India's Super Sukhoi's will technologically out-match China's latest Su-35 jets

[#hydra#]

Now you are talking here and there, WHY dont china induct J10 and give confidence to pakistan. (May be you sell chowmin in china. )

Year,j10 is plaaf's f16.... They are having plenty in theirs force and for your kind information PAF doesn't operates a single j10(Atleat officially)

Point is. You have to Import and set up spare parts factory even after a decade. They( chinese) make their own jet and dont rely on importing during war. You will be waiting for replacement while they will be churning stuff out of factory and pounding the shit out of ya.

The world war era has gone long back my friend,you can't mass produce high end stuffs for fighters in war time, which last maximum a week to two months. You need to stock pile spare for better availability rate with trained ground crew,no matter you produce it by yourself or importing stuffs from outside. You need to stock pile spares in peace time,no other way. The advantage of making in house is you will save a lot of taxpayers money,you will be having better engineering environment for future projects and sanction proof scenarios.

 

[Chanakyaa]

Point is. You have to Import and set up spare parts factory even after a decade. They( chinese) make their own jet and dont rely on importing during war. You will be waiting for replacement while they will be churning stuff out of factory and pounding the shit out of ya.

For Su 35s ? Su 30 MKKs ?

Besides, India too I "Churning Out" Su 30 MKI and LCA Tejas from "RAW" state.
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/15..._2015_16_From_Raw_Material_Phase#.WM_bNGvhWpo

Stop riding on China's back atleast when comparing a Defence Topic. This is Pakistan Defence Forum, Primarily for Pakistan" Defence.

 

[salarsikander]

For Su 35s ? Su 30 MKKs ?

Besides, India too I "Churning Out" Su 30 MKI and LCA Tejas from "RAW" state.
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/15..._2015_16_From_Raw_Material_Phase#.WM_bNGvhWpo

Stop riding on China's back atleast when comparing a Defence Topic. This is Pakistan Defence Forum, Primarily for Pakistan" Defence.

Oh silly Indians. You have to import Stuff for TEJAS critical components without which your tejas can only be led by a trailer as in republic days. As for MKI again critical compo are imported and the integrated. Those chinese have their own series of jet. Do not compare them with you.

As for your apparent jealousy which you cant digest. This is an international Pakistan forum, I m using logic here not bashing india unnecessarily.
SEcond, Do not dare to tell me what to do. Indian !

 

[Chanakyaa]

Oh silly Indians. You have to import Stuff for TEJAS critical components without which your tejas can only be led by a trailer as in republic days. As for MKI again critical compo are imported and the integrated. Those chinese have their own series of jet. Do not compare them with you.

As for your apparent jealousy which you cant digest. This is an international Pakistan forum, I m using logic here not bashing india unnecessarily.
SEcond, Do not dare to tell me what to do. Indian !

Sikandar Mia,

Your perceptions dont change the Reality. You see lies cannot defened the Ground Reality.
And Lies also ruin a healthy debate.

Now some of your lies :

#1. You have to import Stuff for TEJAS critical components without which your tejas can only be led by a trailer as in republic days.

Well, The same applies to JF17 .. no ? and the J11s since all of them have no "Reliable" Pakistani or Chinese Engine.

#2. As for MKI again critical compo are imported and the integrated.

Ans : No.. You are Mistaken. We are Making 100% MKI even the Engines ( with ToT and license to manufacture ) Plz not im NOT syaing Russian have given us the Blueprints.

As for your apparent jealousy which you cant digest. This is an international Pakistan forum, I m using logic here not bashing india unnecessarily.
SEcond, Do not dare to tell me what to do. Indian !

There is NO logic behind this. Logically, would have noticed that your own F16s and Jf17 and literally any jet has that vulnarability of missing spares !

 

[salarsikander]

Sikandar Mia,

Your perceptions dont change the Reality. You see lies cannot defened the Ground Reality.
And Lies also ruin a healthy debate.

Now some of your lies :

#1. You have to import Stuff for TEJAS critical components without which your tejas can only be led by a trailer as in republic days.

Well, The same applies to JF17 .. no ? and the J11s since all of them have no "Reliable" Pakistani or Chinese Engine.

