at Al Aqsa. You talk about self defense, then lets give same weapons to Palestinians and see who wins this fight. You have to be a child to believe that a professional army with weapons, tanks and jets is not massacring innocents who have nowhere to hide because their homes are being bombed.

No USA won't attack you back if you are Israel because Zionists attacked US ship in 1967 war and nobody ever asked them a question. This terror state also attacks other states with impunity and has attacked Iran many times. I think its time for Iran to defend themselves now.

So you mean Palestine State is also lawless country because of their intifada attacks?

its already lawless state because International norms and laws don't apply there, if they did then Israel would have been wiped off the map by International forces. Palestinians have been dehumanized already.

 

[antonius123]

When did you show me a UN or Amnesty international reports? All you did was a show me a screenshot of a statement from UN that condemned violence and declared Israelis as occupiers, killers and terrorists.

Why so ignorant ignoring all my post?
Please look @my post :
#54
#131

No, its you who doesn't want to read the facts, you can't just start the story from the middle, and the beginning show us that Israelis attacked worshippers in Al Aqsa mosque and started forceful evictions in Sheik Al Jarrah and that is when Hamas came in to defend their people. You are trying to be "neutral" here so don't twist the facts.

I never deny Israel attacked worshippers in Al Aqsa. When did I deny?

I am asking you, why did Israel soldier raid Al Aqsa, if not because of being provocated by Hamas? You didn't answer this, but keep denying. You are in denial.

The Israeli Foreign Ministry said Monday’s incident was the “direct result of incitement by Palestinian terror groups”.

Explained: Behind the clashes at Jerusalem’s Al-Aqsa

What is the significance of the mosque and its location, and why has it become the site of clashes between Israeli forces and Palestinians over the last one week?

indianexpress.com

Why can't you blame them if they attacked Palestine? how did 250 people die including 64 children if they weren't attacked? what kind of logic is that?
See you always start from the middle because you have no counter argument for what these Zionists did at Al Aqsa. You talk about self defense, then lets give same weapons to Palestinians and see who wins this fight. You have to be a child to believe that a professional army with weapons, tanks and jets is not massacring innocents who have nowhere to hide because their homes are being bombed.

You should blame Hamas for their terror activity.

Why Israel should sit iddle when they were attacked by terrorist Hamas?

No USA won't attack you back if you are Israel because Zionists attacked US ship in 1967 war and nobody ever asked them a question. This terror state also attacks other states with impunity and has attacked Iran many times. I think its time for Iran to defend themselves now.

Give me one example when US sit idle when they were being attacked.

its already lawless state because International norms and laws don't apply there, if they did then Israel would have been wiped off the map by International forces. Palestinians have been dehumanized already.

You are talking about Hamas, and PAlestine intifada.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Why so ignorant ignoring all my post?
Please look @my post :
#54

im busy, i dont get much free time to reply to you everyday. its weekend, so i won't be available because i have some plans, now i will get back to you on Monday.

 

[antonius123]

im busy, i dont get much free time to reply to you everyday. its weekend, so i won't be available because i have some plans, now i will get back to you on Monday.

No worries. Take your time, we will discuss slowly; the most important things is fact and citation.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Please look @my post :
#54

GAZA (Reuters) - Amnesty International said in a report on Wednesday that Gaza’s dominant Islamist Hamas committed war crimes against Palestinian civilians in the territory alleged to have collaborated with the enemy during last year’s war with Israel.

Bro. you only read the title and forgot to read the full article? This first sentence clearly says that people who collaborated with Israel were targeted by Hamas. All i would like to say is that If Israel has the right to defend itself from traitors then so do the Palestinians. Any country in the world would jail or hang traitors. Remember Hamas is Gaza's elected government.


Slideshow ( 2 images )
A ceasefire last August ended 50 days of fighting between Gaza militants and Israel in which health officials said more than 2,100 Palestinians, mostly civilians, were killed. Israel put the number of its dead at 67 soldiers and six civilians.

This is the reason why i call this genocide, look at the difference between deaths of Palestinian civilians vs Israeli civilians. One side has world class military and hardware and other side has homemade rockets, its a freakin genocide.

“Hamas forces carried out a brutal campaign of abductions, torture and unlawful killings against Palestinians accused of ‘collaborating’ with Israel and others during Israel’s military offensive against Gaza,” London-based Amnesty’s report said.

Just like i mentioned above, they captured people who they thought were traitors. Any country would do that honestly, but interesting point if that Hamas denied it.

A statement by Hamas denied involvement in the actions described by Amnesty, saying that rival Gaza families had taken part in “revenge attacks”.

Earlier, a Hamas spokesman criticized the report as being unfair, unprofessional and not credible.


