Indian Railways vs. Chinese Railways...

[AndrewJin]

dean of the college

Salute! My dad is a university teacher too but not high as a dean like you.

Faster travel will have an overall positive impact on economy with faster and easier movement of people and goods.

Regional Economic Impact Analysis of High Speed Rail in China

High-Speed Railways in China: A Look at Traffic

High-Speed Railways in China: A Look at Construction Costs

Metro in Delhi

I did search a lot of details about it, a great system! If more than 50% transportation of Delhi is metro, Delhi won't be ranked as the most polluted city in terms of PM2.5 any more!

a country of diversity

Yep, a country as large as India is of course diverse.
However, it has nothing to do with diverse viewpoints.
If one forces me to oppose HSR in India, I have tons of reasonable arguments rather than bringing up food on slow trains in India again and again. I am well informed of those opposition, serious evidence-based oppositions, as opposed to food.

India needs HSR to connect business hubs

the best way to move forward is to build HSR to connect business centers initially and target the business travellors, who are more than willing to pay high price in order to save time. Thats why we see the first feasibility study of HSR is done for Mumbai - Ahmadabad.

Exactly. First for business travels, and gradually general passengers will welcome it.
As the case Wuhan-Guangzhou HSR(one of the first HSR lines open in Dec 2009, from the biggest cities in Central China to the biggest cities in Southern China)
20 million passengers of 2010
34 million passengers of 2011
Just the first two years, it changes people's habit from airplane(2hours, 5000rupees-15000rupees) to HSR(4500 rupees/3-4hours), like a "disease" spreading from business commuters to the public. During the first year, it was fiercely criticised by media and airplane lobbyists. Anyway, the rapid increase in passenger volume proves itself.

If we start today, its estimated that it would take 10yrs to get HSR running on that route, by that time both our economy and our transportation need will easily help us to sustain the cost of HSR.

speed upto 200kms,

Some actions of Chinese railway from 1997-2007(six campaigns to raise the speed of railway travel, max. speed 250km/h)
1, upgrade to jointless tracks
2, signal system
3. crossings upgraded to flyovers
4. tunnels and shortcuts. (speed is about how straight a railway is)
5. innovation of locomotives
6. electrification
etc.

As of now ticket booking experience on irctc or at railway counter on opening day is bitter experience than traveling in train.

Don't you have ticket APP or automobile booking machines?

In China, if one buys an HSR ticket(using ID card) online or in APP, then only use ID card through check-in machines.

 

[AndrewJin]

@Indian Patriot
I have already settled down in Shanghai and before going out for snack food on the night market(now 10pm in China), I give u an excellent example of a TRANSPORTATION HUB.

Hongqiao Railway Station
Shanghai Hongqiao Railway Station, located in Minhang District of Shanghai, is a major part of the Hongqiao Comprehensive Transportation Hub (“the Hongqiao hub”). The station achieves a zero-distance transfer with the Terminal 2 of Shanghai Hongqiao International Airport, as well as Line 2 and Line 10 of Shanghai Metro.
Overview
The construction of the railway station began on July 20, 2008 with a total investment of more than CNY 15 billion ($2.3 billion). It was opened on July 1, 2010, simultaneously with the opening of the Shanghai–Nanjing High-Speed Railway line. The railway station takes a total area of about 1.3 million square meters and has 16 platforms, most of which are high-speed-rail configuration.[2] The main building of the train station measures 420 meters in length, 200 meters in width, and 70 meters high (counting both underground and overground floors). 80,000 tons of steel was used to construct the train station, twice the amount of steel used to build the Beijing National Stadium (Bird nest). The train station waiting hall area is more than 10,000 square meters (107,639 square ft), and is capable of handling 10,000 passengers at the same time. (very important for China, a spacious waiting room).