#2. As for MKI again critical compo are imported and the integrated.

Ans : No.. You are Mistaken. We are Making 100% MKI even the Engines ( with ToT and license to manufacture ) Plz not im NOT syaing Russian have given us the Blueprints.



There is NO logic behind this. Logically, would have noticed that your own F16s and Jf17 and literally any jet has that vulnarability of missing spares !

Bullshit. And such a tall bulshhit from Inian. It was expected. If Everything is made in India for mki ? Are avioncs made in ndia ? or radar for that matter or engine ?
I wonder why india are begiing to set up Spare facility In India. yet according to you everything is Indian made. I can shame you literally. Please show me one single auntheitc source which says that even engine is under TOT and everything ok MKI is 100% desi origin.

LOL, but Jf-17 is joint venture my little one.

Can you deny that Tejas seat is imported, its radar, Its engine, can you ?

 

[Chanakyaa]

Bullshit. And such a tall bulshhit from Inian. It was expected. If Everything is made in India for mki ? Are avioncs made in ndia ? or radar for that matter or engine ?
I wonder why india are begiing to set up Spare facility In India. yet according to you everything is Indian made. I can shame you literally. Please show me one single auntheitc source which says that even engine is under TOT and everything ok MKI is 100% desi origin.

LOL, but Jf-17 is joint venture my little one.

Can you deny that Tejas seat is imported, its radar, Its engine, can you ?

Calm down. You are shifting the entire focus of the discussion.

Firstly, I was simply replying how All the Jets including MKI / JF17 o / LVA and F16s have the same fate when it comes to spares.

Secondly,
It seems your information is outdated. MKI is now 100% produced in India. The MKI production was in Fiur Phases and we have finally reached the Fourth Phase since 2015.

Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) said Tuesday that it has produced 12 Su-30 MKI aircraft from raw material phase during the fiscal year 2015-16.

Stating that the company’s turnover has surged to INR 16524 crores for the year 2015-2016, T. Suvarna Raju, CMD, HAL said production of 17 Hawk aircraft is also the highest ever achieved in a year.

The production highlights of the said year include 60 new aircraft and helicopters, overhauling of 229 aircraft and helicopters, 94 new engines, 446 engines overhauled and supply of 143 aerospace structures.

On ‘Make in India’ front 2021 items were indigenized which will result in FE savings of INR 126 crores annually. More than 300 imported systems and sub-systems have been hosted on HAL’s website (Make in India section) to enable private industries to take up indigenization.

HAL has manufactured parts of Su-30MKIs from the raw material stage with complete transfer of technology from IRKUT Corporation under Phase IV of the assembly. Nashik facility of the firm is domestically manufacturing over 31,500 components that are integrated into the fighter jet, in addition partially indigenizing its AL-31FP engines, which are built in Koraput, Odisha, India.

The only exception are a few parts, from Russia & other countries. For instance, the engines, some avionics (like IRST, Radar, etc.), parts of airframe (alloys - Titanium), etc. - they come from Russia. Some avionics like the HUD, ECMs, Targeting pods, etc. come from Israel.

 

[salarsikander]

Calm down. You are shifting the entire focus of the discussion.

Firstly, I was simply replying how All the Jets including MKI / JF17 o / LVA and F16s have the same fate when it comes to spares.

Secondly,
It seems your information is outdated. MKI is now 100% produced in India. The MKI production was in Fiur Phases and we have finally reached the Fourth Phase since 2015.


HAL has manufactured parts of Su-30MKIs from the raw material stage with complete transfer of technology from IRKUT Corporation under Phase IV of the assembly. Nashik facility of the firm is domestically manufacturing over 31,500 components that are integrated into the fighter jet, in addition partially indigenizing its AL-31FP engines, which are built in Koraput, Odisha, India.

The only exception are a few parts, from Russia & other countries. For instance, the engines, some avionics (like IRST, Radar, etc.), parts of airframe (alloys - Titanium), etc. - they come from Russia. Some avionics like the HUD, ECMs, Targeting pods, etc. come from Israel.