“The report is dedicated against Palestinian resistance (to Israel) and the Hamas movement ... It deliberately exaggerated its descriptions without listening to all sides and without making an effort to check the truthfulness of details and information,” said Fawzi Barhoum, a Hamas spokesman.

Hamas even claims that they weren't given a chance to tell their point of view.

In an earlier report in March, Amnesty criticized Israel and accused it of war crimes during the conflict. Israel said the report showed “extreme bias”, had dismissed its security challenges and had ignored Hamas’s actions.

See, Israel accused of War Crimes too, and its more believable because they have a powerful military with best weapons the money can buy.

Apart from the many deaths in the war, at least 16,245 homes were destroyed or rendered uninhabitable by Israeli shelling and air strikes. Gaza militants fired thousands of rockets and mortar bombs into Israel.

Clearly, this is a war crime, i don't need to say a word more.

In Wednesday’s report, Amnesty listed a number of cases it described as “spine-chilling” in which Palestinians accused by Hamas of helping Israel were tortured and killed.

same as above, traitors according to them.


“The de facto Hamas administration granted its security forces free rein to carry out horrific abuses including against people in its custody. These spine-chilling actions, some of which amount to war crimes, were designed to exact revenge and spread fear across the Gaza Strip,” the Amnesty report said.

Same as above.

Hamas dominates the Gaza Strip, a densely populated desert enclave on the Mediterranean which borders Israel and Egypt.

The Palestinians joined the International Criminal Court after the war, a move opposed by Israel, and the ICC is now examining possible war crimes in the conflict. But joining the court also exposes Palestinians to possible prosecution if a case is opened.
"

This is also interesting, Palestinians are confident about their case and agreed to join Criminal Court, but the Israelis refused. this clearly means Israelis knows the atrocities they inflicted on the Palestinians.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

The Israeli Foreign Ministry said Monday’s incident was the “direct result of incitement by Palestinian terror groups”.

Explained: Behind the clashes at Jerusalem’s Al-Aqsa

What is the significance of the mosque and its location, and why has it become the site of clashes between Israeli forces and Palestinians over the last one week?

indianexpress.com

First of all LOL, indianexpress really? but okay no problem.

Here is a paragraph from the same article you posted.

"On the last Friday of Ramzan last week, more than 150 people were injured when Israeli forces broke up a massive gathering of Palestinian worshippers who had gathered to pray at the mosque, revered as Islam’s third holiest site. There were more clashes in the area over the weekend. The stand-off came at the end of a week of tensions over the eviction of Palestinian residents from two neighbourhoods of East Jerusalem, Sheikh Jarrah and Silwan, to make way for Jewish settlers."

I never deny Israel attacked worshippers in Al Aqsa. When did I deny?

I am asking you, why did Israel soldier raid Al Aqsa, if not because of being provocated by Hamas? You didn't answer this, but keep denying. You are in denial.

They didn't raid Al Aqsa because of Hamas, they raided the mosque because of the political game that was going on in Israel, Netanyahu always attacks Palestine when hes in trouble. Same with India's Modi, he always blames Pakistan when opposition gives him hard time.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

You should blame Hamas for their terror activity.

Why Israel should sit iddle when they were attacked by terrorist Hamas?

you are spreading misinformation dude, Netanyahu attacked Palestine to save his government, Hamas is basically a scarecrow created by Israel to unite their people and justify genocide of Palestinians.

Give me one example when US sit idle when they were being attacked.

USS Liberty incident - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Iran also recently attacked their bases in Iraq, you must remember that.

You are talking about Hamas, and PAlestine intifada.

I am talking about Palestine, Hamas or not, its a lawless land because WORLD Does not give a F about it. Israel used white phosphorus there and world just sat silent, just imagine if any other country did that?

 

[Falcon29]

Using human shield, terrorizing their own people, and attacking civilian is the most moral army?

UN report outlines how Hamas used kids as human shields

The headlines in most places were entirely predictable: “UN Says Israel Killed 44 Palestinians in Schools During Gaza War.” That was indeed one finding of a UN report published Monday — but only pa…

nypost.com

Amnesty International: Hamas committed war crimes against Gaza civilians

Amnesty International said in a report on Wednesday that Gaza's dominant Islamist Hamas committed war crimes against Palestinian civilians in the territory alleged to have collaborated with the enemy during last year's war with Israel.

www.reuters.com

There is no such thing as human shields, no one even attempts such smear except Israel. No such thing exists. Your first article is twisting UN report to suit NyPost agenda which is very pro-Israel. Second article is about collaborators. Once again, Hamas is the most moral army in the world. Never kills captives or abuses them. Never committed crime of rape against enemy civilians or soldiers. Never ever. Find me one example.

I never deny Israel attacked worshippers in Al Aqsa. When did I deny?

I am asking you, why did Israel soldier raid Al Aqsa, if not because of being provocated by Hamas? You didn't answer this, but keep denying. You are in denial.

