Indonesia favouring China over Japan in railway bid - government sources

[Beidou2020]

Big congratulations to @TaiShang for getting to 8,000 posts and thus becoming an elite member.

 

[pr1v4t33r]

"The high speed railway has fostered a lot of economic opportunities 3.59 like the real estate, like the logistic, like the tourists. Like the job opps also, from different kinds. 4.10 manufacturing, civil works, etc. So the macro view for the high speed trains, will be prosperous not for railway itself but for the communities. 4.26,” Yang Yong with China Railway International said.

The economic potential is huge. We are trying to connect the biggest city in Indonesia with the 2nd and the 3rd here. So the market and demand is there. Just need a little push for the investors to take up the challenge and take over the projects. I can smell the profits already...

It's not that risky at all my brother, Japan has shown He is able to invest in venture capitalist infrastructure projects in the region ; in the Philippines with the JICA inspired funding of various regional airports in as well as train rail upgrades from Manila to Cebu to Davao to Sultan Kudarat! In Thailand we have poured close to $2 Billion to fund the railway linking Krungthep to Chiang Mai. In Burma , Japan is prepared to write $5 billion in the construction of Dawei Port Project , in Bangladesh Japan is vested $2 Billion for the deep seaport that will connect Chittagong , Dakha, and the rest of the upper country. In Vietnam, we have poured over $35 billion in infrastructure projects . Indonesia is one of our largest trading partners in ASEAN, and home to large scale Japanese manufacturing , so please understand that Japan will accommodate Indonesia's sensitivities, as we have always done in our long and fraternal relations. I am optimistic.

Japan would have to drop the requirement for Government state budget guarantee to remain competitive in this project. Jokowi has stated that this project would be handled as 100% B2B.

 

[Keel]

i myself prefer shinkansen over cina, for the safety reason. The Japanese took three-and-a-half years to complete the feasibility study before the Chinese joined in the bid.

I dont think it is correct to say the length of feasibilty studies is a factor for downplaying China's expertise nor an indication of lack of safety in China's proposal

China has built up the greatest wealth of experience in constructing like kind railways within China and around the world. The projects have covered literally all kinds of terrains, variations in temperature etc

I cannot think of another country which has similar wealth of expertise lke China has in the recent decade. And our safety record is among the best

On the contrary, countries which are not as experienced as China require longer time to study unfamilar projects

 

[MarveL]

I dont think it is correct to say the length of feasibilty studies is a factor for downplaying China's expertise nor an indication of lack of safety in China's proposal

For safety, the Shinkansen has a spotless record while the CRH has had one major crash, with 40 casualties. cmiiw.

 

[Beast]

For safety, the Shinkansen has a spotless record while the CRH has had one major crash, with 40 casualties. cmiiw.

This still doesnt tarnish the fact, China is fore leader in HSR. China has longer track to handle, few hundred million user per day compare to Japan lesser ridership. China one day operating of HSR is equivalent to Japan a week operation usage.

EU HSR too have accident before. Does that means EU is inferior?

 

[dy1022]

For safety, the Shinkansen has a spotless record while the CRH has had one major crash, with 40 casualties. cmiiw.

JR FukuchiyamaLine in 2005, 107 people died! 562 injured!

Shinkansen No.14 稻穗 in 2005, 4 people died!

I can go on, if you like!

 

[Keel]

List of rail accidents (2010–present)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rail_accidents_(2010–present)

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/24/b...crash-rail-system-has-good-safety-record.html

Enough said!

 

[Daniel808]

For safety, the Shinkansen has a spotless record while the CRH has had one major crash, with 40 casualties. cmiiw.

Shinkansen has a spotless record for safety?

Where do you get that Information?
From Indonesian Stupid Newspaper in here?
Comic Books, or Hentai Books you read !

Lol. Pathetic.

 

[Indos]

Jokowi has read my previous post in PDF....

It is not a good thing in economic term to link Jakarta and Bandung with this huge investment cost where it only take 2 hours using cars and buses by existing toll road

 

[Aepsilons]

Jokowi has read my previous post in PDF....

It is not a good thing in economic term to link Jakarta and Bandung with this huge investment cost where it only take 2 hours using cars and buses by existing toll road

That's a pertinent point to consider , too, bro. I think $5 billion from Japan can and should be used to build and update Indonesia's vast ports throughout the archipelago. Not only that, Japan can help Indonesia qualitatively improve her expressways, and bridges, which would be applicable to the average Indonesian Citizen.

 

[Indos]

That's a pertinent point to consider , too, bro. I think $5 billion from Japan can and should be used to build and update Indonesia's vast ports throughout the archipelago. Not only that, Japan can help Indonesia qualitatively improve her expressways, and bridges, which would be applicable to the average Indonesian Citizen.

I believe we should instead link Sumatra and Java by long bridge that has the relatively similar cost.

 

[Aepsilons]

I believe we should instead link Sumatra and Java by long bridge that has the relatively similar cost.

I agree. Java is heavily developed, as it should be considering that is where the bulk of the population is. However, the largest island in Indonesia -- Sumatra -- is heavily underdeveloped and should be prioritized. Secondly, there should be a policy of population redistribution from Java to Sumatra, and I think development of Sumatra will aid in this.