And yet still They have poor reliability record because of NON AVAILABILITY OF SPARE FROM russia. LOL

 

[Chanakyaa]

And yet still They have poor reliability record because of NON AVAILABILITY OF SPARE FROM russia. LOL

Well, im afraid you dont have the understanding of the term "Licensed Production" .

HInt : It doesnt mean you can produce Unlimited ! If you are making 10 Birds, you make everything 10 times needed for one bird. Nothing less and NOTHING more !

 

[ranadd]

And yet still They have poor reliability record because of NON AVAILABILITY OF SPARE FROM russia. LOL

1. Do you understand what is meant by Licensed production? If you want to make 1 more, you need to ask permission. Money needs to be transferred. Reason why Russians sell less to chinese now.

2. Again. India does not make 100% of the parts. There can be anything, from a small fitting to relay to engine blade that still comes from Russia.

3. Not even US makes 100% components for their planes now. But they are very much capable of, so is France. Russia a close third. China is not anywhere in this league. 5 maybe 10 years from now.

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

So you agree that SU MKI was better than, your fighter Jet inventory then that forced china to purchase SU 35 from russia. Super sukhoies ( 200 + ) with 5th Gen engines and radar plus western/Israili plus indian weapons would be a threat to 40 SU 35 ?
.

I didn't see the specs of both SU-35 and your so call super sukoi, so it's hard to judge but one thing you can be sure of is that Upgrade SU MKI require to dismantle old system and make modification to existing aircraft structure to accommodate new upgraded systems such avionic and radar, all the wiring have to be changed, it's an costly and delicate operations which it might end up as a Frankenstein fighter, on the other hand, SU-35 started brand new from the sketching board which everything are well planned ahead from avionic to bolt and nut...so compare a well planned SU-35 to an improvised bricolage of the super suckoi, SU-35 already has a good start regardless of the performance of the avionics and radar system.

Russia gave you Su 30 but you did not get anything in technology except design you can copy. Su 30 had 3D TW engine but still you bought Su 35. You just keep buying from russia.

Maybe on Indian SU-30 but not on Chinese SU-30 mkk, SU-35 will be a good reference for our J-11's family design improvement and of course it's China interest to keep the door open for any weapon supplier that we have been embargo for so long. China will buying only key components but we won't massively buy as India did.

 

[Super Commando Dhruva]

I didn't see the specs of both SU-35 and your so call super sukoi, so it's hard to judge but one thing you can be sure of is that Upgrade SU MKI require to dismantle old system and make modification to existing aircraft structure to accommodate new upgraded systems such avionic and radar, all the wiring have to be changed, it's an costly and delicate operations which it might end up as a Frankenstein fighter, on the other hand, SU-35 started brand new from the sketching board which everything are well planned ahead from avionic to bolt and nut...so compare a well planned SU-35 to an improvised bricolage of the super suckoi, SU-35 already has a good start regardless of the performance of the avionics and radar system.



Maybe on Indian SU-30 but not on Chinese SU-30 mkk, SU-35 will be a good reference for our J-11's family design improvement and of course it's China interest to keep the door open for any weapon supplier that we have been embargo for so long. China will buying only key components but we won't massively buy as India did.

Money is not an issue for India, the question is, do you think that SUPER sukhoie would have an edge over SU 35 ?

 

[IblinI]

Money is not an issue for India, the question is, do you think that SUPER sukhoie would have an edge over SU 35 ?

Old multi roll upgrade against air superiority with a new air frame and a new top level redesign, no.
But anyway, you have every right to say otherwise.

 

[Paranoid Android]

Hope the deal gets signed this year..

 

[Surya 1]

When Russia inducted Su 30 with MKI configuration inplace of Su 35, it became very much clear that Su 35 is no mathc to MKI forget about super sukhoi.

 

[帅的一匹]

1. Do you understand what is meant by Licensed production? If you want to make 1 more, you need to ask permission. Money needs to be transferred. Reason why Russians sell less to chinese now.

2. Again. India does not make 100% of the parts. There can be anything, from a small fitting to relay to engine blade that still comes from Russia.

3. Not even US makes 100% components for their planes now. But they are very much capable of, so is France. Russia a close third. China is not anywhere in this league. 5 maybe 10 years from now.

1. USA
2. Russia
3. EU
4.China
5. Japan

150?. India