You know Hamas is not based in West Bank, it is governing Gaza Strip only. How are you blaming Hamas then? Israel is in total control of Jerusalem. They allowed their settler right wing extremists to raid Al-Aqsa mosque and attack the worshippers there. Which led to clashes. After they murdered Palestinians and attempted evicting Palestinians from Shiekh Jarrah, is when Hamas took it upon themselves to intervene.

 

[antonius123]

First of all LOL, indianexpress really? but okay no problem.

Here is a paragraph from the same article you posted.

"On the last Friday of Ramzan last week, more than 150 people were injured when Israeli forces broke up a massive gathering of Palestinian worshippers who had gathered to pray at the mosque, revered as Islam’s third holiest site. There were more clashes in the area over the weekend. The stand-off came at the end of a week of tensions over the eviction of Palestinian residents from two neighbourhoods of East Jerusalem, Sheikh Jarrah and Silwan, to make way for Jewish settlers."

So? The 150 people injured is because of clash between Palestinian in the mosque and Israel force.

you are spreading misinformation dude, Netanyahu attacked Palestine to save his government, Hamas is basically a scarecrow created by Israel to unite their people and justify genocide of Palestinians.

That is just your assumption/accusation. No evidence.

I have given evidence that Hamas attack Israel first above.

They didn't raid Al Aqsa because of Hamas, they raided the mosque because of the political game that was going on in Israel, Netanyahu always attacks Palestine when hes in trouble. Same with India's Modi, he always blames Pakistan when opposition gives him hard time.

LOL. You are contradicting yourself. Above you admit the news now you deny it. What a cherry picking / selective reading

USS Liberty incident - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Iran also recently attacked their bases in Iraq, you must remember that.

Cant you read it? It was an incident.

I am talking about Palestine, Hamas or not, its a lawless land because WORLD Does not give a F about it. Israel used white phosphorus there and world just sat silent, just imagine if any other country did that?

You are talking about Palestine, not Israel.

 

[antonius123]

There is no such thing as human shields, no one even attempts such smear except Israel. No such thing exists. Your first article is twisting UN report to suit NyPost agenda which is very pro-Israel. Second article is about collaborators. Once again, Hamas is the most moral army in the world. Never kills captives or abuses them. Never committed crime of rape against enemy civilians or soldiers. Never ever. Find me one example.

Explain which UN report that you mean, and how I twisted it.
It seems you are in denial

You know Hamas is not based in West Bank, it is governing Gaza Strip only. How are you blaming Hamas then? Israel is in total control of Jerusalem. They allowed their settler right wing extremists to raid Al-Aqsa mosque and attack the worshippers there. Which led to clashes. After they murdered Palestinians and attempted evicting Palestinians from Shiekh Jarrah, is when Hamas took it upon themselves to intervene.

LOL.

So you are saying Hamas members cannot travel?

 

[antonius123]

GAZA (Reuters) - Amnesty International said in a report on Wednesday that Gaza’s dominant Islamist Hamas committed war crimes against Palestinian civilians in the territory alleged to have collaborated with the enemy during last year’s war with Israel.

Bro. you only read the title and forgot to read the full article? This first sentence clearly says that people who collaborated with Israel were targeted by Hamas. All i would like to say is that If Israel has the right to defend itself from traitors then so do the Palestinians. Any country in the world would jail or hang traitors. Remember Hamas is Gaza's elected government.

Whatever reason you explain to justify Hamas killing Palestinian civilians, it violate humanity.
No, there is no evidence Israel kill their own people for being alleged to cooperate with enemy.

Slideshow ( 2 images )
A ceasefire last August ended 50 days of fighting between Gaza militants and Israel in which health officials said more than 2,100 Palestinians, mostly civilians, were killed. Israel put the number of its dead at 67 soldiers and six civilians.

This is the reason why i call this genocide, look at the difference between deaths of Palestinian civilians vs Israeli civilians. One side has world class military and hardware and other side has homemade rockets, its a freakin genocide.

The article already explain.
If Hamas did not use human shield by hiding in civilian facilities (school, hospital, mosque, etc), the tolls on civilian would be minimized.

“Hamas forces carried out a brutal campaign of abductions, torture and unlawful killings against Palestinians accused of ‘collaborating’ with Israel and others during Israel’s military offensive against Gaza,” London-based Amnesty’s report said.

Just like i mentioned above, they captured people who they thought were traitors. Any country would do that honestly, but interesting point if that Hamas denied it.

No. Most countries will treat the suspect (as traitors) according to law, not just unlawful killings. Thats why I said above: you were actually talking about Palestine and Hamas when saying Israel is lawless.

A statement by Hamas denied involvement in the actions described by Amnesty, saying that rival Gaza families had taken part in “revenge attacks”.