There is A LOT of money to be made in developing Sumatra. ALOT.

 

[Nike]

Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation

Jakarta. Bids were expected from China and Japan for a medium-speed rail project in Indonesia that will be 40 percent cheaper than the $6 billion bullet train project that the government scrapped last week, a minister said in an interview on Sunday.

China and Japan were disappointed by the cancellation of the high-speed rail project, announced by the government on Friday, but could renew rivalries to build the medium-speed rail link between the capital Jakarta and the third-largest city, Bandung.

"Both China and Japan are still interested in the medium-speed train," Coordinating Minister for Maritime Affairs, Rizal Ramli, told Reuters.

"Indonesia is just the first battlefield between China and Japan," Rizal said, adding, "there are other countries that would be interested in similar projects so the stakes are high."

A Japanese embassy official in Jakarta said the Japanese government would not be bidding, but that Indonesia had invited private Japanese companies to participate.

State Enterprises Minister Rini Soemarno said on Friday that Japanese requests for government guarantees and government loans for state-owned enterprises were too burdensome for Indonesia, and had not been sought by China.

"If Japan wants to stay in the process they must get rid of the requirement for government guarantees and government loans to SOEs," said Rini, who has been tasked by President Joko Widodo with choosing the winner.

Rini said Indonesia hopes to start construction on the 150-kilometer Jakarta-Bandung line by the year-end.

While the high speed line between Jakarta and Bandung had been deemed unviable, Ramli said the government would consider proposals over the next one or two years for a bullet train on a 700-kilometer line crossing Java.

Reuters
Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation | Jakarta Globe

 

[Place Of Space]

Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation

Jakarta. Bids were expected from China and Japan for a medium-speed rail project in Indonesia that will be 40 percent cheaper than the $6 billion bullet train project that the government scrapped last week, a minister said in an interview on Sunday.

China and Japan were disappointed by the cancellation of the high-speed rail project, announced by the government on Friday, but could renew rivalries to build the medium-speed rail link between the capital Jakarta and the third-largest city, Bandung.

"Both China and Japan are still interested in the medium-speed train," Coordinating Minister for Maritime Affairs, Rizal Ramli, told Reuters.

"Indonesia is just the first battlefield between China and Japan," Rizal said, adding, "there are other countries that would be interested in similar projects so the stakes are high."

A Japanese embassy official in Jakarta said the Japanese government would not be bidding, but that Indonesia had invited private Japanese companies to participate.

State Enterprises Minister Rini Soemarno said on Friday that Japanese requests for government guarantees and government loans for state-owned enterprises were too burdensome for Indonesia, and had not been sought by China.

"If Japan wants to stay in the process they must get rid of the requirement for government guarantees and government loans to SOEs," said Rini, who has been tasked by President Joko Widodo with choosing the winner.

Rini said Indonesia hopes to start construction on the 150-kilometer Jakarta-Bandung line by the year-end.

While the high speed line between Jakarta and Bandung had been deemed unviable, Ramli said the government would consider proposals over the next one or two years for a bullet train on a 700-kilometer line crossing Java.

Reuters
Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation | Jakarta Globe

His consideration is very reasonable.
1. Between city-city rail within 200 kilometer, it's better to build medium-speed railway. Cost-performance is higher.
2. If linking the whole nation, potentially nearby Java and Sumatra, from Medan, Jakarta to Surabaya, it's better to build high-speed railway net.

 

[prima99]

Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation

Jakarta. Bids were expected from China and Japan for a medium-speed rail project in Indonesia that will be 40 percent cheaper than the $6 billion bullet train project that the government scrapped last week, a minister said in an interview on Sunday.

China and Japan were disappointed by the cancellation of the high-speed rail project, announced by the government on Friday, but could renew rivalries to build the medium-speed rail link between the capital Jakarta and the third-largest city, Bandung.

"Both China and Japan are still interested in the medium-speed train," Coordinating Minister for Maritime Affairs, Rizal Ramli, told Reuters.

"Indonesia is just the first battlefield between China and Japan," Rizal said, adding, "there are other countries that would be interested in similar projects so the stakes are high."

A Japanese embassy official in Jakarta said the Japanese government would not be bidding, but that Indonesia had invited private Japanese companies to participate.

State Enterprises Minister Rini Soemarno said on Friday that Japanese requests for government guarantees and government loans for state-owned enterprises were too burdensome for Indonesia, and had not been sought by China.

"If Japan wants to stay in the process they must get rid of the requirement for government guarantees and government loans to SOEs," said Rini, who has been tasked by President Joko Widodo with choosing the winner.

Rini said Indonesia hopes to start construction on the 150-kilometer Jakarta-Bandung line by the year-end.

While the high speed line between Jakarta and Bandung had been deemed unviable, Ramli said the government would consider proposals over the next one or two years for a bullet train on a 700-kilometer line crossing Java.

Reuters
Ministers Expect Bids for Medium-Speed Rail Project From China and Japan — Despite Last Minute Cancellation | Jakarta Globe

it looks like Japan won't bid much in the second round of this competition. it'll be cake walk for China though as their previous proposal were favored by the Govt. they simply needs to modify the price to be 40% cheaper and they'll win the competition. no worries about other competitiors. france were rumored to join the HSR competition before, but in the end they can't.