‘Indians never knew Pakistan was so modern’

[guluchulo]

The connection - I don't know what the connection is...I was merely making small talk !

Its not as if the rest of the thread is anything but a cauldron laced with pious sentiments, jingoism & pseudo-empathy !

I don't even know what a Shiv Lingam is but it looked as if an oblong shaped stone was protruding from the ground with a broken coconut over it & the guide said that Hindus from Pakistan & pilgrims from India every year come to this place to pray to that Shiva Idol & cleanse themselves in the pond near it !

The Government signboards near it were saying the same thing & they did mention a British Archaeologist by the name of Sir Alexander Cunningham who discovered these Temples in the 1800s & the legend, as told by the Guide & those Signboards, revolved around Lord Shiva crying about something & his tears fell from the heavens & made these ponds !

I don't know how true or untrue it is but there was also a Hanuman Temple, a Buddhist Stumpa & a Haveli belonging to some notable that was excavated a few years ago from that site !

I just thought you might find it interesting - How was I supposed to know I'd be placed in interrogation providing evidence for whether it really was from 300 BC or not ?

Its a body part which is very small in Indians.

 

[livingdead]

See Hindu guy society is defined by people who are living in this society and i have no clue about thought process of every Pakistani individual to paint whole society as modern. The problem is modern people of my society don't get your or western attention that's why we are known only for opposite

I dont think you need to know every pakistani to decide what most of your country is about.. otherwise no possible assertion can ever be made about your society, as it is impossible to get such statistical data.
Let me approach it in another way, what are the major difference in mindset of people in UK and pakistan as per you. If your answer is UK society and pakistani society are too diverse in themselves and hence its hazardous to make such guess without knowing each and every british and pakistani.. you might not want to reply me.

 

[Joe Shearer]

this I presume happens in a tiny minority of household.
And by this parameter India is way too backward because most Indians will be mortified to confess that they drink any alcohol at all to their parents...

My father introduced me to beer when I was less than two. It's a different matter that even a sip would make me tiddly (my friends say it still does). When people came home to dinner, in later years, during my pre-teens and teens, I was the designated bartender, as my kid brother was useless at gauging a peg measure or a half-peg, and as I was considered a 'reliable' bartender; almost all the liquor ended up with the guests. My sister was only allowed wine, occasionally, as it was not considered ladylike for an unmarried girl to drink spirits. She is still an extreme moderate drinker, almost abstemious, but through personal choice. My wife, from a family that used to squeeze the liquor out of liqueur chocolates, never drank before, but now occasionally has a vodka and tonic. My daughter is a very balanced person with drink, knows what she likes, stays teetotal when she is designated driver, naturally, and generally very responsible.

On cigarette smoking, his stipulation was that I should not smoke in a hole-and-corner kind of way, the way many do in front of older people in Bengali society. He was quite let down as he found out that I did not smoke at all.

Takes all sorts.

Its a body part which is very small in Indians.

Stop tempting me.

 

[livingdead]

My father introduced me to beer when I was less than two. It's a different matter that even a sip would make me tiddly (my friends say it still does). When people came home to dinner, in later years, during my pre-teens and teens, I was the designated bartender, as my kid brother was useless at gauging a peg measure or a half-peg, and as I was considered a 'reliable' bartender; almost all the liquor ended up with the guests. My sister was only allowed wine, occasionally, as it was not considered ladylike for an unmarried girl to drink spirits. She is still an extreme moderate drinker, almost abstemious, but through personal choice. My wife, from a family that used to squeeze the liquor out of liqueur chocolates, never drank before, but now occasionally has a vodka and tonic. My daughter is a very balanced person with drink, knows what she likes, stays teetotal when she is designated driver, naturally, and generally very responsible.

On cigarette smoking, his stipulation was that I should not smoke in a hole-and-corner kind of way, the way many do in front of older people in Bengali society. He was quite let down as he found out that I did not smoke at all.

Takes all sorts.


Stop tempting me.

I would venture to say your case is not even 1 % of Indians... ( yes I got the number from a part of body that is very small in Indians and quite large in pakistanis.. but very reliable source... )

 

[Joe Shearer]

I would venture to say your case is not even 1 % of Indians... ( yes I got the number from a part of body that is very small in Indians and quite large in pakistanis.. but very reliable source... )

??

Most of my friends in Calcutta, when I made friends in Calcutta, fairly late in youth, had similar attitudes to drink and were similarly acculturated.

I think Bengal has a far more relaxed attitude towards drinking than other parts of the country. I always felt claustrophobic (except in Bombay, and, of late, in Bangalore) elsewhere in India. In Madras, in 1981, I had to go to a doctor, get him to certify me as a habitual and incurable drunk, and obtain a liquor permit. Coming out of Calcutta society, that was traumatic. Not so much that it stopped me from getting a permit. The only place in the whole state that insisted on seeing and using that permit was the Sangam Hotel in Trichy.