In summary, it has
1, an HSR station( 400-500 trains per day)
2, an international airport,
3, a long-disatcne bus-port
4. two metro lines (line2&10)
5. city bus
6. taxi stand
7. a logistics park and commercial centre

platform

automatic check-out (reduce cost on human sources and efficient)

Arriving floor, metro, food&supermarket, etc

Linked to Terminal 2 directly and one metro interval to terminal1

zero exchange to metro

This is what we need, both in China and India.
Late this year, an intercity HSR will link downtown Wuhan(my hometown) to Wuhan's airport. Not so perfect as Shanghai, but everyone who has ever been to Shanghai Hongqiao Station will love this idea.

 

[AndrewJin]

we are far behind and have much to learn from the Chinese but Indian railways works good

not super efficient, but it works just fine.. @AndrewJin, you should visit and try some of it before the modern industrial machine devours it all, which it will at some stage.

Hello, Metro. I'll try in the future. Actually I wanna try railway systems around the world!

But no matter how many HSR lines we have in China, we still have long-distance overnight slow trains(less than 200km/h). It will never disappear, more products, more choices, different targets, isn't it?
Normal trains in China

The absolute number of normal trains are still higher than HSR although the percentage is shrinking.
BUT, passengers of normal trains are not on the decline, but grows more slowly than before.
And compared to the mileage comparison, HSR is very efficient. (time interval between 2 trains）

And pls see this photo(salute to all stuff who keeps HSR clean and organised)

This photo was taken today in Shanghai. After all passengers disembarked(except me of course)
Staff were busy diverting seat direction, cleaning the train, distributing rubbish bags to every seat and checking the engines.
Why in such a hurry?
Cause in 10-15 minutes, new passengers would come and this train would be responsible for another service from Shanghai.

 

[Götterdämmerung]

View attachment 212746
This photo was taken today in Shanghai. After all passengers disembarked(except me of course)
Stuff was busing diverting seat direction, cleaning the train, distributing rubbish bags to every seat and checking the engines.
WHY so hurry?
Cause in 10-15 minutes, new passengers would come and this train would be responsible for another service from Shanghai.

I think, you mean staff, like people who work for an organisation/ a company. Stuffs are objects/ things not human.

 

[AndrewJin]

I think, you mean staff, like people who work for an organisation/ a company. Stuffs are objects/ things not human.

Danke schön!
Corrected, typing too fast and I'm having food in a night market, kebab and baked scallops

 

[Götterdämmerung]

Danke schön!
Corrected, typing too fast and I'm having food in a night market, kebab and baked scallops

Dafür nicht!

I envy you as we don't have any kind of night markets here in Germany, not even in big cities. Every time I visited China and had to leave, the first thing I miss is the food, particularly the midnight snacks. Here, I have to go to the kitchen and make a sandwicht.

 

[AndrewJin]

Dafür nicht!

I envy you as we don't have any kind of night markets here in Germany, not even in big cities. Every time I visited China and had to leave, the first thing I miss is the food, particularly the midnight snacks. Here, I have to go to the kitchen and make a sandwicht.

Sandwich?
No! That's not food. Why not sausage and beer? Cheap and yummy!

Dafuer nicht? What I've learned was nichts zu danken(not correct?)
When I was a volunteer of 2010 Shanghai Expo, I spoke a lot of French to french visitors, but no German to German tourists who generally spoke good English. The only time I spoke some sentences was with an Österreicher

 

[Götterdämmerung]

Sandwich?
No! That's not food. Why not sausage and beer? Cheap and yummy!

Dafuer nicht? What I've learned was nichts zu danken(not correct?)
When I was a volunteer of 2010 Shanghai Expo, I spoke a lot of French to french visitors, but no German to German tourists who generally spoke good English. The only time I spoke some sentences was with an Österreicher

Dafür nicht is only spoken in the northern most part of Germany. Normally, we say "bitte schön", "nicht zu danken" or "gern geschehen", etc.

You volunteered at the Shanghai Expo? Cool! I was at the Expo as well, my friend was the director of the German Pavillion.