Earlier, a Hamas spokesman criticized the report as being unfair, unprofessional and not credible.


“The report is dedicated against Palestinian resistance (to Israel) and the Hamas movement ... It deliberately exaggerated its descriptions without listening to all sides and without making an effort to check the truthfulness of details and information,” said Fawzi Barhoum, a Hamas spokesman.

Hamas even claims that they weren't given a chance to tell their point of view.

Claim without evidence is worthless.

In an earlier report in March, Amnesty criticized Israel and accused it of war crimes during the conflict. Israel said the report showed “extreme bias”, had dismissed its security challenges and had ignored Hamas’s actions.

See, Israel accused of War Crimes too, and its more believable because they have a powerful military with best weapons the money can buy.

Thats why I said both are not innocent.
But at least Israel doesnt target civilian deliberately like Hamas.

Apart from the many deaths in the war, at least 16,245 homes were destroyed or rendered uninhabitable by Israeli shelling and air strikes. Gaza militants fired thousands of rockets and mortar bombs into Israel.

Clearly, this is a war crime, i don't need to say a word more.

You can't complain and accuse Israel did war crime, when Hamas was provocating and attacking Israel civilian first. Israel has right to self defense and did her best effort to minimize civilian tolls. The civilian tolls is high on Palestine side due to Hamas way of war (using human shield, and hiding behind civilian).

Hamas dominates the Gaza Strip, a densely populated desert enclave on the Mediterranean which borders Israel and Egypt.

The Palestinians joined the International Criminal Court after the war, a move opposed by Israel, and the ICC is now examining possible war crimes in the conflict. But joining the court also exposes Palestinians to possible prosecution if a case is opened.
"

This is also interesting, Palestinians are confident about their case and agreed to join Criminal Court, but the Israelis refused. this clearly means Israelis knows the atrocities they inflicted on the Palestinians.

LOL. The article doesnt say Israel refuse joining ICC, but saying Israel opposed Palestinian joining ICC instead. Your reading comprehension faulty.

 

[Falcon29]

Explain which UN report that you mean, and how I twisted it.
It seems you are in denial

Not in denial, the exact report in NyPost. NyPost is twisting it, not you.

LOL.

So you are saying Hamas members cannot travel?

No one allowed to travel outside Gaza or into West Bank without Israeli approval. Do more research on this subject friend.

 

[Falcon29]

Mr Falcon , do u know according to the Wahhabist jurisdiction it's haram to have pictures of girls as ur profile picture ?

No such thing as Wahabi or Wahabi jurisdiction. I am Sunni Muslim who follow Shafi'a madhab. It's nice to know you are sectarian that allowing hatred to eat him up alive. And it's nice to know I committed a crime by posting picture while you live in apartment with your girlfriend. You are just delusional loser full of hate, and zero confidence. Someone with confidence don't go chasing around another member on forum. Only because you have uncertainties about what you perceive to be the truth. Someone certain about himself and his perceived truth don't need to act depraved and vile to reaffirm his own own beliefs.

I, unlike you, know the truth, and am confident in it. And confident in my relationship with my Lord, and confident in his sovereignty over the Universe, and the affairs of this world. You are just emotionally invested in your man-made agenda/ideology which is tied to one country. Not to God, this is why truth will never be revealed or inspired to you....

 

[Respect4Respect01]

So? The 150 people injured is because of clash between Palestinian in the mosque and Israel force.

no, they attacked the worshippers during the last week of Ramadan. Attack on innocent civilians is not a clash. Don't twist the fact to suite your narrative.

Palestinians recount violent raid by Israeli forces on Al-Aqsa

Monday was the most violent crackdown yet on Palestinians marking the holy month of Ramadan.

www.aljazeera.com

That is just your assumption/accusation. No evidence.

I have given evidence that Hamas attack Israel first above.

you gave no evidence, i completely refuted your claims. Netanyahu always played this trick whenever he was in trouble. The matter of the fact is all their leadership is full of extremists who don't consider Palestinians as equal human beings/

 

[Respect4Respect01]

LOL. You are contradicting yourself. Above you admit the news now you deny it. What a cherry picking / selective reading

no you need to read my posts again, Hamas is only a resistance group and they will keep resisting until Israelis don't stop this occupation and genocide. But its also a fact that Netanyahu attacked Gaza to save himself but that still didn't work out this time. In return for the first time in history Hamas gave them a bloody nose. Image of Strong and Powerful Israel was shattered this time.

Cant you read it? It was an incident.

no you need to go check the dictionary again, Accident and Incident are not the same words. Incident means event

"
-an individual occurrence or event.
-a distinct piece of action, or an episode, as in a story or play.
-something that occurs casually in connection with something else.
-something appertaining or attaching to something else.
''

Here is a definition of "incident" from https://www.dictionary.com/browse/incident