 

[livingdead]

??

Most of my friends in Calcutta, when I made friends in Calcutta, fairly late in youth, had similar attitudes to drink and were similarly acculturated.

I think Bengal has a far more relaxed attitude towards drinking than other parts of the country. I always felt claustrophobic (except in Bombay, and, of late, in Bangalore) elsewhere in India. In Madras, in 1981, I had to go to a doctor, get him to certify me as a habitual and incurable drunk, and obtain a liquor permit. Coming out of Calcutta society, that was traumatic. Not so much that it stopped me from getting a permit. The only place in the whole state that insisted on seeing and using that permit was the Sangam Hotel in Trichy.

May be. The last time I was in kol, it looked like liquor is rationed. I had to stand in a queue, the guy just took my money (they had iron grill like thing between me and shopkeeper) and just gave what I pointed at (as if he is doing a favour to me).
But thats govt, not society. I get that.

 

[Armstrong]

??

Most of my friends in Calcutta, when I made friends in Calcutta, fairly late in youth, had similar attitudes to drink and were similarly acculturated.

I think Bengal has a far more relaxed attitude towards drinking than other parts of the country. I always felt claustrophobic (except in Bombay, and, of late, in Bangalore) elsewhere in India. In Madras, in 1981, I had to go to a doctor, get him to certify me as a habitual and incurable drunk, and obtain a liquor permit. Coming out of Calcutta society, that was traumatic. Not so much that it stopped me from getting a permit. The only place in the whole state that insisted on seeing and using that permit was the Sangam Hotel in Trichy.

Have mercy on your Liver !

 

[Joe Shearer]

Have mercy on your Liver !

Oh, quite. I'm a mild drinker nowadays, the last time I had a lot was the SSP party to celebrate an old boy getting the Chief of Air Staff job. Usually it's a couple of small pegs, or a couple of brandies, or single malts, or perhaps half a bottle of wine. Maybe two or three times a week.

I'm a reformed person now.

May be. The last time I was in kol, it looked like liquor is rationed. I had to stand in a queue, the guy just took my money (they had iron grill like thing between me and shopkeeper) and just gave what I pointed at (as if he is doing a favour to me).
But thats govt, not society. I get that.

Horrid!

Try Ballygunge Wine Stores; they take cheques from me. Or just buy at Spencers; they stock spirits now.

Aren't we getting sidetracked a wee bit?

 

[wise_owl]

I doubt Pakistan is even close to being modern. Can women wear bikinis in your country? Do you have nightclubs and bars? Is alcohol widely available? We in Brazil have many problems but modernity is not one of them. In fact we have gone off on the other hand

There was a time when people not fully dressed were considered barbarians/ savages

now a modern girl

 

[Vinod2070]

I think more than the perceptions of outsiders, we first need to be able to have positive perceptions of our countries and culture and heritage.

Where is the need to depend on others for approval?

"Indians" know (or focus on) different things about Pakistan. Depends on the amount of exposure or interest.

Some know them from cricket, some from the support to the likes of LET and JEM, some from having had personal interactions, some from the trauma of partition, some from some Pakistani artists working in India, some from the TTP insurgency and so on.

 

[SQ8]

this I presume happens in a tiny minority of household.
And by this parameter India is way too backward because most Indians will be mortified to confess that they drink any alcohol at all to their parents...

Yes it does.. but it in a way tells you how society is struggling to find itself an identity and balance.
At one end you have fairly modern areas in cities and a balanced middle class open to ideas.. and on the other end you have people who are not prepared to administer polio drops to their underage wives.

All within the space of a 40km radius

 

[Joe Shearer]

I think more than the perceptions of outsiders, we first need to be able to have positive perceptions of our countries and culture and heritage.

Where is the need to depend on others for approval?

"Indians" know (or focus on) different things about Pakistan. Depends on the amount of exposure or interest.

Some know them from cricket, some from the support to the likes of LET and JEM, some from having had personal interactions, some from the trauma of partition, some from some Pakistani artists working in India, some from the TTP insurgency and so on.

What a horrible idea, @Vinod2070. How can we depend on a minority dominating society to determine how to assess their domination? Do you really need a lengthy explanation of why this is a bad idea?

 

[Vinod2070]

What a horrible idea, @Vinod2070. How can we depend on a minority dominating society to determine how to assess their domination? Do you really need a lengthy explanation of why this is a bad idea?

Sorry, I could not understand what you are trying to say here. You may want to write in simpler terms when you get some time.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sorry, I could not understand what you are trying to say here. You may want to write in simpler terms when you get some time.

It isn't good enough to pat yourself on the back.

You need to find out if others think you are doing as well as you think you are doing.

Simple enough?

 

[Jf Thunder]

General impression of Pakistanis is a big bearded man with an AK-47 in an ankle length shalwar kameez mouthing something about kafirs.

But then, these impressions will only change with more people to people contacts.

you just described me. how?