 

[Viny]

@AndrewJin: AAP kind of Ticket vending machines are there for metro rails and mumbai suburb railway system, similar system is not available as of now for long distance trains, though there are few test Kiosks placed in few stations, but it didnt garner much interest, as Indias are not much into carrying plastic currency (credit cards and debit cards).

But none the less this will come up for local tickets, but long distance we need to fill up reservation forms and i dont see that going away too soon.

 

[AndrewJin]

Dafür nicht is only spoken in the northern most part of Germany. Normally, we say "bitte schön", "nicht zu danken" or "gern geschehen", etc.

You volunteered at the Shanghai Expo? Cool! I was at the Expo as well, my friend was the director of the German Pavillion.

WOW, I once spoke to some staff of German Pavilion in the Expo Subway (now line 13). By speaking German to staff in German, Schweiz, and Austria Pavilion, it was simply too easy to exchange expo badges.
Bitte schön! I kerne this expression,
gern geschehen, never heard of.
My position was between Belgium/EU and Spain, unforgettable experiences, I've made a lot of friends there.

@AndrewJin: AAP kind of Ticket vending machines are there for metro rails and mumbai suburb railway system, similar system is not available as of now for long distance trains, though there are few test Kiosks placed in few stations, but it didnt garner much interest, as Indias are not much into carrying plastic currency (credit cards and debit cards).

But none the less this will come up for local tickets, but long distance we need to fill up reservation forms and i dont see that going away too soon.

Indias are not much into carrying plastic currency (credit cards and debit cards).

Actually in China, cash and card both OK. Quite often only cash.

long distance we need to fill up reservation forms

I know this system, but never get it. What's the purpose of it?

 

[Viny]

Actually in China, cash and card both OK. Quite often only cash.

I know this system, but never get it. What's the purpose of it?

System was established to indentify the victims in case of accident.
Further more we provide various kinds concessions, thus a reservation form along with concession related document needs to be supplied.

Sooner or later I am sure we will go away with reservation form systems in certain areas.

 

[AndrewJin]

System was established to indentify the victims in case of accident.
Further more we provide various kinds concessions, thus a reservation form along with concession related document needs to be supplied.

Sooner or later I am sure we will go away with reservation form systems in certain areas.

So is this system applied to any class of tickets?
In China, no matter u buy one ticket online, with APP, automobile machines or counters, u have to bring an ID card or some equivalent cards. One's ID number and name is printed on the name along with platform number. On the train, railway staff will check and railway policemen will use ID machine to check ID cards.
Buying tickets online can also buy concession tickets, like for students, people with disability, elderly, etc.
So I think anything can be done online with a centralized and computerized booking system. When I buy tickets, I can check how many available tickets left, choose from different class, and return or change the ticket. It's super easy, especially with Alipay.

 

[Viny]

@AndrewJin : We are binding things across Adhar Card (ID Card), but its still long way to go. The current reservation form method is applied for all reserved seat classes. For general class were you dont get a reserved seat, its kind of first cum first serve, one doesnt need to fill up any kind of forms. And its lowest in terms of cost and has just basic facilities, no AC.

 

[by78]

What train is this? It's apparently some kind of prototype HSR that China is working on. Does anyone have any info?

 

[AndrewJin]

@AndrewJin : We are binding things across Adhar Card (ID Card), but its still long way to go. The current reservation form method is applied for all reserved seat classes. For general class were you dont get a reserved seat, its kind of first cum first serve, one doesnt need to fill up any kind of forms. And its lowest in terms of cost and has just basic facilities, no AC.

Yes, that's great policy. In China, everyone has an ID card, all personal information is stored in the chip and also the national database. So I think if you guys all have an electric ID card, the current booking system can be easily upgraded.
btw, as you said, it's about accidents. My question is, how to find out information of those who take the non-reserved class? Like the train tragedy in Uttar Pradesh last month. (I am seriously concerned about train accident around the world.)